The Inexplicable Success of Capitalist Indoctrination

[Revoltingest]

In the US the rich - often - are not paying their fair share of taxes. The biggie I see is that they tend not to pay for their companies' use of the infrastructure. Roads, the grid, schools, police, fire, and so on. All of which they use to their benefit.

On what do you base that?
Here in MI, business properties pay full property
taxes, unlike homeowners, who get discounts
of 50% or more. Also, my commercial properties
have been often assessed at above market
value.
You mention schools. Businesses pay more per
dollar assessed value than homeowners, despite
having no children in schools.

 

[icehorse]

On what do you base that?
Here in MI, business properties pay full property
taxes, unlike homeowners, who get discounts
of 50% or more. Also, my commercial properties
have been often assessed at above market
value.
You mention schools. Businesses pay more per
dollar assessed value than homeowners, despite
having no children in schools.

Are you an oligarch and haven't been telling us? I'm not talking about small / medium sized business owners.

 

[PureX]

Fantastic OP !

But I'd refine it a bit, because capitalism CAN work, we've just let it get out of control. So we could say something like "why does reagan-omics hold such sway"?

To me, the short answer is: really effective propaganda.

I think we deceive ourselves into thinking that we cannot be swayed by propaganda, but that's a deadly mistake.

The interesting thing about propaganda, though, is that it only works on us if we want it to.

When the Nazis vilified the Jews with propaganda in the 1930s it worked because the German people really wanted someone to blame for their miserable economic situation after losing WW1. They much preferred having someone to blame to accepting the fact that they had brought it all on themselves by starting a massive war and then losing.

So why do so many of us so readily accept the lies of the capitalists (like Reaganomics) even as decade after decade they are proven to be lies?

I honestly don't know.

 

[Revoltingest]

Are you an oligarch and haven't been telling us? I'm not talking about small / medium sized business owners.

Small fish here.
But the same rules apply to big'ns.
What's your basis for your claim?

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

I

You seem to be ignoring the reality that Taiwan
is a peaceful, successful, independent country,
& that China plans to conquer it by invasion.
No whatabouti
sm can justify China's violent goal.

It is part of One China as agreed by USA, and Taiwan itself.nor do you recognise them as independent.

How do yo,u think America would react if China supported the independence of an island off the mainland of America with arms ships aircraft and long range missiles.

Think of the near war situation and 50 year blockade of Cuba. And that is miles away. You still do not recognise them and they are no threat at all.

 

[icehorse]

Small fish here.
But the same rules apply to big'ns.
What's your basis for your claim?

If only.

I'm also an owner of a small business. For many of the last years, I paid more taxes than Wells Fargo, despite their large profits. And there are many other such huge, profitable corps that pay - as a percentage of income or profit - a fraction of you and I are paying.

 

[icehorse]

The interesting thing about propaganda, though, is that it only works on us if we want it to.

I disagree. For the sake of discussion I will lump propaganda in with advertising, they are very similar.

All of the world's top organizations spend - collectively - trillions of dollars a year on advertising. All "free" internet services like google, and twitter and such rely entirely on advertising to generate revenue.

That said, it works even better when - like you said - a person already wants to believe.

So why do so many of us so readily accept the lies of the capitalists (like Reaganomics) even as decade after decade they are proven to be lies?

I honestly don't know.

Here's a fantastic, 5 minute, video that I think explains a lot of it.

The speaker starts by looking at a common meme: "If taxes on the rich go up, job creation will go down". This is of course bull****, but this idea underpins a lot of the economic propaganda machine since Reagan.

 

[Revoltingest]

I
It is part of One China as agreed by USA, and Taiwan itself.nor do you recognise them as independent.

Taiwan doesn't lose its right to independence
simply because 2 other countries agree that
it shouldn't be so.

How do yo,u think America would react if China supported the independence of an island off the mainland of America with arms ships aircraft and long range missiles.

If the island is a different country,
then I too would object to violent
conquest of it.

Think of the near war situation and 50 year blockade of Cuba. And that is miles away. You still do not recognise them and they are no threat at all.

More whataboutism, eh.
USA is currently not planning
to invade, conquer, & add Cuba
to the states.

Why do you believe that Taiwan would
be better off if China conquered it?

 

[Revoltingest]

If only.

