The revenge of hydroxychloroquine

[Shaul]

A new peer reviewed study shows hydroxychloroquine reduces Covid-19 hospitalizations by 84%.

Study finds 84% fewer hospitalizations for patients treated with controversial drug hydroxychloroquine

 

[Altfish]

A new peer reviewed study shows hydroxychloroquine reduces Covid-19 hospitalizations by 84%.

Study finds 84% fewer hospitalizations for patients treated with controversial drug hydroxychloroquine

Have you read the study?
The article says that a low dose of hydroxychloroquine mixed with other agents, the other agents being zinc and azithromycin, has in a small sample proved effective against people with no treatment.

 

[Shaul]

Have you read the study?
The article says that a low dose of hydroxychloroquine mixed with other agents, the other agents being zinc and azithromycin, has in a small sample proved effective against people with no treatment.

So what’s your point?

 

[metis]

Here are some of the side-effects of it:
What side effects can this medication cause?
Hydroxychloroquine may cause side effects. Tell your doctor if any of these symptoms are severe or do not go away:

• headache
• dizziness
• loss of appetite
• nausea
• diarrhea
• stomach pain
• vomiting
• rash

If you experience any of the following symptoms, call your doctor immediately:

• difficulty reading or seeing (words, letters, or parts of objects missing)
• sensitivity to light
• blurred vision
• changes in vision
• seeing light flashes or streaks
• difficulty hearing
• ringing in ears
• muscle weakness
• unusual bleeding or bruising
• bleaching or loss of hair
• mood or mental changes
• irregular heartbeat
• drowsiness
• convulsions
• decreased consciousness or loss of consciousness
• thinking about harming or killing yourself. -- Hydroxychloroquine: MedlinePlus Drug Information

 

[suncowiam]

I just talked to hydroxychloroquine. She doesn't feel the need to have revenge. She was doing just fine as a drug for malaria which have been thoroughly tested and verified. No doubts left in the scientific community.

Also as an FYI, performing and referencing clinical studies is probably a good thing to do first before suggesting it is a cure all in a pandemic.

It helps to follow scientific methods to help classify a hypothesis as being a lie, opinion, hearsay, speculation, plausible or fact.

What Trump did falls into the lie, opinion, hearsay and speculation range.

Point understood?

 

[exchemist]

So what’s your point?

The point is it is not much good.

Other studies have shown no effect. Here is an example: https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2019014

 

[Altfish]

So what’s your point?

Arsenic is useful in small doses

 

[Shaul]

Here are some of the side-effects of it:
What side effects can this medication cause?
Hydroxychloroquine may cause side effects. Tell your doctor if any of these symptoms are severe or do not go away:

• headache
• dizziness
• loss of appetite
• nausea
• diarrhea
• stomach pain
• vomiting
• rash

If you experience any of the following symptoms, call your doctor immediately:

• difficulty reading or seeing (words, letters, or parts of objects missing)
• sensitivity to light
• blurred vision
• changes in vision
• seeing light flashes or streaks
• difficulty hearing
• ringing in ears
• muscle weakness
• unusual bleeding or bruising
• bleaching or loss of hair
• mood or mental changes
• irregular heartbeat
• drowsiness
• convulsions
• decreased consciousness or loss of consciousness
• thinking about harming or killing yourself. -- Hydroxychloroquine: MedlinePlus Drug Information

Wow, those side effects sounds way worse than the possible effects of Covid-19 which include death. [/sarcasm off]

 

[Shaul]

The point is it is not much good.

Other studies have shown no effect. Here is an example: https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2019014

Older studies under different, non-proposed conditions.

 

[Shaul]

I just talked to hydroxychloroquine. She doesn't feel the need to have revenge. She was doing just fine as a drug for malaria which have been thoroughly tested and verified. No doubts left in the scientific community.

Also as an FYI, performing and referencing clinical studies is probably good thing to do first before suggesting it is a cure all in a pandemic.

