The literal Word of God?

[The Great Architect]

There are many Christians, who see the Bible as the (100%) literal, infallible Word of God.

That's fine -- but I am curious to know, are there any other positions, that one can take? I believe that the Bible is holy; and that it was inspired by God. But also, that every punctuation mark (or word) should not necessarily be taken absolutely literally. I think the message, and its divinity, remains the same; because it is inspired by God.

It is a holy text, that was written by human prophets, who were chosen by God. I suppose mine is a more moderate position. Are there names for the different points of view -- regarding the literalness of the Bible? Why is it so important (for some people) to take an absolutist position? What does everybody think the value is of the other points of view? :bible:

 

[te_lanus]

for me it is more in the line of: the Bible is God's dealin with mankind as described by mortal man.


is it God's literal word? no i dont think so.

 

[The Great Architect]

is it God's literal word? no i dont think so.

but my point is that others believe it is; and that interests me, too.

 

[DadBurnett]

I can in no way give credence to the Bible being God's literal word. Even if it was in the beginning, we don't have The Bible - we have compilations and translations, many of them somewhat contridictory.
To thos who say the Bible is God's literal word, I have one simple question, which Bible? So far, that question has not been answered.

 

[Arkholt]

I like to think that the things in the Bible really happened, and that God said all the things that it says he did. I don't think every word in there is the word of God, though. I don't think any book that purports to be scripture is 100% the word of God. It wasn't written by the hand of God, at least. That means at least some words must be those of a mortal and not a deity.

Really, though, I don't think it matters. If one learns good things from the Bible and acts on the things one learns, does it matter if everything in there really happened or if every word came from the mouth of God? No, not at all.

 

[Scott1]

but my point is that others believe it is; and that interests me, too.

It's a (relatively) new concept ... a by-product of the Reformation that I don't think will survive this century.

 

[Humanistheart]

There are many Christians, who see the Bible as the (100%) literal, infallible Word of God.

That's fine -- but I am curious to know, are there any other positions, that one can take? I believe that the Bible is holy; and that it was inspired by God. But also, that every punctuation mark (or word) should not necessarily be taken absolutely literally. I think the message, and its divinity, remains the same; because it is inspired by God.

It is a holy text, that was written by human prophets, who were chosen by God. I suppose mine is a more moderate position. Are there names for the different points of view -- regarding the literalness of the Bible? Why is it so important (for some people) to take an absolutist position? What does everybody think the value is of the other points of view? :bible:

Taking the bible as the literal word of god is problematic. Then you end up argueing things like bats are birds and not mammals and other odd claims found throughout the bible.

 

[Dunemeister]

It's a (relatively) new concept ... a by-product of the Reformation that I don't think will survive this century.

Not so fast, Scott! The church has always held that its scriptures are the word of God. God has always been regarded as the primary author of all the volumes that make up what we call the bible. This, I take it, is what it means for the bible to be the "literal" word of God.

What the Reformation did was put (reformists would say "restore") scripture in the role of arbiter over tradition. That is, where tradition and scripture are at odds, scripture wins out. The Reformation did this because, in their view, medieval and renaissance church theology and practice had become seriously at odds with what scripture said. So the reformers didn't invent the notion that the bible was the literal word of God.

 

[The Great Architect]

I don't think every word in there is the word of God, though. I don't think any book that purports to be scripture is 100% the word of God. It wasn't written by the hand of God, at least. That means at least some words must be those of a mortal and not a deity.

Really, though, I don't think it matters. If one learns good things from the Bible and acts on the things one learns, does it matter if everything in there really happened or if every word came from the mouth of God? No, not at all.

I agree. But then, what makes it holy?:cross:The inspiration from God?

 

[Arkholt]

I agree. But then, what makes it holy?:cross:The inspiration from God?

Yes, I believe it was written by inspired servants of God. I believe God spoke to them, and they wrote down what he said. That doesn't mean that every word that they wrote is God's word. It just means that quite a few of them are.

Don't know if that makes sense to anyone else, but it does to me.

 

[Mr Cheese]

Yes

"
Ironically, biblical literalism misunderstands the biblical faith in the very course of struggle to understand and defend it in a changing cultural context. Biblical literalism commits a seductive form of idolatry. The literalist misleads Christians by asserting the idolatrous notion that the words of inspired Scripture adequately and sufficiently bind the God revealed in Scripture to the narrow limitations of scientific, "common sense" interpretation.
The requisite balancing principle is forgotten: that Scripture produced under "inspiration" by mere mortals simultaneously conceals as it reveals the Word-requiring an act of faith and careful, "Inspired" personal interpretation to grasp the Word spoken to the self. Literalism errs fatally when in implicit arrogance it denies the mystery of the revealed but sovereign, never-fullyknowable God.
Viewed functionally, as opposed to analytically, such error becomes heresy when it so misleads that it blocks the individual's path to salvation through Christ, promised in gospel and creed to those who truly accept the invitation to repent, believe, and follow Him. It makes scriptural inerrancy a basic article of faith which must be believed if the Bible is true. "
On the Heresy of Literalism

 

[Mr Cheese]

It's a (relatively) new concept ... a by-product of the Reformation that I don't think will survive this century.

let us pray!

