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The Jesus myth...

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rocketman

rocketman

Out there...
Kcnorwood said:
It's a bit long but its very good & informative. I'd like to know what some of you think of it.


ZEITGEIST, The Movie - Official Release - Part 1 of 3
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No offence but personally I think this is complete rubbish. Typical conspiracy crap that will only fool those who want to be fooled. The amateur scholarship is ridiculous. The misrepresentaion of ancient religions is the stuff of willfull ignorance. It might be fun for people to watch in the same way that Dan Brown's work is fun, but no serious intellectual can give this tripe any credit. Most of the religious ideas were debunked hundreds of years ago.

If people aren't making conspiracies about cristians-bankers-9/11 they are making them about jews-military industrial complex-9/11... who knows who's next.

Anyway who swallows this is truly gullible.
 
Kcnorwood

Kcnorwood

Well-Known Member
There is alot of truth to what he says about holidays & older Gods coming before Jesus, not to mention the fact that all of it happaned before christiany ever came along.
 
rocketman

rocketman

Out there...
Kcnorwood said:
There is alot of truth to what he says about holidays & older Gods coming before Jesus, not to mention the fact that all of it happaned before christiany ever came along.
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Things like Christmas and the (scholarly innacurate) guess that Jesus was born on Dec 25th etc etc came some time after the early church period and obviously were an adapatation of others people's calenders. None of which altered the underlying beliefs of the christian religion. A good example of why the holiday issue is irrelevant would be the Sabbath. Sunday became more popular in Western Christianity due to the widespread use of that day already due to pagan influences. No big deal. Note that many of the pagan 'conveniences' were not picked up by the Eastern christian churches, and to this day the fundamental theology of both remains the same. Holidays are cosmetic window dressing in this discussion.

Sun worship was indeed a part of many old religions, yet your movie at no point provides any evidence that this applied to christianity (I'm assuming this is all about christianity based on the title of this thread) The bible starts out clearly saying:

"And God said, "Let there be lights in the expanse of the sky to separate the day from the night, and let them serve as signs to mark seasons and days and years, and let them be lights in the expanse of the sky to give light on the earth." Gen 1:14,15

Unlike Egyptan religions the Jewish God was always seperate from the created star we call the sun. And Judaism and Christianity are both strictly monotheistic, with the bulk of christians from the beginning accepting Jesus as God in the flesh. To suggest that the christian religion was ever about sun-worship is really silly.

As occult expert Jay Kinney says:

"Time and again, Zeitgeist maximizes emotional impact at the expense of a more reasoned weighing of evidence. But, perhaps that’s the intention."

Jay Kinney reviews Zeitgeist, the Movie - Boing Boing
 
A

angellous_evangellous

Guest
Jay said:
You would be surprised at just how many non-Christians out there lap up silly conspiracy theories and propagate nonsense. I guess it takes all kinds. :)
Click to expand...

Maybe we can make a nickel on this... :rolleyes::D
 
R

Random

Well-Known Member
The assertion that Christianity is much rooted in Astro-Theology is sound enough and has much merit upon careful consideration. However, overall, "Zeitgeist" understates the extent of the One World Conspiracy. And there is only one conspiracy...

Those of you who doubt it need only use that doubt as a springboard to greater understanding, if possible (intellects vary...). Those of you who dismiss all such talk as "silly nonsense" are already victims, and default supporters of oppression and tyranny.

Wake up! Or...stay asleep. Your "choice", if you believe in choice.
 
Halcyon

Halcyon

Lord of the Badgers
I stopped watched after a couple of minutes, when it got to speaking about Horus and Set. Whoever this guy is, he got everything about those deities utterly wrong.

Horus is the God of the sky not the sun, that being the God Ra or Re. Set is not the God of darkness or night but the God of chaos and storms, he accompanies the sun God Ra on his nightly journey into the underworld as a protector of the sun not an enemy.

If this bloke can't get simple facts about Egyption deities right, I don't have any reason to listen to anything he says about Jesus or Christianity.
 
Kcnorwood

Kcnorwood

Well-Known Member
I'd agree that thire are some things that he got wrong in the video. But there still is some truth to it. The problem with ANY thing like this is that none of have any realy proof of what went down 4,000 years ago let alone 2,000 years,not unless you were there.
 
R

Random

Well-Known Member
Halcyon said:
I stopped watched after a couple of minutes, when it got to speaking about Horus and Set. Whoever this guy is, he got everything about those deities utterly wrong.

Horus is the God of the sky not the sun, that being the God Ra or Re. Set is not the God of darkness or night but the God of chaos and storms, he accompanies the sun God Ra on his nightly journey into the underworld as a protector of the sun not an enemy.

If this bloke can't get simple facts about Egyption deities right, I don't have any reason to listen to anything he says about Jesus or Christianity.
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No, you're wrong.

The makers of Zeitgeist are well aware of the cthonic portfolios of ancient gods, and Horus the Sky-god was, like all proto-Sky Fathers, first and foremost a SOLAR deity. Egyptian mystics would not have distinguished the Sky aspect from the Solar one. And since, on a deeper level, the male Astrological deities were all derivative of Sun gods and kings, your distinction is invalid.

If one is not prepared to challenge false preconceptions extant from relevant sources of information, how will one learn anything or better ones knowlege? Even though it is not perfect by any means, Zeitgeist @ least can encourage one to develop insight in areas of our (hidden) world which we rarely experience in everyday life. Why not watch the whole thing?
 
Melissa G

Melissa G

Non Veritas Verba Amanda
Re-Horakhty, is the Horus of the Horizon, ie the aspect of Re as the God first appears on the Eastern horizon. Horus the Elder is clearly pre-dynastic in origin, and is a Solar God. This Horus has not the Horus, son of Osiris, who comes later. Seth is and always was a storm God. Later Set was identified with the red land, ie the desert. It's most probable that the Osiris myth does not predate the OK.

According to Wainright,, many of the God's of Egypt prove to be Sky Gods, and fertility Gods, their prototypes can be traced back to Libyan days, before these people descended into the Nile Valley.

~melissa
 
rocketman

rocketman

Out there...
Random said:
No, you're wrong.

The makers of Zeitgeist are well aware of the cthonic portfolios of ancient gods, and Horus the Sky-god was, like all proto-Sky Fathers, first and foremost a SOLAR deity. Egyptian mystics would not have distinguished the Sky aspect from the Solar one. And since, on a deeper level, the male Astrological deities were all derivative of Sun gods and kings, your distinction is invalid.

If one is not prepared to challenge false preconceptions extant from relevant sources of information, how will one learn anything or better ones knowlege? Even though it is not perfect by any means, Zeitgeist @ least can encourage one to develop insight in areas of our (hidden) world which we rarely experience in everyday life. Why not watch the whole thing?
Click to expand...

I was taught that Horus evolved from an original version which was a 'sky god' that had the sun for one eye and the moon for another.

Horus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
R

Random

Well-Known Member
rocketman said:
I was taught that Horus evolved from an original version which was a 'sky god' that had the sun for one eye and the moon for another.

Horus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Click to expand...

Correct. Solar deities, almost uniformly male in hypostasis, adopted aspects of Lunar deities, originally Moon-goddesses, mystically incorporated into their portfolios as the Patriarchal revolution (approx 3500 BCE - 500 CE) got into full swing. It's final triumph was called Christianity, specifically European Christianity.

BTW, Wiki is a casual source of info, strictly. The lack of unverifiable claims is both a strength and a weakness when one considers that quite naturally all pertinent information extant is not going to be readily avaiable, especially on esoteric or highly controversial issues, to either the mainstream public or academia.
 
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