The Grand Dilemma

[The Sum of Awe]

I'm facing this now:

For all who think for yourself using reason - if you were unhappy with what you came up with and was logical, would you pretend to not believe in what you've found and believe in something else or stay unhappy knowing of this logic.

Through logic and reason and months spent thinking and debating philosophy, I concluded, quite a while ago I concluded that we are not important, it is impossible for a god to care, there are no objective morals, right or wrong, etc. It isn't impressing me.

So what would you do?

 

[Twilight Hue]

Nothing.

I just stay with things as they are played out. Embellishing, fabricating, and donning rose colored glasses, no matter what the mood, distorts and amplifys things unnecessarily.

I like my unhappiness genuine with no artificial flavors or additives.

 

[Madhuri]

Being unhappy with your view of reality is a waste of time. Be unattached and make the most of your life. Be hopeful for something better, if you like, but remain unattached if possible. Because what the average person thinks they know about reality probably does not even add up to a glimpse. We think we know a lot now, but there's far more that the smartest people in the world still do not understand.

This is what I think, and it relates to everyone.

 

[Revoltingest]

I'm facing this now:
For all who think for yourself using reason - if you were unhappy with what you came up with and was logical, would you pretend to not believe in what you've found and believe in something else or stay unhappy knowing of this logic.
Through logic and reason and months spent thinking and debating philosophy, I concluded, quite a while ago I concluded that we are not important, it is impossible for a god to care, there are no objective morals, right or wrong, etc. It isn't impressing me.

So what would you do?

Buck up & accept that which is.
Let go of the need for meaning, purpose, afterlife.
Enjoy what you have!

But I caution you that the conclusions you've reached are based upon unprovable & un-disprovable premises.
Whatever we believe is mere speculation.

 

[Thief]

Buck up & accept that which is.
Let go of the need for meaning, purpose, afterlife.
Enjoy what you have!

But I caution you that the conclusions you've reached are based upon unprovable & un-disprovable premises.
Whatever we believe is mere speculation.

Afterlife?...let's not go there yet.
That would put this thread over to the religious debate section.

Unhappy?...logic has 'fixed' the situation?....
If you must surrender your logic that you might find happiness...do it.

This world does not adhere to such disciplines...why should you?

Now if you insist upon logic...fine.
You would then be headed to the afterlife...properly.
You'll fit right in.
That would be logical.

 

[Revoltingest]

Afterlife?...let's not go there yet.
That would put this thread over to the religious debate section.
Unhappy?...logic has 'fixed' the situation?....
If you must surrender your logic that you might find happiness...do it.

Another approach:
No need to eschew logic. Let go of the need for things unavailable, & appreciate what one has.

This world does not adhere to such disciplines...why should you?

"Should" does not apply.

Now if you insist upon logic...fine.
You would then be headed to the afterlife...properly.
You'll fit right in.
That would be logical.

With no provable premises, I don't even need logic.

 

[Thief]

Another approach:
No need to eschew logic. Let go of the need for things unavailable, & appreciate what one has.


"Should" does not apply.


With no provable premises, I don't even need logic.

Logic is a technique.
You could make an assumption and then proceed with it...logically.

You mentioned afterlife. Is that an assumption?
Even so....you can be sure a great many things....
Logic can be applied to the afterlife.
I suspect...it is essential.

 

[Kathryn]

I'm facing this now:

For all who think for yourself using reason - if you were unhappy with what you came up with and was logical, would you pretend to not believe in what you've found and believe in something else or stay unhappy knowing of this logic.

Through logic and reason and months spent thinking and debating philosophy, I concluded, quite a while ago I concluded that we are not important, it is impossible for a god to care, there are no objective morals, right or wrong, etc. It isn't impressing me.

So what would you do?

Not sure how old you are. I am nearly 50. I've come to realize that my belief structure is always subject to alteration, as I gather new information. I'd say that your current realization is a stage and if you have an open mind and a thirst for more wisdom and knowledge, you will at some point move into another stage or, if you will, level of understanding.

