The logical fallacy of atheism

[Nakosis]

The atheists keeps forgetting, believers have evidence of God. It is the atheist who does not and shall not have evidence of God. Not everyone wears your shoes.

So then they shouldn't be judged for their disbelief. They are only being honest with what has been provided to them.

“Matt 7:1 Judge not, that you be not judged.”

Evidence provided for proof should be verifiable for any who would accept that proof. Anecdotal evidence doesn't really qualify. It's good for you in your belief but doesn't really benefit anyone else.

 

[Sapiens]

The atheists keeps forgetting, believers have evidence of God. It is the atheist who does not and shall not have evidence of God. Not everyone wears your shoes.

ev·i·dence
ˈevədəns/
noun
noun: evidence
1.
the available body of facts or information indicating whether a belief or proposition is true or valid.
"the study finds little evidence of overt discrimination"
synonyms:proof, confirmation, verification, substantiation, corroboration, affirmation, attestation "they found evidence of his plotting"



be·lief
biˈlēf/
noun
noun: belief; plural noun: beliefs

1. 1.
   an acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists.
   "his belief in the value of hard work"
   
   
   • something one accepts as true or real; a firmly held opinion or conviction.
     "contrary to popular belief, Aramaic is a living language"
     synonyms:opinion, view, conviction, judgment, thinking, way of thinking, idea, impression, theory, conclusion, notion "it's my belief that age is irrelevant"
     
     
     
     
     
   • a religious conviction.
     "Christian beliefs"
     synonyms:ideology, principle, ethic, tenet, canon; Moredoctrine, teaching, dogma, article of faith, creed, credo
     "traditional beliefs"
     
     
     
     
     
   
   
   
   
2. 2.
   trust, faith, or confidence in someone or something.
   "a belief in democratic politics"
   synonyms:faith, trust, reliance, confidence, credence "belief in the value of hard work"
   
   
   
   
   
   
   

Believers have belief, that's why they are believers. When you have evidence you are no longer a believer.

 

[Willamena]

be·lief
biˈlēf/
noun
noun: belief; plural noun: beliefs

1. 1.
   an acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists.
   "his belief in the value of hard work"
   
   
   • something one accepts as true or real; a firmly held opinion or conviction.

...When you have evidence you are no longer a believer.

That's saying that when you have evidence, you no longer accept that something exists.

 

[Sapiens]

You're a little late to join the Sophists' Club.

 

[serp777]

It is rather deceitful for you to be using the word God, without having a clue what it means. Obviously your not being completely honest here.

What gives you the authority and special knowledge to know what the word of God is and how to interpret it?

 

[Sapiens]

It is rather deceitful for you to be using the word God, without having a clue what it means. Obviously your not being completely honest here.

God
gäd/
noun
noun: God; noun: god; plural noun: gods; plural noun: the gods

1. 1.
   (in Christianity and other monotheistic religions) the creator and ruler of the universe and source of all moral authority; the supreme being.
   synonyms:the Lord, the Almighty, the Creator, the Maker, the Godhead; MoreAllah, Jehovah, Yahweh;
   (God) the Father, (God) the Son, the Holy Ghost/Spirit, the Holy Trinity;
   the Great Spirit, Gitchi Manitou;
   humorousthe Man Upstairs
   "a gift from God"
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
2. 2.
   (in certain other religions) a superhuman being or spirit worshiped as having power over nature or human fortunes; a deity.
   "a moon god"
   synonyms:deity, goddess, divine being, celestial being, divinity, immortal, avatar "sacrifices to appease the gods"
   
   
   
   
   
   
   

 

[Sonofason]

What evidence? Please bring it front and center.

Please stay out of my shoes, certain forms of insanity, as well as many other diseases are infectious.

The universe is evidence of God. If you believe this is untrue, show your evidence why it is not true.

Life is evidence of God. If you believe this is untrue, show your evidence why it is not true.

Jesus is evidence of God. If you believe this is untrue, show your evidence why it is not true.

The Holy Spirit, whom you do not know, is evidence of God. If you believe this is untrue, show your evidence why it is not true.

God is evidence of God. He reveals Himself to those who love and obey Him.

