The nature of the self/ego

[St Giordano Bruno]

Below answers your questions of my views of the nature of the self or ego and that has been the way it has been over the last 20 years. It is a view of the self that makes the most sense for with me, take it or leave it.

1. What is the role of the self in your religion?

The role of my self is to just merely "exist" and the meaning we attribute to it is what you feel and what you make of it

2. Is our perception of self(identity) an illusion? Why or why not?

Multiple selves is an illusion and all selves are just varying expressions of the one self

3. Is the self of any importance or is it seen to exist simply to glorify the god of your religion?

The self is an emergent property of the universe's hightened complexity

4. If your religion believes the individual was created, why was it created?

It was created necessarily as in inevitiable feature of the Anthropic Principle in its weaker form. It exist in a universe replete with every possible physical accident. It happens because there happens to be multiple universes with every possible physical combination and characteristic like the ultimate infinite monkeys theorem.

5. According to your religion does the self grow or is it something that diminishes in favor of another aspect of being?

The self is the only means for the universe to know of its own existence as it is an observation principle

6. According to your religion is there a final state of being, by whatever avenue taken? If so, please describe it.

This if the final state of being, there is no great divine plan for anything greater

7. According to your religion is there a difference between self and what we know as the ego.

No difference other than semantics

8. Is the ego something that needs to be guided, checked, reigned in, annihilated or corrected.

No it is a force unto itself

Your thoughts on these questions would be greatly appreciated.

Note: This is placed in a discussion area and so debate is not permitted.

To borrow from a thoughtful poster, if you could identify your religion and then give your answers, that would be most helpful.

Feel free to answer some, or all, of the questions, as you wish, or have time for.

The last point is a plea to try to refrain from the cut and paste technique from your favorite scripture. IF, and it is a big IF, the section is applicable, then go for it, otherwise please try to answer the questions in your own words.

 

[Brok Born]

I like people with strong egos who have done their share of self-improvement to build up the ego and who, at the same time, are very aware of this very ego. I found those who claim to be egoless to be either unaware or boring and uninteresting and I don't know which is worse. Maybe I need to meet Buddha.

Thanks and Regards.
Brok Born

 

[Cassiopia]

I'm pagan. Excuse me if I skip through these quickly...
1. What is the role of the self in your religion?
Pretty important, self improvement, development and responsibility are key.
2. Is our perception of self(identity) an illusion? Why or why not?
I don't believe it is an ilusion, but it may not be permanent.
3. Is the self of any importance or is it seen to exist simply to glorify the god of your religion?
The self exists in order to evolve.
4. If your religion believes the individual was created, why was it created?
To learn and grow.
5. According to your religion does the self grow or is it something that diminishes in favor of another aspect of being?
It grows and develops.
6. According to your religion is there a final state of being, by whatever avenue taken? If so, please describe it.
There is continual development.
7. According to your religion is there a difference between self and what we know as the ego.
Opinions within my religion would vary.
8. Is the ego something that needs to be guided, checked, reigned in, annihilated or corrected.
Sometimes checked and guided.

 

[idea]

1. What is the role of the self in your religion?
2. Is our perception of self(identity) an illusion? Why or why not?
3. Is the self of any importance or is it seen to exist simply to glorify the god of your religion?
4. If your religion believes the individual was created, why was it created?
5. According to your religion does the self grow or is it something that diminishes in favor of another aspect of being?
6. According to your religion is there a final state of being, by whatever avenue taken? If so, please describe it.
7. According to your religion is there a difference between self and what we know as the ego.
8. Is the ego something that needs to be guided, checked, reigned in, annihilated or corrected.


Your thoughts on these questions would be greatly appreciated.

Note: This is placed in a discussion area and so debate is not permitted.

To borrow from a thoughtful poster, if you could identify your religion and then give your answers, that would be most helpful.

Feel free to answer some, or all, of the questions, as you wish, or have time for.

The last point is a plea to try to refrain from the cut and paste technique from your favorite scripture. IF, and it is a big IF, the section is applicable, then go for it, otherwise please try to answer the questions in your own words.

