• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

The Gospels and Islam

Rival

Diex Aie
Staff member
Premium Member
Okay, so it might seem like I'm off on an Islam week, I guess I am, but here we go.

The Gospel was not 'revealed' to Jesus. Period. Jesus preached and the disciples wrote down what he preached, which became the Gospel. Or the four gospels, if you prefer.

Muslims, please give me any evidence that:

a) the NT text is totally corrupted and just not what it was originally so much so that we can't rely on a word of it.

b) the gospel was revealed to Jesus. If so, what was this 'other gospel'?

without using Qur'an or any of that apocryphal nonsense.


Thanks.
 

SpeaksForTheTrees

Well-Known Member

Excusez-moi much ruins of a Turkish temple are dated at least 11,000 BC and masonary like this took a long time , so obviously was serious commitments long before construction even started, can suggest religion originated from the area of today's Islamic nations .
 

DawudTalut

Peace be upon you.
Okay, so it might seem like I'm off on an Islam week, I guess I am, but here we go.

The Gospel was not 'revealed' to Jesus. Period. Jesus preached and the disciples wrote down what he preached, which became the Gospel. Or the four gospels, if you prefer.

Muslims, please give me any evidence that:

a) the NT text is totally corrupted and just not what it was originally so much so that we can't rely on a word of it.

b) the gospel was revealed to Jesus. If so, what was this 'other gospel'?

without using Qur'an or any of that apocryphal nonsense.


Thanks.
Peace be on you.
Gospels do not constitute the utterances of Jesus (on whom be peace) or his disciples. Jesus was a Jew and so were his disciples. If any of Jesus' utterances were to be found preserved in their originality, they could only be in the Hebrew language.

The language which Jesus and his disciples spoke was Hebrew, not Latin or Greek. So copies of the New Testament written down in Latin or Greek must have been written down long after the time of Jesus, at a time when Christianity had begun to penetrate into Roman territory and Roman imperialist power had become divided into the Italian and Greek parts.

Nations do not easily give up their language. It is for them as valuable an inheritance as any property or other possession. Roman rule in Palestine had begun only about fifty years before the advent of Jesus. This is not long enough for a people to forget their language. But there are other important considerations also to be kept in view [8 of these are given]

Jesus said [Matthew. 5: 17-18] : Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets : I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

From this it is evident that the mission of Jesus was to restore Mosaic teaching, but the Gospel as we have it today teaches that the Mosaic teaching was abrogated completely by Jesus. It is quite clear, therefore, that the present New Testament is not what Jesus taught and preached.

Testimony of Christian scholars is also present.

Deletion took place:
In John (5 : 2-5) we had : Now there is at Jerusalem by the sheep market a pool, which is called in the Hebrew tongue Bethesda, having five porches. In these lay a great multitude of impotent folk, of blind, halt, withered, waiting for the moving of the water. For an angel went down at a certain season into the pool, and troubled the water: whosoever then first after the troubling of the water stepped in was made whole of whatsoever disease he had. And a certain man was there, which had an infirmity thirty and eight years. When Jesus saw him lie, and knew that he had been now a long time in that case, said he unto him, Wilt thou be made whole ?


For hundreds of years we had this account reproduced in the Gospels. Nobody ever thought that it was unreliable. But when there began controversies between the Muslims and the Christians in the nineteenth century, verse 4 and part of v. 3 were deleted from the above passage in the Revised Version published in 1881, out of fear of Muslim criticism, and it was noted on the margin that many ancient authorities insert, wholly, or in part, the words deleted from the text. The question is, when this portion was found in many ancient authorities, why was the change made. Moreover, the very fact that a certain verse is found in certain copies and is missing in others is a proof of the fact that the original text has been tampered with.

Reference and More -- From page 47 @ https://www.alislam.org/library/books/Introduction-Study-Holy-Quran.pdf


=== Furthermore, it is clear that Jesus migrated to Kashmir after surviving cross, getting cure, his mother was with him, he travelled though Iran, Afghanistan to Kashmir to meet the lost tribes.....
https://www.alislam.org/topics/jesus/
He must have spoken a lot there. It should be found too.


