There is more then enough evidence to prove God exists.

[TheGunShoj]

Well that, of course, is down to you not seeing through my eyes or yours have not been opened.

No…that's down to logic. Just because you have evidence that everything is connected in some way (I'm just giving the benefit of the doubt on that point) you don't jump to the conclusion that it was God. It has to be investigated and demonstrated. If you do that, it's an argument from ignorance. Everything is connected, don't have an answer for that, must be god.

 

[Serenity7855]

No…that's down to logic. Just because you have evidence that everything is connected in some way (I'm just giving the benefit of the doubt on that point) you don't jump to the conclusion that it was God. It has to be investigated and demonstrated. If you do that, it's an argument from ignorance. Everything is connected, don't have an answer for that, must be god.

That is not really how you think it is, is it? You think that Christians see a gap and automatically fill it with God? That is naive and quite absurd, especially coming from a one time self confessed devout Christian. You have to ask God, the eternal father, in the name of Jesus Christ, through the power of the Holy Ghost, and by the power of the Holy Ghost you can know the truth of all things. Christians also need evidence before they believe. How gullible do you think we are?

James 1

5 If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.

 

[ScuzManiac]

That is not really how you think it is, is it? You think that Christians see a gap and automatically fill it with God? That is naive and quite absurd, especially coming from a one time self confessed devout Christian. You have to ask God, the eternal father, in the name of Jesus Christ, through the power of the Holy Ghost, and by the power of the Holy Ghost you can know the truth of all things. Christians also need evidence before they believe. How gullible do you think we are?

James 1

5 If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.

In all fairness...

That's a pretty broad statement.

I think it's safe to say that most Christians were taught at an early age...

And I've been to many churches in my life. My great grandmother won the "Woman of the Year" award in the late 90s from the state of Virginia as she never missed a Sunday or Wednesday at her church for over 30 years (and once she retired, she worked 40 hours per week for nearly a decade at the church's thrift shop for free). In my experience with Christianity, most Christians were taught (or fed depending on how you look at it) to just believe with little or no evidence.

Sure, they may explore evidence at a later age and begin to ask questions but most people that were born into Christianity and taught its concepts at a young age, never leave Christianity. Do you think that's a fair statement?

In other words, most Christians believe first and look for evidence later (if they ever do).

 

[Serenity7855]

In all fairness...

That's a pretty broad statement.

I am pretty broad minded

I think it's safe to say that most Christians were taught at an early age...

I don't know if that is true but I was not taught at an early age, I needed evidence.

And I've been to many churches in my life. My great grandmother won the "Woman of the Year" award in the late 90s from the state of Virginia as she never missed a Sunday or Wednesday at her church for over 30 years (and once she retired, she worked 40 hours per week for nearly a decade at the church's thrift shop for free). In my experience with Christianity, most Christians were taught (or fed depending on how you look at it) to just believe with little or no evidence.

But that is all meaningless. Churches and denominations are a complete farce. They mean nothing. It is nice to hear that your great grandmother won the "woman of the year" award, but what does that mean in reality? That she had a lot of free Sunday's, that she is a Christian just because she attends church. I haven't attended a church, regularly, for at least 10 years. Am I not a Christian? Show me where in scriptures we are told to organise churches and then select men we think are inspired to interpret and teach from Gods Holy Scriptures. I can show you where Jesus Christ's said that his church will be where two or three are gathered in his name there will He be also. He walked the earth he did not preach from an alter in the usual regalia designed by man. If you think that the teachings of Man, in a gold filled chapel, with insense and strangely clad attire, then we will have to disagree. I am a Christian because I received personal revelation testifying to my very being that God lives and that we are here to be tried and tested in the flesh. I needed that evidence before I would put one foot into the baptismal font. I do not believe anything that I am told without evidence. I never have. Religion is personal, it is no one else business but the believer. In my everyday life I never you will never hear me talk about my personal relationship with God, through his spirit. I only speak about it on forums like this, or if someone asks me and genuinely want to know. I cannot give you what I have, only you can get that, and it ain't easy. You have to really want it and tune your mind to the powers of heaven. A lot of words but a lot to say, and more.

Sure, they may explore evidence at a later age and begin to ask questions but most people that were born into Christianity and taught its concepts at a young age, never leave Christianity. Do you think that's a fair statement?

