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There is more then enough evidence to prove God exists.

Serenity7855

Lambaster of the Angry Anti-Theists
Are you seriously saying this after constantly, and repeatedly, telling me nature transcends God and God was helpless to stop it.

Do you even follow what you write at this point?

Look man, I don't want to be harsh, but can you tell me openly if you have some psychiatric disorder or some form of dementia. This isn't meant to be rude, but I before I continue I need this information.

If you go back over your post you will see that it was you who said that nature transcends God. I said that God can only do that which can be done once and I said that he can only know what can be known twice so where is the constantly and repeatedly. Are you reading things that are not there and then asking how mentally stable I am. Can you not understand that there are things that a God cannot know because they are unknowable and cannot do because they are not doable. How can God transcend the natural laws he created?
 
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Serenity7855

Lambaster of the Angry Anti-Theists
Excuse me. In post #1487 you said that God was incapable of murder

Obviously murder can be done. We mere mortals have been doing it for years

Still waiting on your evidence

God is physically incapable of the act of murder. He would cease to exist, unless, of course, the murder is righteous and I cannot think of a situation where it would be righteous.
 

Bunyip

pro scapegoat
God is physically incapable of the act of murder. He would cease to exist, unless, of course, the murder is righteous and I cannot think of a situation where it would be righteous.

Where do you get these ideas from? They do not even relate to Christian theology, so is this your own religion you are arguing for?
 

Blackdog22

Well-Known Member
If you go back over your post you will see that it was you who said that nature transcends God. I said that God can only do that which can be done once and I said that he can only know what can be known twice so where is the constantly and repeatedly. Are you reading things that are not there and then asking how mentally stable I am.

You clearly wrote that the flood was nature taking its course. You then said that God could do nothing to stop it. You are saying that God can't stop water...water.. You then argue he can do anything, after you literally just said he can't stop water.

Apparently he couldn't help but kill everyone in Sodom and Gomorrah either, except he didn't kill them, because nature, and God can't stop nature, but he can do anything. Do you see how nonsensical this is? That is why I am asking about your mental state because this makes zero sense. Almost nothing you say seems to flow from one post to the other and I really don't want to get into it deep before knowing if you are stable or not. Just answer the question.

Can you not understand that there are things that a God cannot know because they are unknowable and cannot do because they are not doable. How can God transcend the natural laws he created?

I don't even know what these laws are you are speaking of. You are saying God is bound by gravity? Is this what you mean? I have no idea what you are talking about. How can God know everything and at the same time not. What exactly is something God can't know. I can't think of any reason why there would be something unknowable to someone who knows all.

He is God, he can do anything, as you literally just stated
 

ScuzManiac

Active Member
God is physically incapable of the act of murder. He would cease to exist, unless, of course, the murder is righteous and I cannot think of a situation where it would be righteous.

Except for the fact that your God has killed countless amounts of people.

Some for simply not doing as he asked.

:facepalm:
 
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Serenity7855

Lambaster of the Angry Anti-Theists
You clearly wrote that the flood was nature taking its course. You then said that God could do nothing to stop it. You are saying that God can't stop water...water.. You then argue he can do anything, after you literally just said he can't stop water.

If nothing else I am consistent in my beliefs. If you look at my arguments with outhouse you will see that he tried to trap me on what I believe the flood was. For the most part I said that I did not know, it either happened or it was allergenic. I then said that if it happened then it would be a supernatural event as there is no archaeological evidence that there had been a flood at tat time. So, I did not say it was nature taking care of business because I know that nature was not involved. So I did not say that God cannot stop water, you did, what I said was that when people become that wicked then the consequences are predetermined and good is helpless in stopping those consequences. You are not reading for comprehension.

Apparently he couldn't help but kill everyone in Sodom and Gomorrah either, except he didn't kill them, because nature, and God can't stop nature, but he can do anything. Do you see how nonsensical this is?

It is physically impossible for God to kill anyone, unless the killing was a righteous act. That is something that is impossible for him to do. It would make the perfect plan of salvation imperfect and a God would cease to exist. Neither of those are an option as we know God exists and that the plan of salvation is a perfect plan. God can do anything that can be done, one of those things that cannot be done, is for him to sin, therefore, he cannot kill.


That is why I am asking about your mental state because this makes zero sense. Almost nothing you say seems to flow from one post to the other and I really don't want to get into it deep before knowing if you are stable or not. Just answer the question.