Love and obey God, and you will have all the evidence of God you need to fully trust in Him.

 

[Sonofason]

So then they shouldn't be judged for their disbelief. They are only being honest with what has been provided to them.

“Matt 7:1 Judge not, that you be not judged.”

Evidence provided for proof should be verifiable for any who would accept that proof. Anecdotal evidence doesn't really qualify. It's good for you in your belief but doesn't really benefit anyone else.

If one does not believe in God, and the salvation God offers through the sacrifice of His Son, surely that person will be judged by his works. I wish him luck.

 

[Sonofason]

ev·i·dence
ˈevədəns/
noun
noun: evidence
1.
the available body of facts or information indicating whether a belief or proposition is true or valid.
"the study finds little evidence of overt discrimination"
synonyms:proof, confirmation, verification, substantiation, corroboration, affirmation, attestation "they found evidence of his plotting"



be·lief
biˈlēf/
noun
noun: belief; plural noun: beliefs

1. 1.
   an acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists.
   "his belief in the value of hard work"
   
   
   • something one accepts as true or real; a firmly held opinion or conviction.
     "contrary to popular belief, Aramaic is a living language"
     synonyms:opinion, view, conviction, judgment, thinking, way of thinking, idea, impression, theory, conclusion, notion "it's my belief that age is irrelevant"
     
     
     
     
     
   • a religious conviction.
     "Christian beliefs"
     synonyms:ideology, principle, ethic, tenet, canon; Moredoctrine, teaching, dogma, article of faith, creed, credo
     "traditional beliefs"
     
     
     
     
     
   
   
   
   
2. 2.
   trust, faith, or confidence in someone or something.
   "a belief in democratic politics"
   synonyms:faith, trust, reliance, confidence, credence "belief in the value of hard work"
   
   
   
   
   
   
   

Believers have belief, that's why they are believers. When you have evidence you are no longer a believer.

Certainly a person is capable of accepting something as true or real due to an abundance of evidence.

Thus one can believe due to overwhelming evidence.

Certainly, a person can trust in, and believe in, and be confident in someone or something that has proven itself to be believable, trustworthy, and worthy of confidence. Evidence leads to belief. And sometimes, belief can lead to evidence.

 

[Sonofason]

What gives you the authority and special knowledge to know what the word of God is and how to interpret it?

The Holy Spirit gives me the authority and the special ability to recognize the truth.

 

[Sonofason]

God
gäd/
noun
noun: God; noun: god; plural noun: gods; plural noun: the gods

1. 1.
   (in Christianity and other monotheistic religions) the creator and ruler of the universe and source of all moral authority; the supreme being.
   synonyms:the Lord, the Almighty, the Creator, the Maker, the Godhead; MoreAllah, Jehovah, Yahweh;
   (God) the Father, (God) the Son, the Holy Ghost/Spirit, the Holy Trinity;
   the Great Spirit, Gitchi Manitou;
   humorousthe Man Upstairs
   "a gift from God"
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
2. 2.
   (in certain other religions) a superhuman being or spirit worshiped as having power over nature or human fortunes; a deity.
   "a moon god"
   synonyms:deity, goddess, divine being, celestial being, divinity, immortal, avatar "sacrifices to appease the gods"
   
   
   
   
   
   
   

I believe you should be sending Bunyip those definitions, as he is the one claiming to not know the meaning of the word God. See, this is the sort of thing that happens when you interject in someone else's conversation. My advice is to think before you speak.

 

[serp777]

The Holy Spirit gives me the authority and the special ability to recognize the truth.

You think the holy spirit gives you the authority. You have no proof or evidence besides your feelings, even though your feelings are definitely not infallible.

Hamas fighters also think Allah gives them authority and the special ability to recognize the truth. WHy should you be any more reliable than them?

 

[Sapiens]

I believe you should be sending Bunyip those definitions, as he is the one claiming to not know the meaning of the word God. See, this is the sort of thing that happens when you interject in someone else's conversation. My advice is to think before you speak.

Better if you thought before you wrote.

 

[Bunyip]

I believe you should be sending Bunyip those definitions, as he is the one claiming to not know the meaning of the word God. See, this is the sort of thing that happens when you interject in someone else's conversation. My advice is to think before you speak.