I guess that I am different. I had to have it before I would commit myself for a second time. I spent 25 years riding on other people's waves, I was not about to do it again.

Yes, I think it is a fair statement. I also think it is brain washing. It is mindless. I do not know how these people remain active based on someone else's words. Probably fear of what their pastor tell them will happen to them if they leave. Christ said that only a handful of his elect would recognise the masters voice and gain access into the kingdom of God. Can you not see how that will pan out with so many congregations being taught the false doctrines of mam.

In other words, most Christians believe first and look for evidence later (if they ever do).

Sorry, I do not know how true that is.

 

[abinormal]

... So why is it that Atheists have such leverage in our society to preach their counterfeit arguments.

OIC, so you believe someone like you should be the only one to have the leverage to preach.

And..if someone else dare to have a different theory, opinion, belief, you call "theirs" counterfeit.

Anybody? What's wrong with this picture?

 

[abinormal]

In all fairness...

That's a pretty broad statement.

I think it's safe to say that most Christians were taught at an early age...

And I've been to many churches in my life. My great grandmother won the "Woman of the Year" award in the late 90s from the state of Virginia as she never missed a Sunday or Wednesday at her church for over 30 years (and once she retired, she worked 40 hours per week for nearly a decade at the church's thrift shop for free). In my experience with Christianity, most Christians were taught (or fed depending on how you look at it) to just believe with little or no evidence.

Sure, they may explore evidence at a later age and begin to ask questions but most people that were born into Christianity and taught its concepts at a young age, never leave Christianity. Do you think that's a fair statement?

In other words, most Christians believe first and look for evidence later (if they ever do).

I respect your reply, and believe it to be true, as it was my experience. I lost my faith, I say it that way because it's the easiest and best way to describe it. I had faith for 28 years, I was a born-again believer, or that is what I believed Then, I started reading the bible, word for word, for myself. Before that I only listened to what others taught me.

I honestly can't tell you, or explain the experience, but I know many christians, maybe all, would say that god took his holy spirit from me. That is what I read about in the bible, and was also taught that could happen. I simply feel indifference to the bible, jesus, god now. I don't feel anything, not anger, maybe surprise if I think about how involved I was. How much I believed, it was my life. Sorry to wander off topic.

Again, I just wanted you to know I liked what you had to say, and how you said it. It was because of christians like you that I first came around to it, it sure wasn't because of self-righteous know-it-alls that didn't show me anything I ever wanted to be like. Denise

 

[abinormal]

That is not really how you think it is, is it? You think that Christians see a gap and automatically fill it with God? That is naive and quite absurd, especially coming from a one time self confessed devout Christian. You have to ask God, the eternal father, in the name of Jesus Christ, through the power of the Holy Ghost, and by the power of the Holy Ghost you can know the truth of all things. Christians also need evidence before they believe. How gullible do you think we are?

James 1

5 If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.

That nails it pretty good for me, there was a gap, and people/christians that happened to be in my life said it was a god-shaped gap and needed to be filled and could only be filled by him (their words). In Israel when jesus came along people were desperate for something, someone. The bible even talks about how they were let down when they found out jesus didn't come to "physically" kick their enemies ***.

Naive and absurd better fits your idea it "isn't" possible imo.

 

[abinormal]

No…that's down to logic. Just because you have evidence that everything is connected in some way (I'm just giving the benefit of the doubt on that point) you don't jump to the conclusion that it was God. It has to be investigated and demonstrated. If you do that, it's an argument from ignorance. Everything is connected, don't have an answer for that, must be god.

It was the lack of answers from "christians", the bible, and a so-called god that turned me from christianity. If god "is" it/he/she will have to show up to get me to ever believe, it sure won't be obnoxious "christian" know-it-alls (that love spouting the rest are going to hell).

 

[Serenity7855]

I respect your reply, and believe it to be true, as it was my experience. I lost my faith, I say it that way because it's the easiest and best way to describe it. I had faith for 28 years, I was a born-again believer, or that is what I believed Then, I started reading the bible, word for word, for myself. Before that I only listened to what others taught me.