My fave scriptures that explain it are these:


For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it. - (New Testament | Matthew 16:25)

a strange thing happens when you lose your life / lose your ego - you find something else, the real you hides behind our ego.

also, this idea comes into play:
14 For the body is not one member, but many.
15 If the foot shall say, Because I am not the hand, I am not of the body; is it therefore not of the body?
16 And if the ear shall say, Because I am not the eye, I am not of the body; is it therefore not of the body?
17 If the whole body were an eye, where were the hearing? If the whole were hearing, where were the smelling?
18 But now hath God set the members every one of them in the body, as it hath pleased him.
19 And if they were all one member, where were the body?
20 But now are they many members, yet but one body.
21 And the eye cannot say unto the hand, I have no need of thee: nor again the ahead to the feet, I have no need of you.
22 Nay, much more those members of the body, which seem to be more feeble, are necessary:
23 And those members of the body, which we think to be less honourable, upon these we bestow more abundant honour; and our uncomely parts have more abundant comeliness.
(New Testament | 1 Corinthians 12:14 - 23)


by letting go of your ego, you allow yourself to join with other people - join as part of the body. The heart, or foot, or eye - all on it's own sitting on the operating table is not good for anything, the foot does not walk without the legs, the eye does not see without the brain, the heart does not pump blood without anything to pump it too... it is only when these organs come into the body, allow themselves to be taken over by the direction of the body, used by the body, that their real purpose is unveiled. Some people think that you lose your individuality by being sheeple to some organized body - but the heart/eye/feet are still heart/eyes/feet within the organized body...

we are called to belong, not just to believe.
I resisted it’s exertions (NavalAcademy) fearing its effects on my individuality. But as a POW I learned that a shared purpose did not claim my identity. On the contrary, it enlarged my sense of myself.– Faith of my Fathers

letting go of ego, is how we can belong... if that makes sense? to be united with others...
our ego leads to isolationism... letting go of the ego allows us to be united with others.

 

[Reggae_Re]

What do you think why there are such different attitudes to Ego in religions?.. Do you listen to other points of view?.. Do you think we should put our Egos down?.. Maybe, is it a reason for all our suffering?.. Thank's for your answers!..

 

[YmirGF]

What do you think why there are such different attitudes to Ego in religions?.. Do you listen to other points of view?.. Do you think we should put our Egos down?.. Maybe, is it a reason for all our suffering?.. Thank's for your answers!..

I tend to think that it is how we choose to treat the ego that is the cause of our suffering. In some ways, the ego is like an inquisitive child that needs to know that it is loved, cherished and transforms beyond its normal limitations when given half a chance. That said, it is my view that all too many folks confuse egotism for ego.

 

[NobodyYouKnow]

1. What is the role of the self in your religion?
2. Is our perception of self(identity) an illusion? Why or why not?
3. Is the self of any importance or is it seen to exist simply to glorify the god of your religion?
4. If your religion believes the individual was created, why was it created?
5. According to your religion does the self grow or is it something that diminishes in favor of another aspect of being?
6. According to your religion is there a final state of being, by whatever avenue taken? If so, please describe it.
7. According to your religion is there a difference between self and what we know as the ego.
8. Is the ego something that needs to be guided, checked, reigned in, annihilated or corrected.


Your thoughts on these questions would be greatly appreciated.

Note: This is placed in a discussion area and so debate is not permitted.

To borrow from a thoughtful poster, if you could identify your religion and then give your answers, that would be most helpful.

Feel free to answer some, or all, of the questions, as you wish, or have time for.

The last point is a plea to try to refrain from the cut and paste technique from your favorite scripture. IF, and it is a big IF, the section is applicable, then go for it, otherwise please try to answer the questions in your own words.

Religion: Agama Hindu Dharma/Tantra.

It is difficult to answer this because self is equated with ego, unless you are talking about the Supreme Soul or the 'that' in the 'I am that I am'.

As you can see, the statement is contradictory within itself, for when one becomes 'that', they lose the sense of the 'self'...the 'ego'.

