The Trump voter's need for chaos

[Audie]

Caution:
This is the "Liberal Only" forum.
If one doesn't identify as such, one should refrain from posting here.

Howabout a more or less neutral non citizen observicator???

 

[Shadow Wolf]

As it happens, there is now an overwhelming weight of scienttific evidence that the core Trump supporter is typically a racist and motivated by his or her racim to support Trump. That was not something I myself expected. I thought they were mostly people who had been economically disadvantaged by the policies of the elites on both sides of the aisle over the past 40 years. But I was wrong. It's racism, not economics, that drives the majority of Trump's core supporters. Pretty ugly people, really. "Deplorables", as Clinton quite accurately called them.

In reference to the OP, yeah, I can see why racists would want to sow chaos and undermine American democracy.

Another alarming trend they found was overall Trump support during the 2016 election overlaps with problem areas in the opiate epidemic. I'd also hesitate to use "racism," not because of the percieved "baited language" of it, but because Trump supporters often don't like Muslims. The poor ones hate the wealthy, the wealthy ones loathe the poor. It seems to me xenophobia better encompasses what they are, because they detest the other and outsider, be it religion, home land, race, or socio-economic status. It even covers the blatant misogyny of many of them.

 

[sooda]

Opinion | The Trump Voters Whose ‘Need for Chaos’ Obliterates Everything Else

It perfectly explains the behavior of so many forum conservatives.

Call Sign Chaos is a memoir of a life of warfighting and lifelong learning, following along as Mattis rises from Marine recruit to four-star general. It is a journey about learning to lead and a story about how he, through constant study and action, developed a unique leadership philosophy, one relevant to us all.

Call Sign Chaos - Random House Books
www.randomhousebooks.com/campaign/call-sign-chaos/

 

[Audie]

Another alarming trend they found was overall Trump support during the 2016 election overlaps with problem areas in the opiate epidemic. I'd also hesitate to use "racism," not because of the percieved "baited language" of it, but because Trump supporters often don't like Muslims. The poor ones hate the wealthy, the wealthy ones loathe the poor. It seems to me xenophobia better encompasses what they are, because they detest the other and outsider, be it religion, home land, race, or socio-economic status. It even covers the blatant misogyny of many of them.

If you make that "the other half of the country"

In bold sure describes the left

 

[sun rise]

Today's "conservatives" are reactionaries.

I think 'reactionary' is the proper word in the literal sense: people reacting negatively to what is going on.

The world is changing rapidly in many different ways: The USA is becoming majority minority, women are making great strides toward equality and overall the stability of the 1950s where blacks "knew their place", women were in the role of Kinder, Küche, Kirche (children, kitchen, church) and the white male was the head of the family have all vanished. The great polarity of good (USA) vs evil (Soviet Union/Communist China) has almost vanished. Back in the 50's, America was a de facto Christian nation with Jews subject to some discrimination (they can't join the country club) and others tiny minorities who are ignored. And then there's climate change. And I've really only gotten started on what is changing.

Some react to this change positively and some do not. The positive reaction can be whole-hearted or grudging. Some react with fear which leads to anger and a rejection of modernity and an attempt to reverse the change.

We see this not only in the US but overseas with the growth of reactionary Islam, ethnic violence, religious hatred even by Buddhists and coming into power of reactionary governments some of which are populist.

The past is dead. It's up to those who understand this to help the future take birth in whatever positive way motivates them.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

If you make that "the other half of the country"

In bold sure describes the left

How cute a comment about a very specific trend and correlations between a certain group and other factors gets "refutted" by a sweeping generalization about a vague concept that includes people who's political ideologies often differ once you leave the core-and-traditional-most definition of Left and Right.
So, do keep lumping together the bulk majority of the Left is capable of getting along with others and minds "polite company" manners with those who are easily melted Snow White Liberals (who themselves are often at least comfortably middle-class on up, and are typically "plain Jane" white). Sort of like how the Tea Party organized the most reactionary and dumb of the Right and turned them into loudest group on the Right.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

The past is dead. It's up to those who understand this to help the future take birth in whatever positive way motivates them.

So true it deserves attention.

 

[Audie]

How cute a comment about a very specific trend and correlations between a certain group and other factors gets "refutted" by a sweeping generalization about a vague concept that includes people who's political ideologies often differ once you leave the core-and-traditional-most definition of Left and Right.
So, do keep lumping together the bulk majority of the Left is capable of getting along with others and minds "polite company" manners with those who are easily melted Snow White Liberals (who themselves are often at least comfortably middle-class on up, and are typically "plain Jane" white). Sort of like how the Tea Party organized the most reactionary and dumb of the Right and turned them into loudest group on the Right.

Whatever that is all about.

Who is trying to refute something?

 

[David1967]

That's actually a good point. There is no one on the Democratic side as bad as Trump.

To me, the question regarding the Democratic candidates is, which one has the best chance of actually beating Trump?

 

[David1967]

Why I'm giving the subject so much thought is because if I voted Dem, and I am, I'm actually going to vote for the Dem most likely to win. So if Biden becomes the person against Trump, I'll vote Biden.

As it stands at this moment anyway, I think Biden is the one who has the best chance of winning.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Whatever that is all about.

It's countering the discussion of trends and correlations between a specific group with a claim that an entire group of people that is so wide, broad, and diverse all acts about the same, specifically in regards to tolerance of the other. I could do that about the Right, but I don't, instead differing to specific claims, such as the KKK are racist, or there has been a trend uncovered between Trump support and opiate abuse, instead of denouncing the entire Right as racist druggies.