........................

The deepest level of communication is not communication, but communion. It is wordless. It is beyond words. It is beyond speech, and it is beyond concept. Not that we discover a new unity. Not that we discover an older unity. My dear Brothers, we are already one. But we imagine we are not. And what we have to recover is our original unity. What we have to be is what we are.


–Thomas Merton

 

[sojourner]

I agree. But then, what makes it holy?:cross:The inspiration from God?

The Church. It's certainly not holy to anyone else!

"Holy" means "set apart." The Bible is holy because we "set it apart" from all other writings as particularly inspired.

 

[OmarKhayyam]

The “problem” I have with the modern xantins is that they are intellectually dishonest, hypocrites really. I give the fundies high marks for at least having the moral courage and intellectual honesty to take their myth seriously. They read what the bible says and they believe WHAT is says. The content of what they believe is foolish even absurd but they defend it anyway.

They don’t retreat to an “interpretation” position that sees 6 days as allegorical but the resurrection as a unique historical event. It is either all true every letter of every word in the KJV (an inspired by God translation) the revealed WoG– or it is not. The fundies assert it is and live with the consequences. The moderns equivocate, wiggle, squirm, and are clearly uncomfortable. Ultimately they abandon what the thing clearly says and justify their belief on grounds of moral superiority.

Another poster had a good phrase for this behavior – “weasel words.” I think that pretty much says it.

 

[sojourner]

The “problem” I have with the modern xantins is that they are intellectually dishonest, hypocrites really. I give the fundies high marks for at least having the moral courage and intellectual honesty to take their myth seriously. They read what the bible says and they believe WHAT is says. The content of what they believe is foolish even absurd but they defend it anyway.

They don’t retreat to an “interpretation” position that sees 6 days as allegorical but the resurrection as a unique historical event. It is either all true every letter of every word in the KJV (an inspired by God translation) the revealed WoG– or it is not. The fundies assert it is and live with the consequences. The moderns equivocate, wiggle, squirm, and are clearly uncomfortable. Ultimately they abandon what the thing clearly says and justify their belief on grounds of moral superiority.

Another poster had a good phrase for this behavior – “weasel words.” I think that pretty much says it.

Intentionally provocative. The world just ain't as "either/or, black-and-white" as you seem to want it to be.

At least the liberals have the intellectual decency to treat what was written with enough respect to try to figure out what the author really said.

 

[kingdombuilder]

There are many Christians, who see the Bible as the (100%) literal, infallible Word of God.

That's fine -- but I am curious to know, are there any other positions, that one can take? I believe that the Bible is holy; and that it was inspired by God. But also, that every punctuation mark (or word) should not necessarily be taken absolutely literally. I think the message, and its divinity, remains the same; because it is inspired by God.

It is a holy text, that was written by human prophets, who were chosen by God. I suppose mine is a more moderate position. Are there names for the different points of view -- regarding the literalness of the Bible? Why is it so important (for some people) to take an absolutist position? What does everybody think the value is of the other points of view? :bible:

It is a long read, but well worth the time if you are really interested in the subject.
The official Chicago Statement on Biblical Inerrancy written by many top Christian Evangelical leaders during the conference of 1978...

ok, I was not able to link to the site due to not having created enough posts yet, but I recommend googling "Chicago Statement of Faith, Inerrancy" or "...infallibility" from there it should be no problem finding the document.

 

[jtartar]

There are many Christians, who see the Bible as the (100%) literal, infallible Word of God.

That's fine -- but I am curious to know, are there any other positions, that one can take? I believe that the Bible is holy; and that it was inspired by God. But also, that every punctuation mark (or word) should not necessarily be taken absolutely literally. I think the message, and its divinity, remains the same; because it is inspired by God.

It is a holy text, that was written by human prophets, who were chosen by God. I suppose mine is a more moderate position. Are there names for the different points of view -- regarding the literalness of the Bible? Why is it so important (for some people) to take an absolutist position? What does everybody think the value is of the other points of view? :bible:

The Great Architect,
There is much more to your question than it seems on the surface.
To answer you need to understand exactly what God's PURPOSE is for the earth.
When God created Adam and Eve, He told them to be fruitful and multiply and fill the earth and have in subjection all other eathly creations, Gen 1:26-28. This means that God's purpose was to have MANKIND EXTENT the Garden of Eden until it covered the earth, Isa 45:18.
God's promise is; when He states a purpose it is certain to come true, Isa 55:11.
As we can see clearly, God does not force a person to obey Him, He wants all to obey Him because He created man and knows what is the best for man, Isa 48:17,18. God makes laws for our good, not just because He can. Man. even when he wants to do the right thing, many times does not know the best way to go, Jere 10:23.
God gave the Israelites a set of laws to help them live happy and satisfying lives.
God has also given Christians a set of laws, these are mentioned in the Christian Greek Scriptures. The Most important law is to love your God with all your heart mind and strength, the second is to love your neighbor as yourself, Matt 22:37-40. Christians are not under the Mosaic Law Covenant, but there are several laws that were also in the Mosaic Law Covenant that are also laws for Christians. John 13:34,35, Matt 7:12, Gal 6:2, Rom 13:8-10, are laws that are much more important that the Mosaic Law. These are different, because they are laws that say you must DO THINGS. while the Mosaic Law Covenant was a DO NOT DO set of laws, more tha a DO set of laws.
For God to produce a paradise earth for people who love Him and love their neighbors He must judge the people, Rom 3:5,6, and remove all who do not want tp obey HIm, 2Thes 1:6-9, 2Pet 3:3-7,13, Rev 21:1-5.
God is JUST in everything, Deut 32:4. God will not Judge anyone unless His word is accesible to them, and that word MUST be accurrate, for how could a just God judge anyone as not worthy of living if they had no accurrate set of laws??
God, not only gave mankind a set of commandments, He also promised to keep them from becoming adulterated, Ps 12:6,7. Jesus said that God's word is truth, John 17:17. The Apostles of the first century made sure that every word written in God's Bible is accurate. A comparison of the Dead Sea Scrolls with copied scriptures during the time that the Dead Sea Scrolls were hidden prove the accurracy of the scriptures, 1Pet 1:25, 2:2.
God inspired men to write His book, The Holy Bible, 2Pet 2:20,21, 2Tim 3:16,17. Men wrote things that seem to be contradictory at times, but a close examination of the scriptures reveal that the thing written were complements, not contradictions. Some modify, some qualify, all are accurrate!! the truth is: ONLY THE WORD OF GOD can be trusted completely, it is God's promise, Prov 3:5,6, 2:1-12. Never trust your own heart, unless it has been train in God's word, Jere 17:9, and never put trust in men, Ps 146:3,4, Mark 7:6-9,13, Col 2:8, 2Pet 3:15-18.

 

[luvuyesua]

I believe every word, no matter what anyone says. The bible just keeps on as the years go by and discoveries appear, proving itself and teaching us.

some people say their are different bibles and I have found that some of them mean,theirs a difference in the Christian catholic bible, christian bible, torah, and a jerusalem bible, and some believe even more than that, jehovas bible, mormons(everyone know the difference their)etc.Just incase, torah, first five books of the bible, christian catholic bible 72 books, original. than their was a break away and it turned into 66 books, jerusalem bible, I have, has all 72 books. Jehovas 66 and so on, but same scriptures, st james version I feel has a trustworthy history, and in the bible it warns of altering it, I dont think God would have let any unintentional translation happen, and I am sure God had every thing to do with all of it.

We see how it contradicts itself, we were made in his image, he is our Daddy, study your activity as a parent, look at how many things you teach or decide through the years that seem like contradictions but arent, and when your kids grow up, end up knowing what you meant, when before they didnt understand agree or think possible. and that will happen to us.

here is a literal statement, that no one yet speaks of, pretty recent, The shortening of the days, how impossible is that? I am pretty sure it has never been seen in our known history, I am pretty sure. The dayshave already lost a little more than 2 seconds in a day,( tsunami in thailand and chiles earthquake) but many of us will always react like the jewsafter seeing the phenominom of the parting of the sea, you would think seeing that, they would have no doubt in anything happening, but no. and if it were to happen again many humans would still resort to human logic or doubt of taking literal Gods ability. (its written by man) look what happened to what he wrote with his own finger. he wisely chose men to write it, and we are not worthy to hold something written by Gods hand, but we are arrogant enough to think so.

something out of logic is literal in the hands of God word of God and actions of God, I have no embarrassment, nor fear no care of mocking, about seeing the bible as literal, everything I have been reading in the times, is unfolding and I have prepared my kids minds, thanks to the word of God. To not take the bible literal, or picking out which ones, would make me feel like a coward, limiting my knowledge of God to my logic or mans logic, what lack of respect and lack of knowledge of knowing who is King, creator, father, GOD. it is pretty clear when it is a symbol, remember the bible isnt for just any heart to understand, rebellious, arrogant, self rightious, sarcastic, closed, embarrassed, lying, evil, contradicting intelligence, any of those types of hearts would likely read it with the eyes wide shut, and it would be the will of God that, they not understand. their is a scripture on that, and why Jesus said things certain ways, this is literal. and God knows better than all of us what type of heart the reader carries, and what intention and lack of intention. better than the person themselves.
Good thread
blessed is the child heart

 

[abysslightdarkness]

hi
i beginning to doubt more. In lev11:20-3(4 legs insects) lev11:4-6(camel chew cubs) & Is40:22(disc-like flat earth). As for new testament with many geographical inconsistencies eg. Lk4:29 Nazareth isn't built on/near the cliff ?? with all these horrible discrepancies and more i had came to a conclusion that the bible is full of nonsense and its a foolish act to take it too seriously like most of you did. Look, if you can believe a flat earth & 4legged insects surely, to say that this bible is from god is really not factual

yours sincerely dar

 

[luvuyesua]

a little comment, the bible describes the figure of the earth.