So, bearing that in mind, I shall try to answer these questions:

1. The role of the self is to realise its relation with 'non-self'.
2. It isn't an 'illusion' per se (although my path will claim that it is), it's just not necessarily all that important, or even deserves all the importance we place upon it.
3. See the answers given above...so that will be a 'no' and a 'yes'.
4. I am going to just go with tradition here and say 'karma'. That seems to be the answer to everything. lol
5. It diminishes in favour of another aspect of being (Brahman).
6. Moksha is indescribable.
7. There is no difference (see my introduction to this reply).
8. Not really. It just needs to be 'superseded' with something better.

I hope my answers are satisfactory.

 

[LuisDantas]

1. What is the role of the self in your religion?

To be acknowledged as a tricky concept, usually misleading, often unworth of the trouble.

2. Is our perception of self(identity) an illusion? Why or why not?

Sort of. It is an artificial feeling, very much unreliable yet also unavoidable.

3. Is the self of any importance or is it seen to exist simply to glorify the god of your religion?

Not the second option, for sure. It would not make any sense as I see it.

As for importance... it is important to be functional as a person, I suppose.

4. If your religion believes the individual was created, why was it created?

No, it was not.

5. According to your religion does the self grow or is it something that diminishes in favor of another aspect of being?

I would have to know what you mean by "self" to answer. I have a very hard time with this kind of question, because I have no idea of what is meant.

6. According to your religion is there a final state of being, by whatever avenue taken? If so, please describe it.

You mean, a final state for my being, for me as a person?

I am very much a believer that death is real, if that is what you mean to ask. No afterlife realms at all.

I do however believe that there is value, perhaps the ultimate value, in harmoniously taking and leaving a legacy from and for others.

7. According to your religion is there a difference between self and what we know as the ego.

I guess not. One vague, arguably useless concept is as good as the next.

8. Is the ego something that needs to be guided, checked, reigned in, annihilated or corrected.

Probably. It will depend on the context and which meaning it lends to that concept.

(...)

To borrow from a thoughtful poster, if you could identify your religion and then give your answers, that would be most helpful.

I make my own Dharma, as I truly hope everyone to. It is based on a shamelessly atheistic and anti-theistic take on Buddhism which for all I know is as orthodox as they come, but also takes a lot from Utilitarian Ethics.

 

[YmirGF]

Religion: Agama Hindu Dharma/Tantra.

It is difficult to answer this because self is equated with ego, unless you are talking about the Supreme Soul or the 'that' in the 'I am that I am'.

As you can see, the statement is contradictory within itself, for when one becomes 'that', they lose the sense of the 'self'...the 'ego'.

So, bearing that in mind, I shall try to answer these questions:

1. The role of the self is to realise its relation with 'non-self'.
2. It isn't an 'illusion' per se (although my path will claim that it is), it's just not necessarily all that important, or even deserves all the importance we place upon it.
3. See the answers given above...so that will be a 'no' and a 'yes'.
4. I am going to just go with tradition here and say 'karma'. That seems to be the answer to everything. lol
5. It diminishes in favour of another aspect of being (Brahman).
6. Moksha is indescribable.
7. There is no difference (see my introduction to this reply).
8. Not really. It just needs to be 'superseded' with something better.

I hope my answers are satisfactory.

All answers are more than satisfactory, NobodyYouKnow. That said, much of my current perspective has its roots in your present understanding as defined by your religious tag. (In no way do I mean that as any kind of a put down, just a clarification, as Hinduism shaped much of my early thinking.) To be fair, I am meaning "self" in my sense on the word, wherein it is an open-ended being with no final destination. In a very real sense, there is only limitless and quite endless growth.

 

[Satyamavejayanti]

Namaste,

I will try to provide my opinion, My religion is Hindu.

By self here i mean the Hindu concept of Atman, my opinion is based on this assumption.

1. What is the role of the self in your religion?

It plays a significant role, some call it part of the supreme self, some consider it separate, but most would agree as it being eternal and unborn.

2. Is our perception of self(identity) an illusion? Why or why not?

I don't think it is, as our perceptions are part of the Universe, and the Universe is not a illusion and is real, therefore our identity is real.

