The Purpose of Religion

[Popeyesays]

i agree with this, however, i also feel that morality comes into it aswell! a lot of people follow a religion because they see that religion as having a moral code that they agree with and can identify with

i guess a lot of people need comfort in knowing that this life we are living at the moment is not the be all and end all - wheather it be an after life they believe in or a form of reincarnation.

For consideration:
"Likewise, the divine religions of the holy Manifestations of God are in reality one, though in name and nomenclature they differ. Man must be a lover of the light, no matter from what dayspring it may appear. He must be a lover of the rose, no matter in what soil it may be growing. He must be a seeker of the truth, no matter from what source it come. Attachment to the lantern is not loving the light. Attachment to the earth is not befitting, but enjoyment of the rose which develops from the soil is worthy. Devotion to the tree is profitless, but partaking of the fruit is beneficial. Luscious fruits, no matter upon what tree they grow or where they may be found, must be enjoyed. The word of truth, no matter which tongue utters it, must be sanctioned. Absolute verities, no matter in what book they be recorded, must be accepted. If we harbor prejudice, it will be the cause of deprivation and ignorance. The strife between religions, nations and races arises from misunderstanding. If we investigate the religions to discover the principles underlying their foundations, we will find they agree; for the fundamental reality of them is one and not multiple. By this means the religionists of the world will reach their point of unity and reconciliation. They will ascertain the truth that the purpose of religion is the acquisition of praiseworthy virtues, the betterment of morals, the spiritual development of mankind, the real life and divine bestowals. All the Prophets have been the promoters of these principles; none of Them has been the promoter of corruption, vice or evil. They have summoned mankind to all good. They have united people in the love of God, invited them to the religions of the unity of mankind and exhorted them to amity and agreement. For example, we mention Abraham and Moses. By this mention we do not mean the limitation implied in the mere names but intend the virtues which these names embody. When we say Abraham, we mean thereby a manifestation of divine guidance, a center of human virtues, a source of heavenly bestowals to mankind, a dawning point of divine inspiration and perfections. These perfections and graces are not limited to names and boundaries. When we find these virtues, qualities and attributes in any personality, we recognize the same reality shining from within and bow in acknowledgment of the Abrahamic perfections. Similarly, we acknowledge and adore the beauty of Moses. Some souls were lovers of the name Abraham, loving the lantern instead of the light, and when they saw this same light shining from another lantern, they were so attached to the former lantern that they did not recognize its later appearance and illumination. Therefore, those who were attached and held tenaciously to the name Abraham were deprived when the Abrahamic virtues reappeared in Moses. Similarly, the Jews were believers in Moses, awaiting the coming of the Messiah. The virtues and perfections of Moses became apparent in Jesus Christ most effulgently, but the Jews held to the name Moses, not adoring the virtues and perfections manifest in Him. Had they been adoring these virtues and seeking these perfections, they would assuredly have believed in Jesus Christ when the same virtues and perfections shone in Him. If we are lovers of the light, we adore it in whatever lamp it may become manifest, but if we love the lamp itself and the light is transferred to another lamp, we will neither accept nor sanction it. Therefore, we must follow and adore the virtues revealed in the Messengers of God -- whether in Abraham, Moses, Jesus or other Prophets -- but we must not adhere to and adore the lamp. We must recognize the sun, no matter from what dawning point it may shine forth, be it Mosaic, Abrahamic or any personal point of orientation whatever, for we are lovers of sunlight and not of orientation. We are lovers of illumination and not of lamps and candles. We are seekers for water, no matter from what rock it may gush forth. We are in need of fruit in whatsoever orchard it may be ripened. We long for rain; it matters not which cloud pours it down. We must not be fettered. If we renounce these fetters, we shall agree, for all are seekers of reality. The counterfeit or imitation of true religion has adulterated human belief, and the foundations have been lost sight of. The variance of these imitations has produced enmity and strife, war and bloodshed. Now the glorious and brilliant twentieth century has dawned, and the divine bounty is radiating universally. The Sun of Truth is shining forth in intense enkindlement. This is, verily, the century when these imitations must be forsaken, superstitions abandoned and God alone worshiped. We must look at the reality of the Prophets and Their teachings in order that we may agree."
(Abdu'l-Baha, The Promulgation of Universal Peace)

Regards,
Scott

 

[gnomon]

And now to cast a stone into the pond...