Born again Christians have done more to thwart Gods plan of salvation then any other religions on the face of the earth. You cannot loose faith, you gave it up for something else or you never had it in the first place. Those that have been truly converted can never go back to what they were. It is impossible.

I honestly can't tell you, or explain the experience, but I know many christians, maybe all, would say that god took his holy spirit from me. That is what I read about in the bible, and was also taught that could happen. I simply feel indifference to the bible, jesus, god now. I don't feel anything, not anger, maybe surprise if I think about how involved I was. How much I believed, it was my life. Sorry to wander off topic.

That is not the way the Holy Ghost works. He is an influence. His influence fill the emmensity of space. There is no place where it is not. God did not take it away, you must have either pushed him away or you never had him in the first place. If you are worthy then the door is unlocked and you receive his companionship. If you are a unrepentant sinner them it is you who was away from him. He will never walk away from you. Sorry, but this has all been given to us in the Scriptures.

Again, I just wanted you to know I liked what you had to say, and how you said it. It was because of christians like you that I first came around to it, it sure wasn't because of self-righteous know-it-alls that didn't show me anything I ever wanted to be like. Denise

You have free agency, you make your own choices. You are the only one that can be at fault. If you allow others to mislead you and allow self righteous individual to teach you false doctrine then it is your fault for allowing it to happen. You cannot blame anybody else. Choose the Right.

 

[LuisDantas]

No, no, TheGunShoj is none of these. He just does not see the same things that I see. That does not make him wrong, mistaken or delusional.

Is that your usual level of attention to what is told to you?

That would explain a lot.

 

[Serenity7855]

That nails it pretty good for me, there was a gap, and people/christians that happened to be in my life said it was a god-shaped gap and needed to be filled and could only be filled by him (their words). In Israel when jesus came along people were desperate for something, someone. The bible even talks about how they were let down when they found out jesus didn't come to "physically" kick their enemies ***.

Naive and absurd better fits your idea it "isn't" possible imo.

But you listened to them. Didn't you think for a second that they might be wrong. Did you just take their word for it without doing your own investigations first. If someone asked you to jump in a river full of crocodiles, would you do it without question, no, of course you wouldn't, so why did you believe in something that you did not know existed. You have to take ownership of your own actions and stop blaming others for your decisions. You have yet to be converted.

 

[abinormal]

But you listened to them. Didn't you think for a second that they might be wrong. Did you just take their word for it without doing your own investigations first. If someone asked you to jump in a river full of crocodiles, would you do it without question, no, of course you wouldn't, so why did you believe in something that you did not know existed. You have to take ownership of your own actions and stop blaming others for your decisions. You have yet to be converted.

Do you have any idea how many "christians" never read the bible for themselves, and yes, jump right in. I'm sure that wasn't you though, I'm sure you read the bible, and made your intellectual decision. But most "christians" are taught it can't be an intellectual decision, or mental, only spiritual. That is what the bible teaches. Maybe I should ask here what the heck is your "religion".

 

[Serenity7855]

It was the lack of answers from "christians", the bible, and a so-called god that turned me from christianity. If god "is" it/he/she will have to show up to get me to ever believe, it sure won't be obnoxious "christian" know-it-alls (that love spouting the rest are going to hell).

No it wasn't. I can answer any question you have about Christianity but what good would it be to you if you have not been converted. Until you receive the Holy Ghost you will never know any of his mysteries. There is no such place as hell. Besides, your last sentence suggests that you are still angry with Christians because you decided to listen to them.

 

[abinormal]

Just to keep the record straight as well, I don't hold it against the people that are led astray themselves. Yes, they did teach me what they believed, but no, I don't blame them in the way you are accusing me of. I am also very willing to take responsibility for my actions, in fact, I am mad at myself for falling for it without reading what the bible says.

I know there isn't much sense in trying to tell you anything because I recognize the "symptoms" of your delusion, I lived it.

 

[abinormal]

No it wasn't. I can answer any question you have about Christianity but what good would it be to you if you have not been converted. Until you receive the Holy Ghost you will never know any of his mysteries. There is no such place as hell. Besides, your last sentence suggests that you are still angry with Christians because you decided to listen to them.

Hey, it's apparent you've cornered the market on "an answer for everything" I wouldn't argue that. The truth, you may be a bit shy on. No one knows for sure, the best any of us have is a belief, or lack thereof.