This particular stage is bleak, but you won't always feel this way - that's my prediction.

Pray for wisdom and continue to seek it. Meanwhile, treat others as you want to be treated.

If you stick with those two basic mindsets, I don't think you can get too much off track. By "off track" I mean this - every belief system has practical applications to real life. If you can't apply your belief system to your daily life, it's frankly bull ****. I'd ask you - what's your practical application of your current set of beliefs?

I think that some of the most cruel regimes and most sick individuals have applied their particular beliefs without balancing them with a continued search for wisdom, and the universal concept of treating others as you'd want to be treated. When we check those two concepts at the door, we can step off into some pretty dark ****.

 

[Willamena]

I'm facing this now:

For all who think for yourself using reason - if you were unhappy with what you came up with and was logical, would you pretend to not believe in what you've found and believe in something else or stay unhappy knowing of this logic.

Through logic and reason and months spent thinking and debating philosophy, I concluded, quite a while ago I concluded that we are not important, it is impossible for a god to care, there are no objective morals, right or wrong, etc. It isn't impressing me.

So what would you do?

I believe what is true, it's not an option. If logic makes you unhappy, it just means your premises need to be reassessed. Logic leads to truth, and truth should make you happy.

 

[Revoltingest]

Logic is a technique.
You could make an assumption and then proceed with it...logically.

True dat.

You mentioned afterlife. Is that an assumption?

Yes, for some. No, for me.

Even so....you can be sure a great many things....
Logic can be applied to the afterlife.
I suspect...it is essential.

Applying logic to shaky premises yields shaky results.
I find it useful in system design, but worthless in metaphysics.

 

[Revoltingest]

Not sure how old you are. I am nearly 50. I've come to realize that my belief structure is always subject to alteration, as I gather new information. I'd say that your current realization is a stage and if you have an open mind and a thirst for more wisdom and knowledge, you will at some point move into another stage or, if you will, level of understanding.
This particular stage is bleak, but you won't always feel this way - that's my prediction.
Pray for wisdom and continue to seek it. Meanwhile, treat others as you want to be treated.
If you stick with those two basic mindsets, I don't think you can get too much off track. By "off track" I mean this - every belief system has practical applications to real life. If you can't apply your belief system to your daily life, it's frankly bull ****. I'd ask you - what's your practical application of your current set of beliefs?
I think that some of the most cruel regimes and most sick individuals have applied their particular beliefs without balancing them with a continued search for wisdom, and the universal concept of treating others as you'd want to be treated. When we check those two concepts at the door, we can step off into some pretty dark ****.

What a revolting way of seeing things!
(I attribute it to your youth.)

 

[Koldo]

Buck up & accept that which is.
Let go of the need for meaning, purpose, afterlife.
Enjoy what you have!

But I caution you that the conclusions you've reached are based upon unprovable & un-disprovable premises.
Whatever we believe is mere speculation.

Hear Hear.
This Revoltifarian is very wise. (frubals):clap

 

[Thief]

True dat.

Yes, for some. No, for me.

Applying logic to shaky premises yields shaky results.
I find it useful in system design, but worthless in metaphysics.

Well...apparently you have decided....no afterlife for you?

So then, proceeding to expectation would indeed be...illogical.

 

[idav]

I'm facing this now:

For all who think for yourself using reason - if you were unhappy with what you came up with and was logical, would you pretend to not believe in what you've found and believe in something else or stay unhappy knowing of this logic.

Through logic and reason and months spent thinking and debating philosophy, I concluded, quite a while ago I concluded that we are not important, it is impossible for a god to care, there are no objective morals, right or wrong, etc. It isn't impressing me.

So what would you do?