Religion is the proof of evil on earth. I makes us do irational things for resons so rediculus that if we were to say the resons out loud and give it good thought we would all declare it insanity. People blow themselves up because they feel they must win an arguement that is essentialy, in the words of George Carlin, "An arguement over who has the better imaginary freind."
People are dieing now in the middle east because of this arguement. And it isnt the first time either. The Crusades, the Spanish Inquistion, WWII, the Salem Witch Burnings, the list is endless. Religion is, for lack of a better term, more Evil than Good. For those of you who believe such things, religion is the devils greatest tool against man.

I would disagree. One on the point that I do not see religion as the most frequent underlying cause of conflict between cultures. We could get into a comparison contest of how many people have been killed over religious reasons (the Crusades) as compared to non-religious ones (Nazi Germany, communism under Stalin and Mao, world programs leading to the Somali famine, imperialism, etc.). No doubt religious beliefs can fuel tragedies such as the Salem witch trials but there are people who hold to religious ideals that speak out against such actions.

 

[gnomon]

With out religion there is no defintion of good or bad. Who set the standards? We get to choose what good and bad is. Guilt is a bi product of doing something wrong. Is stealing hurting anyone? No! Then take, who cares.

I know I cannot prove this but I'm under the impression that social mores probably predate religious tenets. Unfortunately I cannot reach back into the mind of the first homo sapiens sapiens.

 

[Abram]

I know I cannot prove this but I'm under the impression that social mores probably predate religious tenets. Unfortunately I cannot reach back into the mind of the first homo sapiens sapiens.

thats cool... I can't realy prove my point either. In fact I can't prove any of them.

 

[meogi]

With out religion there is no defintion of good or bad. Who set the standards? We get to choose what good and bad is.

Exactly. A group of people defines what's good and bad. This happens with or without religion... although in the case of religion it's generally one person (the prophet to whom god speaks) who defines them. Believers merely agree and the standards are reinforced.

Guilt is a bi product of doing something wrong.

Guilt is a byproduct of you, yourself, believing something is wrong yet doing it anyway.

Is stealing hurting anyone? No! Then take, who cares.

I guess you've never had anything stolen from you... it doesn't feel good. Why? Because it's either a loss of something you need to survive, or (one way or another) a loss of status among your peers. If you never valued the object in the first place, then yes, who cares... but how often do you keep something you don't value?

 

[Abram]

Exactly. A group of people defines what's good and bad. This happens with or without religion... although in the case of religion it's generally one person (the prophet to whom god speaks) who defines them. Believers merely agree and the standards are reinforced.

No God set the standards. In fact we didn't know we had a problem with sinning till God gave us the 10 commandments. That's why we have them, to know we sin.

Guilt is a byproduct of you, yourself, believing something is wrong yet doing it anyway.

I don't buy this one because if we created our own guilt we could learn to shut it down or change it. (I wish)

I guess you've never had anything stolen from you... it doesn't feel good. Why? Because it's either a loss of something you need to survive, or (one way or another) a loss of status among your peers. If you never valued the object in the first place, then yes, who cares... but how often do you keep something you don't value?

I have walked out to my car to find a missing window and a empty trunk. I'm trying to make a point that why bother keeping the law of anyone if you knew you could get way with it. With no religion or higher power, there is no consequence... Freedom from guilt through non belief. So much power with that mind set!

 

[meogi]

No God set the standards. In fact we didn't know we had a problem with sinning till God gave us the 10 commandments. That's why we have them, to know we sin.

God set the standards? I thought Moses did... does not my original statement about one person to whom god speaks through hold true?

I don't buy this one because if we created our own guilt we could learn to shut it down or change it. (I wish)

No, we do create our own guilt. We can 'shut it down,' (or never have it in the first place) but that requires change of beliefs. Do you believe all people who commit crimes that are deemed 'wrong' feel guilt?

I have walked out to my car to find a missing window and a empty trunk. I'm trying to make a point that why bother keeping the law of anyone if you knew you could get way with it.