I'm also an owner of a small business. For many of the last years, I paid more taxes than Wells Fargo, despite their large profits. And there are many other such huge, profitable corps that pay - as a percentage of income or profit - a fraction of you and I are paying.

You're changing the claim.
It was about features paid for by property taxes.
Now you're making it about income taxes.
How much did Wells Fargo pay in property
taxes each year?

 

[icehorse]

You're changing the claim.
It was about features paid for by property taxes.
Now you're making it about income taxes.
How much did Wells Fargo pay in property
taxes each year?

Since you've decided to abandon logic, why are you defending Wells Fargo and their ilk? Do you imagine they are "job creators", or what?

 

[Bthoth]

If only.

I'm also an owner of a small business. For many of the last years, I paid more taxes than Wells Fargo, despite their large profits. And there are many other such huge, profitable corps that pay - as a percentage of income or profit - a fraction of you and I are paying.

because politicians in bills add line items to give exemptions to businesses that contribute to the pac funds. Businesses are stronger than tax paying voters. It's one of the errors of our society.

 

[danieldemol]

Yeah....it's always someone else who sins.

If you had slaved away just to nearly die of poverty due to a capitalist system that sends money not to the worker but rather to the owner of the means of production you would realise it really is someone other than the labourer who sins in my view.

I guess the phrase "physician heal thyself" means little to certain folk.

 

[Revoltingest]

Since you've decided to abandon logic, why are you defending Wells Fargo and their ilk? Do you imagine they are "job creators", or what?

I don't defend Wells Fargo.
I've no idea how much they pay.
I'm just questioning your unsupported
dubious claims & changing them.

 

[Revoltingest]

If you had slaved away just to nearly die of poverty due to a capitalist system that sends money not to the worker but rather to the owner of the means of production you would realise it really is someone other than the labourer who sins in my view.

I'm sure there are some like you say.
But the advantage of capitalism is the potential
to rise above such woe. No other system offers
as much potential.

 

[icehorse]

I'm just questioning your unsupported
dubious claims & changing them.

Well you're partly right, you are trying to change my claims, sigh.

 

[Heyo]

I'm sure there are some like you say.
But the advantage of capitalism is the potential
to rise above such woe. No other system offers
as much potential.

And no other system has the same potential to drift off into a plutocracy.

 

[Revoltingest]

Well you're partly right, you are trying to change my claims, sigh.

Reading your posts make me
feel like I'm not the dumbest
one here.

 

[Revoltingest]

And no other system has the same potential to drift off into a plutocracy.

Au contraire.
Socialism has the worst
record of authoritarianism.
Capitalism has the advantage
that many times it succeeds.

 

[danieldemol]

I'm sure there are some like you say.
But the advantage of capitalism is the potential
to rise above such woe. No other system offers
as much potential.

That potential seems to be only there for a small percentage of people. And I believe that social democracy with a progressive tax system does a much better job for people at the poor end (as it should) than unchecked capitalism which only hastens the addition of zeros to some crook's bank account. The US seems to me to be the nearest to unchecked capitalism and the worst place for the poor in the developed world.

And I honestly doubt that libertarians would be interested in placing checks (chief amongst which is a suitable progressive tax system) on capitalism.

To tie this in with the OP i believe the reason for that is the incitement of fear of communism by extemely wealthy people greedy for unnecessary zeros on the right (as opposed to left) end of their bank accounts.

 

[Revoltingest]

That potential seems to be only there for a small percentage of people.

It is so for me & nearly everyone I know.
A few suffer, but only because that's a path
they chose, eg, preferring to drink than work.

And I believe that social democracy with a progressive tax system does a much better job for people at the poor end (as it should) than unchecked capitalism which only hastens the addition of zeros to some crook's bank account. The US seems to me to be the nearest to unchecked capitalism and the worst place for the poor in the developed world.

And I honestly doubt that libertarians would be interested in placing checks (chief amongst which is a suitable progressive tax system) on capitalism.

To tie this in with the OP i believe the reason for that is the incitement of fear of communism by extemely wealthy people greedy for unnecessary zeros on the right (as opposed to left) end of their bank accounts.

People be all hating towards capitalism.
It's awful. It can't be salvaged.
But their seeing only the worst is a problem
with them....a blindness thing. And they've
no alternative that's better.