The Limits of Religion

[pearl]

Religion is a human construct. It is no more than the expression of what one believes. It should never be allowed to stagnate, its quest is never finalized. Like science religion cannot cease questioning, it cannot close in on itself, it must continue moving forward. Any religion that assumes it has solved the Mystery is dead. That's the negative aspect of religion, when it is allowed to be the end in itself. Even the positive aspects of religion are diminished once it becomes merely habitual, like brushing ones teeth, without thought. As for verifiable, not in this lifetime. Much of the sorry state of the world is due to a religion's 'idea' of God.

 

[HonestJoe]

I have heard people often refer to the limits of science.

Incorrectly, at least in the context it’s typically claimed.

So that got me wondering: What are the limits of religion?

An individual religion will have self-imposed limits. Religion as a concept has no limits. You could come up with a religion (or a version on an existing religion) incorporating anything you care to imagine. Some people might even say that’s how all religion comes about in the first place.

 

[DawudTalut]

I have heard people often refer to the limits of science. So that got me wondering: What are the limits of religion?

*Please do not ask me to define religion; I have confidence in your ability to share your own views.

Peace be on you.
Limit of religion is to give understanding of God, relation with Him and paying His rights and His creatures, ethics and morals taught by God. Religion guides about various aspects of working of universe but details will have to found by other knowledge. Religion tells about lifeafter and how to prepare for it....So limits of religion are quite limitless.

 

[Jeremiahcp]

But considering we are in fact all subjective beings looking out through our individual set of eyes, the subjective nature of religion is one of its greatest strengths. You don't know yourself by reading about yourself but by living yourself. Religion is about the living part of being human.


If that were at all true, you'd have no organized bodies of religion anywhere. Of course subjective truths find consensus all the time, in and outside of religion. What do you think cultures are? In reality, intersubjective truths become in effect objective truths and realities. And as such they provide foundational truths to those participating within them. This is one of the strengths of religion, to provide supporting structures for these.


Religion's focus is primarily on Absolute Truth, the transcendent reality. I'm not sure how you consider that a "low standard".


In a sense, the transcendent Truth is "beyond belief" so yes, simply letting go is "simple". In fact that Absolute can and is described by many a mystic as "simplicity itself". It's the obviousness of it that makes it so absurd to our otherwise busily reasoning minds.


If it did, then how can religion exist today in any form we see?

"If that were at all true, you'd have no organized bodies of religion anywhere."

I said, " creates difficulties"; I didn't say makes it impossible, and the fracturing of so many many different groups kind of supports my point.

"Religion's focus is primarily on Absolute Truth, the transcendent reality. I'm not sure how you consider that a "low standard"

And I am sure have your own definition of "Absolute truth", and so does that guy, and that guy, oh and that guy and the guy over there, and this guy, and that other guy. . . .

"If it did, then how can religion exist today in any form we see?"

Are you serious? I mean. . . I mean. . . Have you never looked at religion?

 

[Jeremiahcp]

Peace be on you.
Limit of religion is to give understanding of God, relation with Him and paying His rights and His creatures, ethics and morals taught by God. Religion guides about various aspects of working of universe but details will have to found by other knowledge. Religion tells about lifeafter and how to prepare for it....So limits of religion are quite limitless.

I don't think you understood the question.

 

[Jeremiahcp]

I found another limit: an inability to recognize limits.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Religion, like magic, has no limits. I mean, of course, other than being limited by reality. But for many fantasy-prone personality types, this doesn't seem to be a significant factor.

 

[George-ananda]

Can you give us an example of a procedure or method of inquiry which is available to religion, but not to science, and which provides us with greater intersubjective verifiability than any method available to science?

No, and that is not what I am claiming either; this verifiability to current science. Spirituality, can experience and its masters can tell us of the Source of reality and understand the 'Why' of existence and how the physical universe is just a derivative from the Source. Religion/spirituality includes the position that consciousness can experience reality not within the range of our physical senses and physical instruments. Consciousness is something fundamental and not something science can explore through physical investigation.

 

[soma]

Religion brings people to God that is its limit because it can't go beyon theology, but for the experience of God people have to go alone.

 

[viole]

I think religion has no limits and can explain everything. Science is limited to the realm of the physical senses and physical instruments.

I believe that things that explain everything, do not explain anything.

Ciao

- viole

 

[George-ananda]

I believe that things that explain everything, do not explain anything.

Well religion takes a top-down approach to understanding reality. Science takes a bottom-up approach. Religion can theoretically explain reality (and the rest is details).

 

[Jeremiahcp]

No, and that is not what I am claiming either; this verifiability to current science. Spirituality, can experience and its masters can tell us of the Source of reality and understand the 'Why' of existence and how the physical universe is just a derivative from the Source. Religion/spirituality includes the position that consciousness can experience reality not within the range of our physical senses and physical instruments. Consciousness is something fundamental and not something science can explore through physical investigation.

"Consciousness is something fundamental and not something science can explore through physical investigation."

Cognitive science - Wikipedia

 

[Jeremiahcp]

Well religion takes a top-down approach to understanding reality. Science takes a bottom-up approach. Religion can theoretically explain reality (and the rest is details).

"Well religion takes a top-down approach to understanding reality."

It seems more of a let's-just-throw-random-stuff-at-the-wall-and-see-what-sticks approach to me.

 

[George-ananda]

"Consciousness is something fundamental and not something science can explore through physical investigation."

Cognitive science - Wikipedia

This avoids the hard problem of what consciousness is. This is the domain of religion.

 

[George-ananda]

It seems more of a let's-just-throw-random-stuff-at-the-wall-and-see-what-sticks approach to me.

That is not my appraisal of the revered spiritual masters of the eastern/Vedic wisdom tradition.

Do you feel you have a fair grasp of what they are claiming? Vedic philosophy can get pretty deep and seems like more than pasta on the wall to me. Seriously, are you familiar with eastern philosophies.

 

[Jeremiahcp]

That is not my appraisal of the revered spiritual masters of the eastern/Vedic wisdom tradition.

Do you feel you have a fair grasp of what they are claiming? Vedic philosophy can get pretty deep and seems like more than pasta on the wall to me. Seriously, are you familiar with eastern philosophies.

Yes I am very familiar, as I eat fortune cookies.

I am not going to buy into your somewhere-in-someway-someone-has-proven-what-I-am-saying argument.

 

[A Vestigial Mote]

I think religion has no limits and can explain everything. Science is limited to the realm of the physical senses and physical instruments.

Honestly, this is very true. If there is one thing I have experienced with those of religious belief, it is that they have an excuse for everything. Literally ANYTHING can be explained within the context of a religious belief system that has an all-powerful intelligence at the helm - or, if not, any amount of supernatural "somethings" that can be called on to explain anything and everything.

Science is limited because it relies more on reality and truth - and strives to be much more separated from "just making things up".

 

[George-ananda]

"just making things up".

There is our key disagreement then. Speaking of the masters of the eastern/Vedic tradition, I have come to believe they have genuine knowledge from experience.

 

[George-ananda]

Yes I am very familiar, as I eat fortune cookies.

.

So, cynics carp without knowledge. The cawing of the crows.

 

[Jeremiahcp]

So, cynics carp without knowledge. The cawing of the crows.

At least I am not claiming to be an authority on something I am not.