Tibetan Buddhism has colour of Christain teaching.
The fact that Christian teaching and ritual have deeply affected Tibetan Buddhism necessitates the belief that Jesus must have visited the Tibetan people. Moreover, the fact that the zealous followers of Buddhism, as stated in Buddhistic records, had always expected to meet him, cries aloud that this ardent desire of theirs heralded his visit to this country. In the face of both these facts, an impartial person has no need to search through Buddhistic records for the statement that Jesus did come to Tibet. For, according to the prophecy of the Buddha, the desire for the Buddha's second advent being strong, the prophecy itself must have attracted Jesus to Tibet. It must be noted that the word 'Metteyya' mentioned frequently in Buddhistic books is undoubtedly the word 'Messiah'.
Ref: https://www.alislam.org/library/books/jesus-in-india/ch4.html



There is information about "Banned from the Bible" @ http://www.alislam.org/egazette/articles/Banned-from-Bible-200905.pdf
 
Last edited:

wizanda

One Accepts All Religious Texts
Premium Member
b) the gospel was revealed to Jesus. If so, what was this 'other gospel'?
To explain what is going on; yet not from a Muslim perspective, just to fix it....

Yeshua in the synoptic gospels taught a living gospel, where by doing the work of God, we can make it Heaven on Earth.

Whereas within John, Paul, and Simon the stone (petros); they've taught a dead gospel, where you just have to believe, 'that jesus came to die for the sins of the world'.

Thus the Quran has a point; yet Muslims don't read the Bible or accept the prophets, thus most have no clue on how to fix it.

This though was all prophesied to occur, that the workers of iniquity would make a covenant with death; so they can all be removed on judgement day. :innocent:
 

Pastek

Sunni muslim

The Gospel was not 'revealed' to Jesus. Period. Jesus preached and the disciples wrote down what he preached, which became the Gospel. Or the four gospels, if you prefer.


The teachings of Jesus includes the confirmation of the previous messages, some explanations concerning them, some prophecies.
Jesus didn't wake up one morning doing things on his own.
He did what he did because he had revelations from God.


Islam doesn't say the Injil was a Book that God sent down from the sky, like it wasn't the case for the Quran too.
When it says in the Quran (which means "recitation") that it's the/a "Book" at the moment of the recitation/revelation of the Quran it wasn't even yet a book.
Like the apostles wrote down the Gospel so it became a Book. For what i know the word Gospel has a meaning which is the "Good news", so the good news of what ? Jesus then revealed new things to people at the same time he reminded them older teachings, so that what we understand by God revealed him the Gospel.

Muslims, please give me any evidence that:

a) the NT text is totally corrupted and just not what it was originally so much so that we can't rely on a word of it.

This is not the position of the muslims. No text is "totally" corrupted we just don't rely on everything in it.

b) the gospel was revealed to Jesus. If so, what was this 'other gospel'?

I don't know there's an other Gospel, what i know is the Gospel is about the general acts and saying of Jesus.

The Gospel that we have today includes only books that christians believe are true but doesn't mean we have everything the apostles wrote or that they are their exact words. Some Bible includes books that others don't (like the copts, ethiopians ...)
Also muslims don't reconize the books of Paul as part of the Gospel.
 

George-ananda

Advaita Vedanta, Theosophy, Spiritualism
Premium Member

Muslims, please give me any evidence that:

a) the NT text is totally corrupted and just not what it was originally so much so that we can't rely on a word of it.

That is not a Muslim position. Mohammed spoke favorably about Jesus and the Bible.


b) the gospel was revealed to Jesus. If so, what was this 'other gospel'?
This doesn't make sense. No one thinks the Gospels were revealed to Jesus when they are a narration of His life by disciples.
 

Rival

Diex Aie
Staff member
Premium Member
This doesn't make sense. No one thinks the Gospels were revealed to Jesus when they are a narration of His life by disciples.
Yes they do. There was a recent thread in the Islam DIR and one poster said as much. I can't remember it but I'll look for it. It is was spurred me to make this thread. Also, most Muslims believe the Bible is corrupted, it's just a thing they say. or else why would there be a new prophet needed?
 

George-ananda

Advaita Vedanta, Theosophy, Spiritualism
Premium Member
Yes they do. There was a recent thread in the Islam DIR and one poster said as much. I can't remember it but I'll look for it. It is was spurred me to make this thread.

They may believe Jesus received revelation but the Gospels themselves are a narration of Jesus' life written later by disciples. I think that is the confusion here.
Also, most Muslims believe the Bible is corrupted, it's just a thing they say. or else why would there be a new prophet needed?
Correct, Muslims do not believe the Bible is a perfect source (unlike the Quran which is perfect).
 
Top