It helps to follow scientific methods to help classify a hypothesis to being a lie, opinion, hearsay, speculation, plausible or fact.

What Trump did falls into the lie, opinion, hearsay and speculation range.

Point understood?

You talk with inanimate objects. Noted.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

See: International Journal of Antimicrobial Agents

 

[suncowiam]

You talk with inanimate objects. Noted.

I actually do talk to inanimate objects.

But then... Why go to a debate forum if you're not going to address everything else I noted?

 

[suncowiam]

First, read up on correlation versus causation.

Second, the study was based on a group of drugs. Groups of different chemicals should be considered a completely different drug or treatment. By only suggesting hydroxychloroquine in this OP is a fallacy on many levels.

Third, how are we to know that hydroxychloroquine had any causation to the results?

Ahh, the revenge of science.

 

[Shaul]

I actually do talk to inanimate objects.

But then... Why go to a debate forum if you're not going to address everything else I noted?

And you think inanimate objects also talk back to you. Why go to a debate forum when you could stay busy all the time talking with tables, chairs and lampposts?

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Second, the study was based on a group of drugs. Groups of different chemicals should be considered a completely different drug or treatment. By only suggesting hydroxychloroquine in this OP is a fallacy on many levels.

But @Shaul is not making an argument. He is simply stroking Trump and justifying his own complicity. The fact remains that if true the study:

• is rather good news, and, in fact,
• serves as a harsh indictment of Trump and his sycophants.

 

[Shaul]

First, read up on correlation versus causation.

Second, the study was based on a group of drugs. Groups of different chemicals should be considered a completely different drug or treatment. By only suggesting hydroxychloroquine in this OP is a fallacy on many levels.

Third, how are we to know that hydroxychloroquine had any causation to the results?

Ahh, the revenge of science.

The proponents of hydroxychloroquine have consistently proposed that it be used in combination as a treatment. That doesn’t negate its part in the effects of such treatment. Other studies have attempted to test the other components alone without it and got inferior results.

This study is an indicator that hydroxychloroquine has benefits when used as proposed. That is science.

 

[Shaul]

But @Shaul is not making and argument. He is simply stroking Trump and justifying his own complicity. The fact remains that if true the study:

• is rather good news, and, in fact,
• serves as a harsh indictment of Trump and his sycophants.

No one has mentioned President Trump. You are raising red herrings.

 

[suncowiam]

The proponents of hydroxychloroquine have consistently proposed that it be used in combination as a treatment. That doesn’t negate its part in the effects of such treatment. Other studies have attempted to test the other components alone without it and got inferior results.

This study is an indicator that hydroxychloroquine has benefits when used as proposed. That is science.

If you want to only discuss hydroxychloroquine , then I will agree with your statement.

If there's some unspoken validation on the original claim of this drug made by Trump and conservatives, then this finding does not vindicate Trump's assertion at the time. It was still purely political, short-sighted and dangerous to suggest before clinical trials were done.

 

[sun rise]

Given the media's known biases, in this case a right-wing bias from the site you noted in the OP, I pay attention to direct references to neutral scientific reports.

There's a zinger as well because zinc has a definite positive impact on COVID-19. So as far as I can see the title of this thread is basically false and the OP cite ignores a critical piece of information.

the other agents being zinc

 

[Shaul]

If you want to only discuss hydroxychloroquine , then I will agree with your statement.

If there's some unspoken validation on the original claim of this drug made by Trump and conservatives, then this finding does not vindicate Trump's assertion at the time. It was still purely political, short-sighted and dangerous to suggest before clinical trials were done.

I could care less if President Trump or any other person thinks their person gives imprimatur to something. I didn’t vote for him and I try to follow the science. On the other hand I equally reject ignoring a potentially efficacious treatment for a deadly disease simply because some dislike that President Trump had some connection to it. Lives are at stake. I hate politics putting lives at risk. Period.