The state of education and the quality of teachers. When is enough is enough?

[Twilight Hue]

5th-grade class holds mock slave auction selling black students; authorities investigating

I really don't have words anymore other than we seriously need to go back to basics. Teach the Three R's (Reading, 'R' Writing, and , 'R' Arithmetic )and that's it.

No wonder kids are so screwed up and messed up in the head these days.

If this doesn't raise an alarm to call for teachers to be regularly tested and certified properly for intelligence, proper judgement, and just plain common sense especially when teaching about sensitive areas in our history, I totally don't know what it will take anymore.

Teachers are just plain out of control and the school system is seriously in need of implementing teacher oversight and establishing a proper SOP.

The sad part is teachers are covered by the Teachers Union in New York state, and they are almost impossible to terminate here.

The only interactive historical re-creation I had in social studies and history was making Johnny cakes and sampling other period culinary dishes of the day.

God almighty help us all.

 

[SomeRandom]

I understand making history interactive, but wow.

 

[Twilight Hue]

I understand making history interactive, but wow.

Yea. Wow is an understatement.

For the life of me I don't know what practical value a recreation like that would hold for the kids.

I can just imagine a scenario ....

Little Al goes home and tells his mom he was sold to Timmy today. They let me keep the chains and shackles as a momento. *Yikes*

They would have been better off if they were to reenact the Underground Railroad.

 

[dianaiad]

5th-grade class holds mock slave auction selling black students; authorities investigating

I really don't have words anymore other than we seriously need to go back to basics. Teach the Three R's (Reading, 'R' Writing, and , 'R' Arithmetic )and that's it.

No wonder kids are so screwed up and messed up in the head these days.

If this doesn't raise an alarm to call for teachers to be regularly tested and certified properly for intelligence, proper judgement, and just plain common sense especially when teaching about sensitive areas in our history, I totally don't know what it will take anymore.

Teachers are just plain out of control and the school system is seriously in need of implementing teacher oversight and establishing a proper SOP.

The sad part is teachers are covered by the Teachers Union in New York state, and they are almost impossible to terminate here.

The only interactive historical re-creation I had in social studies and history was making Johnny cakes and sampling other period culinary dishes of the day.

God almighty help us all.

The problem is that there is too much oversight for teachers. We can't teach what we studied. We have to go by curricula designed by politically correct committees with members who haven't been in a classroom for decades.

I spent, literally, six years getting a California teaching credential in English: four years for a BA, two more for a credential, plus many, many more classes. Getting a master's degree for a California English teacher is generally a matter of....writing a thesis or doing a master level project. The classes are pretty much done already in the credentialing process.

At least, that's how it worked for me.

In all that education, we end up in classrooms where we have NO control over the curriculum, NO control over how we handle the classroom, NO control in the materials we use....

You think we need MORE oversight?

Good grief.

 

[SomeRandom]

Yea. Wow is an understatement.

For the life of me I don't know what practical value a recreation like that would hold for the kids.

I can just imagine a scenario ....

Little Al goes home and tells his mom he was sold to Timmy today. They let me keep the chains and shackles as a momento. *Yikes*

They would have been better off if they were to reenact the Underground Railroad.

Well ideally, by actively participating in a historical scenario, students can empathize better with the situation. Sparking a much more in depth discussion and debate over said scenario. Sort of a more involved way of just dryly stating facts, which can fail to reach a child emotionally.
I could see this perhaps as part of a school play to bring attention to the tragedy. Which is then explained as a scar that humans are still trying to heal from.
Like I get the idea behind it. I remember reenacting a part of Rabbit Proof Fence (the Stolen Generation, or our version of slavery) in primary school once. But I think I might have been older than these kids, I only say this because American school ages are a little different than ours. Due to school year terms and different starting ages. But I also remember having to explain what the significance was in a lengthy essay afterwards, (well, lengthy to an 11 year old, anyway) with frank discussions with the teacher.
Make of that what you will.

 

[Brickjectivity]

The problem is that there is too much oversight for teachers. We can't teach what we studied. We have to go by curricula designed by politically correct committees with members who haven't been in a classroom for decades.