We bother keeping the law because you don't always get away with it. You hurt someone else, and because of that the rest of society deemed it neccessary for you to be punished.

With no religion or higher power, there is no consequence...

No, without society there is no consequence.

Freedom from guilt through non belief. So much power with that mind set!

Freedom from the guilt of who's beliefs? Your's? The Hindu/Muslim/Confucianist's down the street? So much power with that indeed... you just named well over half the people on earth.

It comes down to a group of people thinking their view is correct. A group of people asserting what they believe to be good and bad. You can chose to follow those beliefs, other beliefs, or your own beliefs. It's how humanity has lived since we became a social animal, and it's how we'll continue to live.

 

[The Grey Wolf]

I believe many of you misinturpreted my "Religion is Evil" statement. I did NOT state that the religion it self was to blame, but rather it was singled out. And all religions have ALL at some point been or had connected to them an extreamist group that felt they were "the holy warriors of god" or some rediculous thing. Upon hind-sight religion isnt evil, or rather not compleatly. Firm beliefs and those tards too stupid to see past them are. In the end we will cause our own destrution. And NO god will ever take that away from us. If there are aliens they prolly posted a sign on our planet; "Abandon hope all ye who enter here." If they are smart theyll stay faaaaaar away from us...

 

[angellous_evangellous]

What is your take on the purpose of religion in our world? My opinion is that religion is and always has been here to shelter us from things we dont understand and/or fear.

The purpose of religion is to inspire people to find deeper meaning in their lives through theological reflection and providing for the needs of others.

James 1.27
Religion that is pure and undefiled before God, the Father, is this: to visit orphans and widows in their affliction, and to keep oneself unstained from the world.

Mark 12.28
"Which commandment is the most important of all?" 29Jesus answered, "The most important is, 'Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one. 30And you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.' 31The second is this: 'You shall love your neighbor as yourself.' There is no other commandment greater than these."

 

[angellous_evangellous]

And now to cast a stone into the pond...

Religion is the proof of evil on earth. I makes us do irational things for resons so rediculus that if we were to say the resons out loud and give it good thought we would all declare it insanity. People blow themselves up because they feel they must win an arguement that is essentialy, in the words of George Carlin, "An arguement over who has the better imaginary freind."

People are dieing now in the middle east because of this arguement. And it isnt the first time either. The Crusades, the Spanish Inquistion, WWII, the Salem Witch Burnings, the list is endless. Religion is, for lack of a better term, more Evil than Good. For those of you who believe such things, religion is the devils greatest tool against man.

You've gotten a lot of flack for this.

I agree completely and think that it is a fair assessment of religion. Religion used to be a basic form of government in most cultures. It is public ritual designed to preserve the myths and traditions (as someone said before on this thread). If religion is a type of government, then the rulers can use religion as a tool by which to get the people to carry out their goals, whether it has anything to do with the theology or not. Certainly some religions are godless and have nothing to give to humanity - including some strains of Christianity (like mideval Roman Catholicism that spawned the crusades, the Protestantism behind the modern KKK, and fundamentalism that harms women and homosexuals and science) - but serve as a drug to keep the people in the same pattern of life.

Two excellent reviews of this type of religion are in Bertrand Russell (an American atheist), Why I am not a Christian and other essays, and Dietrich Bonhoeffer (a German Christian who was put to death for speaking out against Hitler), Cost of Discipleship. I know that Russell's essays are available for free online, and possibly Bonhoeffer's work is available as well.

 

[Weeziana]

Please bare with me on this one as I'm new here.

I find religion to be fairly evil as well, or atleast some of the ones that I've witnessed. I've always referred to it as "house of the hipocrits" because many of the church going christians that I know seem to think they're better than everyone else who doesn't attend their church. They look down on others and pass judgement. I can't tell you how often I've been told that I'm going to hell because I don't attend church on a regular basis. Some religions are congregations of people to sit around and talk about their greatness and put themselves above others. They are some of the most non sympathetic group of people I know, unless of course it pertains to someone of their religion.

If I were one to worship God, I certainly wouldn't feel the need to do it as part of a religion. I could do it on my own time and in my own way. Listening to another mortal human tell me what I should be doing and thinking is not my idea of showing faith and worship.

