The illuminati?

[Eddi]

Do you believe in the Illuminati?

I don't believe it exists as an actual conspiracy

But I believe it to be a class of people - an informal group of elites who are all aware of each other and are united by a common interest

And who use their very great personal power to further this common interest - indeed they manage to control the world more or less in their favour

What do you think?

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

What do you think?

I think it might be nice if you could divulge the cogent reasons supporting this belief.

 

[exchemist]

Do you believe in the Illuminati?

I don't believe it exists as an actual conspiracy

But I believe it to be a class of people - an informal group of elites who are all aware of each other and are united by a common interest

And who use their very great personal power to further this common interest - indeed they manage to control the world more or less in their favour

What do you think?

Absurd conspiracy theory.

I am highly suspicious of these "world control" conspiracy theories at the moment, as a number of them seem to be not far from resurrecting the antisemitic conspiracy theories of the 1930s, about Jewish bankers and so forth. Examples are the whispering campaigns on the Right about George Soros and the international bankers conspiracy theories of the Left: Corbyn 'regret' over anti-Semitic mural row

As for controlling the world, do you really think the Chinese, the Americans, the EU and the Russians agree how to run the world?

 

[Eddi]

Absurd conspiracy theory.

You could call it that

But I believe that the idea that there are elites who have power and who use their power to serve themselves is not absurd, indeed I think it makes sense.

I put that Simpsons clip up to show what I don't mean by "Illuminati", not as an example!

as a number of them seem to be not far from resurrecting the antisemitic conspiracy theories of the 1930s

Yes, the crude and stupid ones

As for controlling the world, do you really think the Chinese, the Americans, the EU and the Russians agree how to run the world?

To a limited extent, yes. They have a common interest in keeping the population docile and unconcerned. In that regard, their interests align. Also, I would say that the world capitalist system is favoured by the Chinese, Americans, Europeans and Russians - the international ruling class is I believe united

 

[exchemist]

You could call it that

But I believe that the idea that there are elites who have power and who use their power to serve themselves is not absurd, indeed I think it makes sense.

I put that Simpsons clip up to show what I don't mean by "Illuminati", not as an example!


Yes, the crude and stupid ones


To a limited extent, yes. They have a common interest in keeping the population docile and unconcerned. In that regard, their interests align. Also, I would say that the world capitalist system is favoured by the Chinese, Americans, Europeans and Russians - the international ruling class is I believe united

Ah well, if all you mean is that their rulers all think some form of market economy is the only viable economic system, then sure. But that's not an elite "class" thing. That's just modern economics, really.

 

[Eddi]

Ah well, if all you mean is that their rulers all think some form of market economy is the only viable economic system, then sure. But that's not an elite "class" thing. That's just modern economics, really.

Class differences are an integral part of economic systems

You cannot divorce class from economics

 

[Secret Chief]

Do you believe in the Illuminati?

I don't believe it exists as an actual conspiracy

But I believe it to be a class of people - an informal group of elites who are all aware of each other and are united by a common interest

And who use their very great personal power to further this common interest - indeed they manage to control the world more or less in their favour

What do you think?

It must be real, they have an official website.

The Illuminati | Official Website

 

[Secret Chief]

Speculating about what may be hidden is of course a tricky business. But it seems pretty obvious that the super-rich have made themselves exempt from the laws (and democratic practices) of any particular country or grouping of countries (such as the EU) and that global corporations oftentimes wield greater influence and power than many countries. Likewise, such corporations can act pretty much how they like, overtly and in all probability covertly.

 

[Polymath257]

I think the idea that the super rich or powerful would be able form a stable coalition over decades or centuries to be highly unlikely on the face of it. Too much ego would be involved and any coalition would fragment quickly.

 

[Secret Chief]

I think the idea that the super rich or powerful would be able form a stable coalition over decades or centuries to be highly unlikely on the face of it. Too much ego would be involved and any coalition would fragment quickly.

Yes, I'm not necessarily suggesting coalitions between individuals. Regarding corporations of course cartels occur where mutual self interest exists (which may or may not be temporary).

 

[Eddi]

I think the idea that the super rich or powerful would be able form a stable coalition over decades or centuries to be highly unlikely on the face of it. Too much ego would be involved and any coalition would fragment quickly.

Maybe, but I imagine that the super rich/powerful (or whatever you want to call them) recognise their common interests, take the long view, and act accordingly - as a unified class, even if there are differences and egos involved. They don't have to like each other and indeed can be bitter rivals, whilst presenting a common front on certain issues, i.e. the maintenance of capitalism. I'd say that as a class, the super rich/powerful have a very high degree of class cohesion.