3. Is the self of any importance or is it seen to exist simply to glorify the god of your religion?

I think it has great importance in Hinduism, as its considered eternal, it co-exists with the supreme self, and its the reason for the existence of the Universe as the observer. It does not exists only to glorify Ishvar but to keep the wheel of creation spinning.

4. If your religion believes the individual was created, why was it created?

I don't believe the self was created, but it is eternal, our individual identity is a product os our environment and our actions, some consider it the part of Purusha, some consider it the Brahman under Maya, some see it as being born again and again, many different views on this.

5. According to your religion does the self grow or is it something that diminishes in favor of another aspect of being?

Neither i think, but i would go with that it grows, but only as a individual. As a eternal Atman it just is, and already existing from eternity therefore not needing to grow.

6. According to your religion is there a final state of being, by whatever avenue taken? If so, please describe it.

I think there is, many call it Moksha, but the actual understanding of moksha is not clear. generally its viewed as a release from birth and death.

I would call it being in a state where we have realized all that there is to realize.

7. According to your religion is there a difference between self and what we know as the ego.

I think there is, but again there are many differing views. Personally the Self (Atman) is the life force, the ego is the result of our current individual life which is conditioned by nature.

8. Is the ego something that needs to be guided, checked, reigned in, annihilated or corrected.

Yes, guided and checked, its like a chariot, and the senses are the reins and our self is the charioteer. we must "Hold our horses", so to speak.

Thanks

 

[Straw Dog]

1. What is the role of the self in your religion?
2. Is our perception of self(identity) an illusion? Why or why not?

I don't really follow a religion, but I do hang out with some religious folks.

The sense of identity is and is not an illusion. It has functional value in so far as it facilitates necessary ends of a particular lifeform, but it becomes dysfunctional whenever it adopts excessive desires based upon groundless opinion, ergo the modern consumerist mentality.

3. Is the self of any importance or is it seen to exist simply to glorify the god of your religion?

I tend to think the ego has much more to do with the sense of esteem. It's a certain report about an organism's progress or enhancement based upon a certain worldview establishing the criteria.

To be continued...

 

[arcanum]

Born Christian, now more informed and inspired by Gnostic ideologies. I have had an experience which could be called ego death or at least the suspension of the ego. I never felt more free in my life, the machinations of the ego were totally suspended and I existed in a very pure state of being. Granted I had a little assistance in arriving at this state, but I don't think I will ever look at the self in the same way. I think we are born with an essential self and as a result of life a conditioned ego forms upon that self almost like dust on a mirror, for some it's not so porous, for some a thick black tar forums. I think the goal of the spiritual life is to clean the mirror and get back in touch with one's original nature.

 

[NobodyYouKnow]

Born Christian, now more informed and inspired by Gnostic ideologies. I have had an experience which could be called ego death or at least the suspension of the ego. I never felt more free in my life, the machinations of the ego were totally suspended and I existed in a very pure state of being. Granted I had a little assistance in arriving at this state, but I don't think I will ever look at the self in the same way. I think we are born with an essential self and as a result of life a conditioned ego forms upon that self almost like dust on a mirror, for some it's not so porous, for some a thick black tar forums. I think the goal of the spiritual life is to clean the mirror and get back in touch with one's original nature.

So nice!

I once wrote a poem about this...about what it is like to clean that 'mirror' with an oily rag.

Ego is Satan. It is that which tricks our mind into believing in things that are not real...not true...and it is very good at doing it!

I have just experienced it, yet again.

I have been raised and educated within my own philosophy...a philosophy I totally believe in, so when somebody comes along and refutes my belief with logic, I always need to do a 'double take'...being a student of Pure Logic is also my biggest downfall.

I have been so busy 'experiencing God' within myself, that it has totally blinded me to the concept of God existing anywhere else outside of my own direct perception...so, I realised that was just more deception...more lies.

It hurts to have to say...'that's a crock of bulls***, so, let's move on, shall we?' but that is what I must do to take the 'next step'.

I have to 'unlearn' whatever it is I have learned...and let the Master fill my cup with tea again.