 

[David1967]

The very few people I have asked why they voted for
Trump said that they did so with no enthusiasm, but
saw Hillary as even worse.

This has been my observance as well for the most part. But I do know some very hardcore Trump supporters too.

 

[Enoch07]

As it happens, there is now an overwhelming weight of scienttific evidence that the core Trump supporter is typically a racist and motivated by his or her racim to support Trump. That was not something I myself expected.

Citation needed.

What scientific evidence?

 

[Revoltingest]

Howabout a more or less neutral non citizen observicator???

==== Notice ====
I'll wade in to help posters comply with the rules.
But as a mere "classical liberal", I'm allowed no
more than that in this forum.

 

[sooda]

So Mike and his team hop on Air Force Two twice each day for a 20 minute flight to the other side of the country at taxpayer expense. Every day - a new outrage and more self-dealing. It's PATHETIC .. Wake the hell up America!

• Vice President Mike Pence has elected to stay at President Donald Trump's golf resort in Doonbeg while visiting Ireland this week, despite having to fly more than 100 miles to attend meetings in Dublin.
• Pence flew from the west coast to the east coast of Ireland to meet with the Irish president and prime minister and various business leaders today. He's slated to fly back to stay a second night at Trump's resort.
• Pence's chief of staff told reporters the choice of accommodation was made at Trump's "suggestion," and Pence and his team won't stay for free.

Mike Pence is staying at a Trump resort in Ireland — despite it being more than 100 miles away from his meetings in Dublin | Markets Insider

Mike Pence is staying at a Trump resort in Ireland — even though it's more than 100 miles away from his meetings in Dublin | Markets Insider

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

As it happens, there is now an overwhelming weight of scienttific evidence that the core Trump supporter is typically a racist and motivated by his or her racim to support Trump. That was not something I myself expected. I thought they were mostly people who had been economically disadvantaged by the policies of the elites on both sides of the aisle over the past 40 years. But I was wrong. It's racism, not economics, that drives the majority of Trump's core supporters. Pretty ugly people, really. "Deplorables", as Clinton quite accurately called them.

In reference to the OP, yeah, I can see why racists would want to sow chaos and undermine American democracy.

I think racists are a large subset, a great many are tribalists who support trump because "he triggers the libs", even to their own detriment. That's not to say there isn't a great deal of cross over.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

So Mike and his team hop on Air Force Two twice each day for a 20 minute flight to the other side of the country at taxpayer expense. Every day - a new outrage and more self-dealing. It's PATHETIC .. Wake the hell up America! View attachment 32618

• Vice President Mike Pence has elected to stay at President Donald Trump's golf resort in Doonbeg while visiting Ireland this week, despite having to fly more than 100 miles to attend meetings in Dublin.
• Pence flew from the west coast to the east coast of Ireland to meet with the Irish president and prime minister and various business leaders today. He's slated to fly back to stay a second night at Trump's resort.
• Pence's chief of staff told reporters the choice of accommodation was made at Trump's "suggestion," and Pence and his team won't stay for free.

Mike Pence is staying at a Trump resort in Ireland — despite it being more than 100 miles away from his meetings in Dublin | Markets Insider

Mike Pence is staying at a Trump resort in Ireland — even though it's more than 100 miles away from his meetings in Dublin | Markets Insider

An arrangement trump personally profits from. How this isn't considered a blatant breach of the Emoluments clause is quite beyond me.

Remember who the tribal right wept tears of blood at the taxpayer expense of the Obamas holiday in Hawaii? Yet trump et al charge the taxpayer much more, much of which lines trumps personal pockets, and the same tribal right goes "meh". Pack of disgusting hypocrits.

 

[sooda]

An arrangement trump personally profits from. How this isn't considered a blatant breach of the Emoluments clause is quite beyond me.

Remember who the tribal right wept tears of blood at the taxpayer expense of the Obamas holiday in Hawaii? Yet trump et al charge the taxpayer much more, much of which lines trumps personal pockets, and the same tribal right goes "meh". Pack of disgusting hypocrits.

Yep.. everybody in Pence's entourage will be staying at Trump's property.

 

[PureX]

As it happens, there is now an overwhelming weight of scienttific evidence that the core Trump supporter is typically a racist and motivated by his or her racim to support Trump. That was not something I myself expected. I thought they were mostly people who had been economically disadvantaged by the policies of the elites on both sides of the aisle over the past 40 years. But I was wrong. It's racism, not economics, that drives the majority of Trump's core supporters. Pretty ugly people, really. "Deplorables", as Clinton quite accurately called them.

In reference to the OP, yeah, I can see why racists would want to sow chaos and undermine American democracy.

What may be overlooked, here, is that the increase in racism has been driven by the ongoing economic disenfranchisement that you expected to be the cause all along. As people see their 'American dream' vanishing before their eyes, they begin looking for an easy scapegoat to blame it on, and thereby an easy, violent means of correcting the problem. We Americans do LOVE to obliterate our problems (anthropomorphized into 'enemies') in massive shows of unequivocal violence. We're very 'nazi-like' in that way.

 

[PureX]

Why I'm giving the subject so much thought is because if I voted Dem, and I am, I'm actually going to vote for the Dem most likely to win. So if Biden becomes the person against Trump, I'll vote Biden.

Keep in mind that for registered democrats, a primary vote is meaningless. It counts for nothing. The party will appoint who they want to run regardless of how democratic voters vote in the primary election. Democratic voters wanted Sanders last time, but the party ignored them. And I suspect they will ignore them again, this time, and run Biden, no matter who the democratic voters vote for.