The God of Abraham and Getting Down to Brass Tacks

[Godobeyer]

But God set it up like that. He could have dialled the evil side right down when installing the morality chip.

Yes God gave you free will and freedom to do evil or good now, all will count to Judgement Day.and thats what Judgement purpose for.

 

[Skwim]

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I don't get the joining ranks part exactly, but realize the whole point is talking to orthodox types.

"If you, as a believer in the god of Abraham, expect others to join your ranks," means " If you, as a believer in the god of Abraham, expect others to become Christians, Jews, or Muslims . . . ."

I wholly appreciate God because of the maximal Love God extends/shares with all Creation.

Then I take it that the god of Abraham is not your god.

Yes to the first, especially with Knowledge that the reprehensible is unattributed to God.

To you perhaps not, but to those who believe what the Bible says about god I would think not.

To the second inquiry, there is no (actual) hell. If there is, then this world of separation (really illusion) is it. Welcome to hell! Enjoy your stay.

You know, in discussions such as these if you can't go along with the premise, whether you think it's right or not, there's no sense in responding.

Yup. Atheist.

So is the OP, if I'm not mistaken.

You are. I'm agnostic. Says so right beneath my can of spinach under "Religion."


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[Rick O'Shez]

Yes God gave you free will and freedom to do evil or good now, all will count to Judgement Day.and thats what Judgement purpose for.

But why not give us the choice to do good or very good?

 

[Godobeyer]

But why not give us the choice to do good or very good?

there is already people doing good or very good deeds.
But if you meant ONLY ,That's up to Him, He who made that roles

 

[Kuzcotopia]

Says something that corrects Kuzcotopia about his religious beliefs.

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Thanks for the clarification.

I only frequent this website on my iPhone, and it doesn't show any of that!

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

Most of people doing bad deeds they did it because they want to.

I would hazard a guess that most people do bad things because they are thoughtless and impulsive or mentally disturbed. "Evil" people are most likely far fewer in number than we assume. The majority of people on Earth are idiots, not villains.

Yes God gave you free will and freedom to do evil or good now, all will count to Judgement Day.and thats what Judgement purpose for.

Drugged people don't have free will. They have drug will. Idiots simply lack knowledge and can be educated, or do you propose we kill children for misbehaving (as biblically mandated, btw)?

 

[Godobeyer]

I would hazard a guess that most people do bad things because they are thoughtless and impulsive or mentally disturbed. "Evil" people are most likely far fewer in number than we assume. The majority of people on Earth are idiots, not villains.

Everyone had free will is responsible for his/her deed.
label them idiots don't make them avoid the punishment when they commit crimes.
fact that evil people are exist,they choose to be evil, that's why jails existed for.

Spoiler: A homeworker beat baby

Drugged people don't have free will. They have drug will. Idiots simply lack knowledge and can be educated, or do you propose we kill children for misbehaving (as biblically mandated, btw)?

If they choose to be drugged , so they are remain the responsible.
That's why police check alcohol to suspect drivers, no one would blame the party or bar for that

There is people had good knowledge and made crimes.

 

[Acim]

"If you, as a believer in the god of Abraham, expect others to join your ranks," means " If you, as a believer in the god of Abraham, expect others to become Christians, Jews, or Muslims . . . ."

I thought it probably meant that. Yeah, I don't expect that. Not into the conversion thing.

Then I take it that the god of Abraham is not your god.

That would be mistaken.

To you perhaps not, but to those who believe what the Bible says about god I would think not.

You know, in discussions such as these if you can't go along with the premise, whether you think it's right or not, there's no sense in responding.

Based on the title and my theological understandings of Abrahamic God, along with the mis-attributions, I felt compelled to respond. The premise is not exactly clear, other than to say your impression is this god is really mean/bad, why do others follow that god, knowing how bad/mean he is?

So, I decided to address that by getting down to brass tacks.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

there is already people doing good or very good deeds.
But if you meant ONLY ,That's up to Him, He who made that roles

Well, yes. If it was God who made the roles, why did he design in the capacity for evil when there was no need? It makes God look like an evil scientist.

 

[zahra67]

If you, as a believer in the god of Abraham, expect others to join your ranks, what incentive do you offer? But before you answer consider that this is a god who purposely created evil or bad times or disaster or calamity or doom or hard times or adversity, depending on which Bible you read (Isaiah 45:7)

And

Allows the existence of suffering

Permits the existence of genetic diseases and defects

Created an eternal hell whose entry is based solely on one's behavior during a very minuscule time on earth

Condones and advocates slavery

Kills innocent humans

Advocates raping the women of one's enemy

Expects human sacrifice

Kills those who worship foreign gods

Burns those who transgress his covenant.​

Christians, Jews, and Muslims worship and adore this being, but why? Is it because the good stuff he's done offsets these reprehensible acts? OR is it because he's promised not to send them to hell if they do?

In my opinion the good things this god has done hardly begin to counterbalance all the bad stuff. So I have to conclude that people don't worship and adore him for his character, which is obviously far from stellar or worthy of emulation, but solely to curry favor so as not to wind up in hell, Which in MHO means that any professed praise or love rings quite hollow---it's like bribing the jail keeper. OR . . . there's a serious disconnect between what this god is actually like and how he's perceived.