 

[The Grey Wolf]

Please bare with me on this one as I'm new here.

I find religion to be fairly evil as well, or atleast some of the ones that I've witnessed. I've always referred to it as "house of the hipocrits" because many of the church going christians that I know seem to think they're better than everyone else who doesn't attend their church. They look down on others and pass judgement. I can't tell you how often I've been told that I'm going to hell because I don't attend church on a regular basis. Some religions are congregations of people to sit around and talk about their greatness and put themselves above others. They are some of the most non sympathetic group of people I know, unless of course it pertains to someone of their religion.

If I were one to worship God, I certainly wouldn't feel the need to do it as part of a religion. I could do it on my own time and in my own way. Listening to another mortal human tell me what I should be doing and thinking is not my idea of showing faith and worship.

AMEN!

 

[Eynah]

And now to cast a stone into the pond...

Religion is the proof of evil on earth. I makes us do irational things for resons so rediculus that if we were to say the resons out loud and give it good thought we would all declare it insanity. People blow themselves up because they feel they must win an arguement that is essentialy, in the words of George Carlin, "An arguement over who has the better imaginary freind."
People are dieing now in the middle east because of this arguement. And it isnt the first time either. The Crusades, the Spanish Inquistion, WWII, the Salem Witch Burnings, the list is endless. Religion is, for lack of a better term, more Evil than Good. For those of you who believe such things, religion is the devils greatest tool against man.

No, people are the cause for all of the evil on the earth. The Crusades, the Spanish Inquisition, Salem, etc. all us. It's always been us, not the religions themselves. In fact, I would say that the founders of the religions would not have wanted the deaths in their names. Or at all. Religion is to try and make you a better person, mostly.

I guess you could say that without Religion, we wouldn't be casting stones at each other, but I still think we would have. Instead of going for witches and things, though, we would just change the reasons. "You're the fault of all the problems in Germany because you're ugly, short, and have tiny feet."

 

[Kristian Kanga]

I believe that religion is for the weak.

 

[ChrisP]

I believe that religion is for the weak.

I wish I was there in person to roll my eyes but o well I guess a smilie will have to do .

Why are people who are prepared to admit there is something greater than all weak? Why are people prepared to something (in most cases everything) ahead of themselves weak.

You. Are. Talking. Out. Your. Arse.

 

[Green Gaia]

Two excellent reviews of this type of religion are in Bertrand Russell (an American atheist), Why I am not a Christian and other essays, and Dietrich Bonhoeffer (a German Christian who was put to death for speaking out against Hitler), Cost of Discipleship. I know that Russell's essays are available for free online, and possibly Bonhoeffer's work is available as well.

If you have those links handy and don't mind, you could make a thread about them in our Religious Books forum? I've read both, but others may not have them available to them otherwise. Thanks, Maize.

 

[Green Gaia]

I believe that religion is for the weak.

I believe that religion is for those who seek to know the sacred, either within ourselves or from that transcending mystery some call God. No, one does not need a religion to do either, but we are social animals and tend to organize with others with like beliefs, therefore we have religions.

 

[Green Gaia]

I find religion to be fairly evil as well, or atleast some of the ones that I've witnessed.

Is it the religion that is evil or some people who practice the religion who do evil things?

 

[Weeziana]

Is it the religion that is evil or some people who practice the religion who do evil things?

IMO, the people are the religion. A religion would not be so without the people. A religion is not a "thing" or an object, it's the beliefs of the group that pracitices it, so to me there really is no difference in saying the religion itself or the people that practice it.

 

[The Grey Wolf]

No, people are the cause for all of the evil on the earth. The Crusades, the Spanish Inquisition, Salem, etc. all us. It's always been us, not the religions themselves. In fact, I would say that the founders of the religions would not have wanted the deaths in their names. Or at all. Religion is to try and make you a better person, mostly.

I guess you could say that without Religion, we wouldn't be casting stones at each other, but I still think we would have. Instead of going for witches and things, though, we would just change the reasons. "You're the fault of all the problems in Germany because you're ugly, short, and have tiny feet."

True it was the human element that commited the crime, but it was the religion that gave them an excuse to do the normaly inexcuseable. I also did another post regarding this issue.