That was just pathetic mate. The point still stands that atheism only has meaning in relation to a specific god. Your definitions define the CONCEPT of god, not the specific entity towards whom the atheist in question is atheist.

Some conceptions of god, and many specific gods do not meaningfully clash with atheism - so to try to imagine a definition of atheism that adresses all possible gods under your definitions of the concept renders the term 'atheist' meaningless.

You can not simply define a term (atheism) into a position that is logically untenable (essentially the disbelief in all conceptions of god) and cantilever that into an argument that atheism is logically untenable. As if you can define atheism out of existence. It is I suppose an interesting apologetic tactic, but I'm not impressed.

 

[Desert Snake]

That was just pathetic mate. The point still stands that atheism only has meaning in relation to a specific god. Your definitions define the CONCEPT of god, not the specific entity towards whom the atheist in question is atheist.

Some conceptions of god, and many specific gods do not meaningfully clash with atheism - so to try to imagine a definition of atheism that adresses all possible gods under your definitions of the concept renders the term 'atheist' meaningless.

You can not simply define a term (atheism) into a position that is logically untenable (essentially the disbelief in all conceptions of god) and cantilever that into an argument that atheism is logically untenable. As if you can define atheism out of existence. It is I suppose an interesting apologetic tactic, but I'm not impressed.

If this is correct it would make atheism illogical.
Further, I'm not even saying you aren't correct in that definition, it does make sense.

 

[Bunyip]

If this is correct it would make atheism illogical.
Further, I'm not even saying you aren't correct in that definition, it does make sense.

That was my point - if you define atheism as the disbelief in all conceptions of god (and therefore do not need to define or describe a specific god) then the term 'atheism' is illogical and meaningless.

Which is why atheism does not mean the disbelief in all conceptions of god.

It is contextual - when talking to a Christian, 'atheist' means that the person does not believe in Yahweh the Christian god.

 

[Desert Snake]

That was my point - if you define atheism as the disbelief in all conceptions of god (and therefore do not need to define or describe a specific god) then the term 'atheism' is illogical and meaningless.

Which is why atheism does not mean the disbelief in all conceptions of god.

It is contextual - when talking to a Christian, 'atheist' means that the person does not believe in Yahweh the Christian god.

....:sarcastic O.k. you have to see how that is strange right? There are many similar deities to the Christian God, having a term for rebuttal of such yet leaving an 'out' for multiple other deities just seems like a waste of a word, why even have/use it. May as well just explain that idea to said parties you are discussing with.

 

[Bunyip]

....:sarcastic O.k. you have to see how that is strange right? There are many similar deities to the Christian God, having a term for rebuttal of such yet leaving an 'out' for multiple other deities just seems like a waste of a word, why even have/use it. May as well just explain that idea to said parties you are discussing with.

How did that make sense to you?

You think that a term must apply in all situations to have meaning? Why can't a term be specific? Do you have some sort of argument or explanation why, unlike pretty much any other term in our language 'atheism' must have some sort of broad meaning - a meaning so broad that ot renders the term meaningless?

How did you figure that out?

 

[Desert Snake]

How did that make sense to you?

You think that a term must apply in all situations to have meaning? Why can't a term be specific? Do you have some sort of argument or explanation why, unlike pretty much any other term in our language 'atheism' must have some sort of broad meaning - a meaning so broad that ot renders the term meaningless?

How did you figure that out?

Broad usage doesn't render the term useless/

If it's just defined as "I don't believe in deities", how is that a 'meaningless' term.

Be that as it may, your definition does 'make sense' in it's own way, so have at it, I don't have a horse in this race, don't really care how it's defined.

 

[Willamena]

You can not simply define a term (atheism) into a position that is logically untenable (essentially the disbelief in all conceptions of god) and cantilever that into an argument that atheism is logically untenable. As if you can define atheism out of existence. It is I suppose an interesting apologetic tactic, but I'm not impressed.

Atheism in this vein needn't be the disbelief in all concepts of god, though, it's just nonbelief in the concept of god. It's that simple.

Edit: Atheism has already been defined out of existence by those who mistake it for secularism.