And is this how I, a non believer in the god of Abraham, am expected to regard him: forget about his true character and instead convince myself he's especially good and therefore worthy of my worship and praise in order to avoid hell?

But don't get me wrong. I can see why one might be thankful for having been given life, but why pick the god of Abraham to thank?


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hi.
i send five verses from the holy quran about closeness of god to his servant.
these are only some example in the holy quran.
god's mercy and love is extreme and infinite.
there are 114 chapters in the holy quran that 113 chapters from it, starts with this very beautiful verse:
in the name of god the most compassionate the most merciful.
the goal of creation is devine mercy according to verse 119 of chapter 11 in the holy quran.
in chapter 2, verse 186 we read:
And when My servants ask you concerning Me, then surely I am very near; I answer the prayer of the suppliant when he calls on Me, so they should answer My call and believe in Me that they may walk in the right way.

in chapter 4, verse174 and 175, we read:
O people! surely there has come to you manifest proof from your Lord and We have sent to you clear light.
Then as for those who believe in Allah and hold fast by Him, He will cause them to enter into His mercy and grace and guide them to Himself on a right path.
in chapter 6, verse 54, we read:
And when those who believe in Our communications come to you, say: Peace be on you, your Lord has ordained mercy on Himself, [so] that if any one of you does evil in ignorance, then turns after that and acts aright, then He is Forgiving, Merciful.

in chapter 11, verse 90, we read:

And ask forgiveness of your Lord, then turn to Him; surely my Lord is Merciful, Loving-kind.
in chapter 39, verse 53 the all merciful god addressed his servants with kind word and says:
Say: O my servants! who have acted extravagantly against their own souls, do not despair of the mercy of Allah; surely Allah forgives the faults altogether; surely He is the Forgiving the Merciful.

 

[zahra67]

God made them that way. Gee, thanks, God.

hi.
no.
Allah created man, gave free will to them and its the mankind's free will to select between goodness and devine reward or evil and god's wrath.
but the desire of God is prosperity and salvation for mankind in the eternl bliss of paradise with recieving devine infinite mercy.
see holy quran verse 268 of chapter 2.
and Allah promises you forgiveness from Himself and abundance; and Allah is Amplegiving, Knowing.
and the purpose of creation is devine mercy according to the verse 119 of chapter 11.

 

[Godobeyer]

Well, yes. If it was God who made the roles, why did he design in the capacity for evil when there was no need? It makes God look like an evil scientist.

If He made us (humans) don't made evil or errors, so we would become angels (they have no free will).
He made the roles , He will judge you depend these roles.

 

[viole]

If He made us (humans) don't made evil or errors, so we would become angels (they have no free will).
He made the roles , He will judge you depend these roles.

Angels do not have any free will? So, Satan is innocent, right?

Ciao

- viole

 

[Rick O'Shez]

If He made us (humans) don't made evil or errors, so we would become angels (they have no free will).
He made the roles , He will judge you depend these roles.

But why didn't God design us so we had the choice to be nice or very nice, rather than nice or nasty?

 

[Godobeyer]

Angels do not have any free will? So, Satan is innocent, right?

Ciao

- viole

In Islam view Satan was not an angel , he was a jinny.
https://quran.com/18/50

 

[Godobeyer]

But why didn't God design us so we had the choice to be nice or very nice, rather than nice or nasty?

This is replied by God

https://quran.com/67/2
[He] who created death and life to test you [as to] which of you is best in deed - and He is the Exalted in Might, the Forgiving -


and explained by Dr Mustafa Mahmood

Dr Mustafa mahmoud Existence of Good and Evil

and

 

[Skwim]

This is replied by God

https://quran.com/67/2
[He] who created death and life to test you [as to] which of you is best in deed - and He is the Exalted in Might, the Forgiving -

Provided one lives long enough to take the test

"Latest figures show that 9.2 million children under-five are dying every year,"
source
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Think they had a chance to prove themselves? Of course not. And even if one makes it to adulthood isn't it nice that god's judgment of whether or not one winds up in eternal Hell is based on a relatively insignificant amount of time on earth? It's like judging artistic ability by the single pencil dot one has put on a piece of paper.

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[Godobeyer]

Provided one lives long enough to take the test

"Latest figures show that 9.2 million children under-five are dying every year,"
source
​

Think they had a chance to prove themselves? Of course not. And even if one makes it to adulthood isn't it nice that god's judgment of whether or not one winds up in eternal Hell is based on a relatively insignificant amount of time on earth? It's like judging artistic ability by the single pencil dot one has put on a piece of paper. Think this is bright or fair?

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9.2 milllion children because rich countries and people don't help enough too .
Don't worry. All it's count,all will be justice in Judgement Day.

in Islam view, God who made the laws , NO one is His partner .

btw also in Islam view the dead child would in heaven without judgement.

 

[Skwim]

btw also in Islam view the dead child would in heaven without judgement.

Curious, how far does this free, nonjudgmental ride into heaven extend? Until one is, 5, 6, 7, 10, 12, 15, 16, 17, 18, 21, 30, or . . . ?


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[Godobeyer]

Curious, how far does this free, nonjudgmental ride into heaven extend? Until one is, 5, 6, 7, 10, 12, 15, 16, 17, 18, 21, 30, or . . . ?

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If you mean how many :
YES ITs FREE, ALL dead Children would be in heaven without judgement.

If you meant age :before being adult sexual.