 

[Serenity7855]

Do you have any idea how many "christians" never read the bible for themselves, and yes, jump right in. I'm sure that wasn't you though, I'm sure you read the bible, and made your intellectual decision. But most "christians" are taught it can't be an intellectual decision, or mental, only spiritual. That is what the bible teaches. Maybe I should ask here what the heck is your "religion".

But the choice is still theirs, and yours. You make the decision, you stand accountable for that decision, you reap the consequences. If you want to believe that God does not want you to read the words that he compiled for you then you must accept your mistake and put it right. It is spiritual. It is your spirit communicating with the spirit of God. It is as real as anything that you do, but that nobody will believe. You have to be converted by the spirit of God otherwise you will be living a lie.

I am a Christian. I strive to follow the teachings of Jesus Christ continuously.

James 1:5-6

5 If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.

6 But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed.


3 Behold, I would exhort you that when ye shall read these things, if it be wisdom in God that ye should read them, that ye would remember how merciful the Lord hath been unto the children of men, from the creation of Adam even down until the time that ye shall receive these things, and ponder it in your hearts.

4 And when ye shall receive these things, I would exhort you that ye would ask God, the Eternal Father, in the name of Christ, if these things are not true; and if ye shall ask with a sincere heart, with real intent, having faith in Christ, he will manifest the truth of it unto you, by the power of the Holy Ghost.

5 And by the power of the Holy Ghost ye may know the btruth of all things.

 

[Serenity7855]

Just to keep the record straight as well, I don't hold it against the people that are led astray themselves. Yes, they did teach me what they believed, but no, I don't blame them in the way you are accusing me of. I am also very willing to take responsibility for my actions, in fact, I am mad at myself for falling for it without reading what the bible says.

I know there isn't much sense in trying to tell you anything because I recognize the "symptoms" of your delusion, I lived it.

I have no delusions, that you needed to offend me, by saying that, only makes it more obvious that you are still angry. Whether you are angry with yourself, for being suckered in, or you are angry with me, for pointing out the truth, matters not, you are angry, but anger is no excuse for being odious and vitriolic.

 

[Serenity7855]

Hey, it's apparent you've cornered the market on "an answer for everything" I wouldn't argue that. The truth, you may be a bit shy on. No one knows for sure, the best any of us have is a belief, or lack thereof.

The Theory of evolution is accepted as a fact but called a theory

Faith in God is accepted as a reality but it is called a faith.

Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

I am sorry that you think that I am a "know it all" I just know somethings and what I don't know the Holy Ghost tells me.

 

[abinormal]

But the choice is still theirs, and yours. You make the decision, you stand accountable for that decision, you reap the consequences. If you want to believe that God does not want you to read the words that he compiled for you then you must accept your mistake and put it right. It is spiritual. It is your spirit communicating with the spirit of God. It is as real as anything that you do, but that nobody will believe. You have to be converted by the spirit of God otherwise you will be living a lie.

I am a Christian. I strive to follow the teachings of Jesus Christ continuously.

James 1:5-6

5 If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.

6 But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed.


3 Behold, I would exhort you that when ye shall read these things, if it be wisdom in God that ye should read them, that ye would remember how merciful the Lord hath been unto the children of men, from the creation of Adam even down until the time that ye shall receive these things, and ponder it in your hearts.

4 And when ye shall receive these things, I would exhort you that ye would ask God, the Eternal Father, in the name of Christ, if these things are not true; and if ye shall ask with a sincere heart, with real intent, having faith in Christ, he will manifest the truth of it unto you, by the power of the Holy Ghost.

5 And by the power of the Holy Ghost ye may know the btruth of all things.

As far as I know, jesus did not waste time with people who weren't open to his teachings, of course he had only 3 years, I don't know how much time you have on your hands. Do you want to bring people to christ, or do you just have a need to be right in what you believe? That's a tough one to answer honestly, so you might want to think about it.

 

[outhouse]

Until you receive the Holy Ghost you will never know any of his mysteries


.

Dude come on. There are no mysteries to be learned from ones imagination in that context.


When people talk to you, its not a mental illness sign until you start talking back.


Are you talking back?