I spent, literally, six years getting a California teaching credential in English: four years for a BA, two more for a credential, plus many, many more classes. Getting a master's degree for a California English teacher is generally a matter of....writing a thesis or doing a master level project. The classes are pretty much done already in the credentialing process.

At least, that's how it worked for me.

In all that education, we end up in classrooms where we have NO control over the curriculum, NO control over how we handle the classroom, NO control in the materials we use....

You think we need MORE oversight?

Good grief.

I hear this from one or two other people who are teachers, and it has been this way for twenty or so years now at least. It sounds like a real bummer for public school teachers.

 

[Jumi]

In all that education, we end up in classrooms where we have NO control over the curriculum, NO control over how we handle the classroom, NO control in the materials we use....

That's weird. Did not know that about the US education system.

You think we need MORE oversight?

Good grief.

There's good and bad types of oversight. Not just more or less.

 

[Altfish]

It doesn't help when the country's President has a downer on you...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/educ...ng-sell-you-socialism/?utm_term=.2e67bfd39f12

 

[pearl]

Well ideally, by actively participating in a historical scenario, students can empathize better with the situation.

The teacher provided the 'experience', tapping into the affective domain, unusual for public schools. As for curriculum oversight its necessary but, I think, overdone when it comes to m-cast testing as the teacher is too often forced to teaching to the test.

 

[SomeRandom]

The teacher provided the 'experience', tapping into the affective domain, unusual for public schools. As for curriculum oversight its necessary but, I think, overdone when it comes to m-cast testing as the teacher is too often forced to teaching to the test.

Look I'll take your word for it. I'm Australian and whilst the newest testing curriculum is disconcerting, I don't know if it's anywhere near "teaching the test." At least not yet.

 

[Quetzal]

Teachers are just plain out of control and the school system is seriously in need of implementing teacher oversight and establishing a proper SOP.

I don't understand your analysis. There is one incident and all of a sudden the immediate conclusion you come to is a complete overhaul? Nonsense.

 

[wellwisher]

Yea. Wow is an understatement.

For the life of me I don't know what practical value a recreation like that would hold for the kids.

I can just imagine a scenario ....

Little Al goes home and tells his mom he was sold to Timmy today. They let me keep the chains and shackles as a momento. *Yikes*

They would have been better off if they were to reenact the Underground Railroad.

A pilot test has been run for decades that can show this will work. It is called private schools, like the Catholic Schools which score above the national average. The irony is public school teachers average more educational training than do private school teachers, but their students score lower. The difference is, the private schools tends to be more conservative, and use the traditional approach, that had been used when America was near the top in world education.

The main problem for public schools is not skilled teachers but is connected to unions. I used to work in a government job as a development engineer. The skilled craftsmen I needed to do my job; build experimental equipment, were all union. These union guys and gals were very skilled craftsmen and it was amazing what they could build using my hand written experimental designs. Even though all my designs were built from scratch, they final products looked like they came out of a catalog.

The problem was not the skill of the craftsmen, but the union rules they had to obey. This made it impossible for me to help out when I could by doing even the simplest task, like empty the trash. The union was geared toward creating and maintaining jobs, so even emptying the trash was a union job. My helping in good faith made me a threat. If I tried to help make the job site cleaner, this could result in a union grievance, which means the union worker will get paid for you doing their job. Then the rank and file would avoid you for a few days as secondary punishment.

In terms of Public school unions, the old way of teaching, is more efficient. However, the new way creates more jobs for union workers. Teaching lesson in ten languages means at least ten more union jobs. Instead of generic teachers, the teachers become more specialized, in an attempt to create more jobs. The result is you can start with a better trained teacher force, but end up with worse scores, due to rules that have little to do with education and students needs.

In my case, the best interests of the engineers were often secondary, even though the engineer was at the top of the local chain of command, and he was the source of the funny money that flows to the skilled union development workers and justifies their jobs. It would still work, but not optimized.

In private schools, the students are considered the top of the food chain. Without unions driving the needs of job creation and maintenance, lessor trained teachers , with a more efficient old fashion system that allows the overlap duties and moving around, can better serve this end. This result in better test scores. In public schools a teacher who is not doing their job cannot be fired since students come last behind unions.