I've learned a long time ago that the truth isn't always roses and chocolate. I really believe the term ignorance is bliss but I'd rather not be deluded. Though this type of view you express can be used in benefit because it becomes easier to detach from the illusion of things and just enjoy things for how they are. I view life as chance to ride an awesome rollercoaster just try not to puke.

 

[Kathryn]

What a revolting way of seeing things!
(I attribute it to your youth.)

I take every bit of that statement as a compliment, coming from you!

 

[DreadFish]

I'm facing this now:

For all who think for yourself using reason - if you were unhappy with what you came up with and was logical, would you pretend to not believe in what you've found and believe in something else or stay unhappy knowing of this logic.

Through logic and reason and months spent thinking and debating philosophy, I concluded, quite a while ago I concluded that we are not important, it is impossible for a god to care, there are no objective morals, right or wrong, etc. It isn't impressing me.

So what would you do?

I have been to the bleak depths of my ideas like this too. It really will change as long as you dont hold on to these ideas. Our outlook on life changes at different stages in life. Either way, they are all just ideas, and we have ideas about ideas. I feel this way about this because I think this about it. It is not absolute.

Just keep on keepin' on and enjoy everything that happens.

A quote I found good for situations such as this that I went through:

"If there is a remedy when trouble strikes,
What reason is there for despondency?
And if there is no help for it,
What is the use of being sad?

So come what may, I'll never harm
My cheery happiness of mind.
Depression never brings me what I want;
My virtue will be warped and marred by it." - Nagarjuna

 

[Kilgore Trout]

If a pragmatic worldview doesn't appeal to you, then don't pursue it.

 

[More In Common]

I'm facing this now:

For all who think for yourself using reason - if you were unhappy with what you came up with and was logical, would you pretend to not believe in what you've found and believe in something else or stay unhappy knowing of this logic.

Through logic and reason and months spent thinking and debating philosophy, I concluded, quite a while ago I concluded that we are not important, it is impossible for a god to care, there are no objective morals, right or wrong, etc. It isn't impressing me.

So what would you do?

Wow, I spent an hour writing a very thoughtful response and when I pressed send - it timed me out and erased my reply. LOL! Guess, I was being too wordy and that message wasn't meant to be. No chance of me doing that again, so let me be brief:

If it's getting overwhelming thinking about all this deep philosophical junk - take a break friend..


Go outside, give your brain a rest and just have FUN!! Don't look too much into things and just practice being happy rather than trying to figure out life's great mysteries.

If you can't stop thinking about these subjects then I'll quickly say: The best advice I can give is to practice patience - give yourself more time!

I agree with some of the other posts that this is just a stage. In time the pendulum always swings the other direction and I'm sure you'll find that your spiritual mindset with grow/mature naturally.


Congratulate yourself that you've made it this far, and trust that eventually you'll get beyond subjective notions of importance.

 

[9Westy9]

I'm facing this now:

For all who think for yourself using reason - if you were unhappy with what you came up with and was logical, would you pretend to not believe in what you've found and believe in something else or stay unhappy knowing of this logic.

Through logic and reason and months spent thinking and debating philosophy, I concluded, quite a while ago I concluded that we are not important, it is impossible for a god to care, there are no objective morals, right or wrong, etc. It isn't impressing me.

So what would you do?

I'd prefer to be honest to myself. Also there are objective morals in the form of laws, they're just based on subjective standards.

 

[gnomon]

I'm facing this now:

For all who think for yourself using reason - if you were unhappy with what you came up with and was logical, would you pretend to not believe in what you've found and believe in something else or stay unhappy knowing of this logic.

Through logic and reason and months spent thinking and debating philosophy, I concluded, quite a while ago I concluded that we are not important, it is impossible for a god to care, there are no objective morals, right or wrong, etc. It isn't impressing me.

So what would you do?

It's what helped me recover from a mental illness and get away from a bunch of spiritual nutjobs.

I say it's great.

Call it the no BS philosophy of pragmatism.