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The Pagan Root of Judeo-Christianity.

Desert Snake

Veteran Member
John D Brey,
I believe you must be talking about some other religion, because the roots of True Christianity came straight from Jehovah God through Moses and the Nation of Israel and the Mosaic Law Covenant! Their can be no sensible argument about that!!!
I don't believe that that means these aren't multi-faceted subjects.

We note 'those of the circumcision', ie the physical circumcision, and those who aren't circumcised, both in the religious group of later "christianity". The first church, noted in the NT, does not practice physical circumcision, they view it mystically, presumably, because this clearly is what Paul espouses; we can assume that it's the norm for this church.

Hence those who became christians were from the physical, and non physical understanding, groups, in the area.

The "formal" belief of the christian church being that circumcision is not physical at all, but a spiritual concept.
 

Muffled

Jesus in me
This is all flesh. Paul spoke the words for the saints to see the spirit over the flesh. Phallic has nothing to do with spirit. Or the God of spirit.

(53) His disciples said to him, "Is circumcision beneficial or not?"
He said to them, "If it were beneficial, their father would beget them already circumcised from their mother. Rather, the true circumcision in spirit has become completely profitable."- Gospel of Thomas

I believe I can't put a lot of faith in the gospel of Thomas (supposed) but I enjoy his logic. However it was God who ordered circumcision not a pagan.
 

Phantasman

Well-Known Member
I believe I can't put a lot of faith in the gospel of Thomas (supposed) but I enjoy his logic. However it was God who ordered circumcision not a pagan.
That IS Bible (catholic) logic (of flesh).

If you read Galatians you will understand Pauls spiritual understanding over Peters perversion. The Incident at Antioch (Paul against Peter) explains spirit over flesh. The circumcised were the Jews. Uncircumcised the Gentiles. The gospel was given to all regardless of circumcision. Because Jesus said "the flesh profits nothing" John 8, circumcision (of flesh) means nothing and not of the Father (who is spirit).

For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.- Galatians.
 

John D. Brey

Well-Known Member
Consistent with the ideas being discussed, Professor Wolfson implies something very important here, which comes into full bloom only in his more contemporary writings concerning circumcision. Professor Wolfson explicitly, or implicitly, consciously, or subconsciously, implies what is the case, and case in point, that the writing on the flesh of the male Jew on the eighth day represents the original act of writing such that the seminal question arises whether this writing on the flesh of the male Jew is hieroglyphic or demotic? If demotic, then the writing of brit milah severs the unity of tangible thing and idea from the sacred-glyph producing the first demotic letter or word. . . If hieroglyphic, the writing of brit milah creates a sacred-glyph that's a picture, or pictogram, of some tangible thing (from the natural world) that the glyph, or image, uses to produce the thought, or idea, born of the act of writing. . . . Is brit milah, as the seminal act of writing, the act of a priest producing a sacred-glyph (as we would expect) or the act of a writer/amanuensis producing the demotic separation that severs the written word from it's source in the sacred-glyph? Does the mohel connect the word or letter written in the flesh with a tangible image from the natural world, or is his act the severing of a thought, or idea, from the tangible thing first associated with ideas and thoughts. Is the mohel's act evolution or priestly evocation? Ontological, or meontololgical?



John

Priestly evocation would be the yad revealing the sign (sacred-glyph) without depositing anything in order to do so. The tool used to create a hieroglyph removes material hiding the unity of thing/material and sign while it, the tool, leaves nothing of itself behind. Interpretation, on the other hand, is evolutionary. The pen leaves ink or lead or some medium unique to the pen on the page or parchment. Unlike the word written by the pen, the hieroglyph is ontological in the sense that the veil hiding the sacred-glyph is, like the foreskin in the ritual in question, originally considered part and parcel of the holistic truth hidden by the intact nature of the material the yad removes. Prior to the creation of the hieroglyph the stone where the glyph is cut is thought to be one thing rather than two: sign and material.

In the case of the hieroglyph, the "sign" is the male-element, while the material is female. The female is opened up not to deposit something from the male, but to reveal that the "sign" (male) was in the female all along. On the other hand, in the case of the pen, it is itself the male depositing its male element in or on the page "creating" something from the union of male and female (the ראשׁ "firstborn") which doesn't exist prior to this form of gender mixing. The hieroglyph reveals a hidden unity of male and female that's ontological, original, whereas the written word "creates" a unity that requires that the pen and paper come together (in an evolutionary fashion) to form what, until that unity, doesn't exist: Cain.

The hieroglyph requires only that the material be opened to reveal what's hidden in the material from the get-go. The pen doesn't so much reveal an ontic fact, as it's the case that it creates a new state of evolutionary affairs dependent on the pen unifying with the parchment, paper, or page.

So which is it? Does the mohel reveal a sign hidden beneath the foreskin that was there from the get-go, and is only hidden until something originally part of the penis is removed to reveal something formerly hidden? Or does the mohel deposit something, create, archive, something, on the flesh of the penis, that makes the mohel part and parcel of what he creates (the revelation) in associated with his actions? Is the mohel a revealer, or a creator? Does he merely uncover the revelation? Or are his actions part of the actual creation and existence of the revelation?



John

 
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