 

[Sw. Vandana Jyothi]

Maybe, but I imagine that the super rich/powerful (or whatever you want to call them) recognise their common interests, take the long view, and act accordingly - as a unified class, even if there are differences and egos involved. They don't have to like each other and indeed can be bitter rivals, whilst presenting a common front on certain issues, i.e. the maintenance of capitalism. I'd say that as a class, the super rich/powerful have a very high degree of class cohesion.

I don't know how much cohesion there actually is. It's more likely that super-rich people who are infected and possessed by the demon Greed just all think and act basically alike, i.e., super selfishly self-centered. Holds true for the less rich, too; the difference is only in degree, not in kind. That demon ain't picky.

 

[BSM1]

If it was on an episode of "The Simpsons" then you can probably bet the farm on their existence.

 

[pearl]

The Illuminati Exposed

 

[74x12]

Do you believe in the Illuminati?

I don't believe it exists as an actual conspiracy

But I believe it to be a class of people - an informal group of elites who are all aware of each other and are united by a common interest

And who use their very great personal power to further this common interest - indeed they manage to control the world more or less in their favour

What do you think?

More than one group calling themselves "the Illuminati" or very similar names operate in USA and other countries. Transnationalists. Not all these groups go by "illuminati" however. So that's where the confusion comes in. Because people use that term as if it's the only group that exists. But really there are various other similar cults. However there is a definite hierarchy and ultimately they answer to non-human entities. It's really just part of Satan's conspiracy against God. He created the conspiracy in heaven and now it's on earth also.

 

[sun rise]

If it was on an episode of "The Simpsons" then you can probably bet the farm on their existence.

I'd put a bit of money on "Lisa" being President after Trump. Biden picks a liberal black woman VP, wins and then says, in Nelson's voice "ha ha" and resigns.

Do you think Fox would run with this scoop?

 

[sun rise]

To be serious for a second, there is the idea of a spiritual hierarchy working for the betterment of humanity but hidden from view.

This is the lust for power, fear- and greed- based "Illuminati" concept but in a sense its opposite.

 

[February-Saturday]

The Illuminati actually does exist, but not in the way conspiracy theorists paint it. After the secret orders were outlawed, the Bavarian Illuminati went underground just like the rest of the secret orders. It started to seriously lose membership the longer it was underground, but a few members of the OTO started rejuvenating it around the early 20th century.

Now it's mostly just an exclusive club for high-ranking European members of the OTO. It's almost entirely lost the Illuminism it was originally founded on. I think their headquarters were in Belgium in the 90's, where they repurposed an old OTO building for their own meetings.

Order of Illuminati — Weltbund der Illuminaten — World League of Illuminati — Ordo Illuminatorum — Illuminaten Orden — Ordo Illuminatorum Germaniae — Societas Totius Mundi Illuminatorum — Ordo Templi Orientis — Fraternitas Saturni — Walter Englert

It's actually kind of a well-known group in modern occult circles, as far as I can tell. At least, among people who belong to a lodge because a lot of us enjoy these inter-lodge politics a bit too much.

 

[VoidoftheSun]

Do you believe in the Illuminati?

I don't believe it exists as an actual conspiracy

But I believe it to be a class of people - an informal group of elites who are all aware of each other and are united by a common interest

And who use their very great personal power to further this common interest - indeed they manage to control the world more or less in their favour

What do you think?

I don't believe in the Illuminati, I know they existed - from 1776 to 1787. Weishaupt wasn't perfect but he did have a lot of good ideas. Of course as usual, no conspiracy theorist has ever read anything he wrote.

They were a controversial movement that did go around hijacking Masonic lodges at the time, it got quite out of control, past the level that Weishaupt could control. It soon disintegrated into powder dust though.

Nonetheless it has endured as an influence to many groups, big and small.

From the legend (who actually inadvertently helped bring the Illuminati into pop culture):

My words the same. I wish the Illuminati luck in bringing down the establishment, they've sure got a lot of work to do.

 

[February-Saturday]

Oh, I should also point something out, the "Illuminati" is just plural for Illuminatus, which is somebody that has serious academic devotion to Illuminism. Technically, this means there are a lot of Illuminati that aren't a part of any sort of formal order. The real Illuminati actually support whisteblowing, education, truth in the news, etc. and would be opposed to the conspiracy theorist "NWO" Illuminati covering everything up.

That said, I'm aware people are normally talking about a specific order, but a lot of different conspiracies wildly diverge about what order of Illuminati they're talking about, some of which have never even claimed to be Illuminati.