 

[pearl]

I'm Australian and whilst the newest testing curriculum is disconcerting, I don't know if it's anywhere near "teaching the test." At least not yet.

Referring to the m-cast testing, if students do not pass they cannot graduate, irregardless of having met other requirements, and reflects poorly on the teacher which in turn reflects the teacher's success.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

A pilot test has been run for decades that can show this will work. It is called private schools, like the Catholic Schools which score above the national average. The irony is public school teachers average more educational training than do private school teachers, but their students score lower. The difference is, the private schools tends to be more conservative, and use the traditional approach, that had been used when America was near the top in world education.

The main problem for public schools is not skilled teachers but is connected to unions. I used to work in a government job as a development engineer. The skilled craftsmen I needed to do my job; build experimental equipment, were all union. These union guys and gals were very skilled craftsmen and it was amazing what they could build using my hand written experimental designs. Even though all my designs were built from scratch, they final products looked like they came out of a catalog.

The problem was not the skill of the craftsmen, but the union rules they had to obey. This made it impossible for me to help out when I could by doing even the simplest task, like empty the trash. The union was geared toward creating and maintaining jobs, so even emptying the trash was a union job. My helping in good faith made me a threat. If I tried to help make the job site cleaner, this could result in a union grievance, which means the union worker will get paid for you doing their job. Then the rank and file would avoid you for a few days as secondary punishment.

In terms of Public school unions, the old way of teaching, is more efficient. However, the new way creates more jobs for union workers. Teaching lesson in ten languages means at least ten more union jobs. Instead of generic teachers, the teachers become more specialized, in an attempt to create more jobs. The result is you can start with a better trained teacher force, but end up with worse scores, due to rules that have little to do with education and students needs.

In my case, the best interests of the engineers were often secondary, even though the engineer was at the top of the local chain of command, and he was the source of the funny money that flows to the skilled union development workers and justifies their jobs. It would still work, but not optimized.

In private schools, the students are considered the top of the food chain. Without unions driving the needs of job creation and maintenance, lessor trained teachers , with a more efficient old fashion system that allows the overlap duties and moving around, can better serve this end. This result in better test scores. In public schools a teacher who is not doing their job cannot be fired since students come last behind unions.

The main problem us funding. Rant notwithstanding.

 

[Audie]

That's weird. Did not know that about the US education system.


There's good and bad types of oversight. Not just more or less.

Finland has about the best, doesnt it? Plz say so,
i like to idealize Finland.

 

[pearl]

In private schools, the students are considered the top of the food chain.

And there's good reason for that. Public school students do not have to pass an entrance exam, as they are required to educate every child until the age of 16. Private schools, especially Catholic are more apt to stress building character with students expected to own a sense of responsibility early on. A dress code assures that the students are competitive in academics only, not in who has the most expensive and 'in' sneakers etc., or half dressed or jeans barely above the crack.

 

[Jumi]

Finland has about the best, doesnt it? Plz say so,
i like to idealize Finland.

We're doing good and at least all politicians are promising to take back the education cuts. I just hope no one votes for the people again who wanted to scrap our education system and make it as bad as most everyone else's...

 

[Audie]

The main problem us funding. Rant notwithstanding.

I agree that funding is inadequate, but!

Misallocation of funds is even worse.
Referring to inappropriate, rather than
criminal, though there is a measure of that too.

 

[Vinayaka]

5th-grade class holds mock slave auction selling black students; authorities investigating

Former teacher here ... I've seen this done with eye colour, clothing style, etc. Usually done over two periods, where it's reversed second time around. Each group gets to have a turn at being advantaged and also disadvantaged. The ensuing discussion can bring out a lot of interesting ideas. Mock stuff is a pretty decent way of studying social behaviour. It's a better way than reading the pages of the book, and answering easy questions. But I think in this case, it was a poor choice by the individual.

 

[Twilight Hue]

The main problem us funding. Rant notwithstanding.

Its always funding.

New York's school spending is now 90% above the national average

And teachers here in New York are still complaining there's not enough funding.

It was 67 billion in 2016. That's Billion with a capital B.