Part of my reasoning for being here is because I enjoy having my faith challenged. It causes me to examine my own faith and look for answers to questions I have not asked myself. This is the process I am undergoing here, which is why I called it anecdotal. You label that inquisitiveness as being mentally challenged. I am feeling my way through a situation that has no historical or physical evidence and looking for answers that fit in with the known characteristics and existence of God. If you feel that that is mental instability then please do not converse with me.

I don't even know what these laws are you are speaking of. You are saying God is bound by gravity? Is this what you mean? I have no idea what you are talking about. How can God know everything and at the same time not. What exactly is something God can't know. I can't think of any reason why there would be something unknowable to someone who knows all.

Well that is not the definition of omniscient. Wiki clearly states that omniscient is the knowledge of everything that can be known. That suggests that there are things that cannot be known. For example, we know for a certainty that the universe expanded at the point of the big bang into a universe at a speed that is faster then the speed of light. What we do not know is how that happened.

He is God, he can do anything, as you literally just stated

His is a God, that is true, and anything that can be known, he knows, and anything that can be done he can do. I do not know why you cannot conceptualise this.


Edited to correct spelling mistakes.
 
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Serenity7855

Lambaster of the Angry Anti-Theists
because it is possible to murder, yet you claim your god cannot murder.

If you read this for comprehension you would know exactly what I am saying. It is possible for some of us to murder, it is not possible for God to murder. He cannot sin.

Right back at you.

Well, it was not intended for you so how can it be right back at me from you?
 

ScuzManiac

Active Member
If you read this for comprehension you would know exactly what I am saying. It is possible for some of us to murder, it is not possible for God to murder. He cannot sin.



Well, it was not intended for you so how can it be right back at me from you?

But God has murdered.

And who decides if it is righteous or not? You or God?
 

starlite

Texasgirl
Can you not understand that there are things that a God cannot know because they are unknowable and cannot do because they are not doable.

I believe God to be omniscient as defined in a prominent dictionary: knowing everything : having unlimited understanding or knowledge. Selective foreknowledge means that God could choose not to foreknow all the future acts of his creatures. For example....God spoke of ‘becoming acquainted with Abraham,’ and after Abraham went to the point of attempting to sacrifice Isaac, Jehovah said, “For now I do know that you are God-fearing in that you have not withheld your son, your only one, from me.”

The apostle Peter writes: “Jehovah is not slow respecting his promise [of the coming day of reckoning], as some people consider slowness, but he is patient with you because he does not desire any to be destroyed but desires all to attain to repentance.” If God already foreknew and foreordained millenniums in advance precisely which individuals would receive eternal salvation and which individuals would receive eternal destruction, we could ask...how meaningful such ‘patience’ of God could be and how genuine his desire could be that ‘all attain to repentance.’

And consider this... if, by God’s foreknowledge, the opportunity to receive the benefits of Christ Jesus’ ransom sacrifice were already sealed off from some, perhaps for millions of individuals, even before their birth, so that such ones could never prove worthy, it could not be said that the ransom was made available to all men.
 

ScuzManiac

Active Member
God can do anything that can be done.

Makes perfect sense to me.

After all, it IS God.

..there are things that a God cannot know because they are unknowable and cannot do because they are not doable.

Wait, what?

You mean, the same God that made everything in 7 days has limits?

This is the first time I've ever heard that.

Got a source or scriptural reference to that statement?

And are you stating that there is more than one God?
 

Serenity7855

Lambaster of the Angry Anti-Theists
But God has murdered.

And who decides if it is righteous or not? You or God?

No, God never murders. If ever a people become wicked, to the degree that they did in Sodom and Gomorrah, and need to be euthanased, then it will be a destroying angel that removes them or it will be a supernatural event it will never be at the hand of God. God cannot sin. But maybe this is not murder. That when a people become that wicked it is a blessing for them to be euthanased. Have you ever considered that.
 

Serenity7855

Lambaster of the Angry Anti-Theists
Where do you get these ideas from? They do not even relate to Christian theology, so is this your own religion you are arguing for?

It does not relate to Christian theology that the condition within the garden of Eden were perfect? Adam and Eve stood in perfection not knowing good from evil. Everything that lived in the garden of Eden was in a state of perfection and God walked in the garden and conversed with Adam and Eve because all was perfect and able to coexists with each other. Then Eve fell pray to the Serpent, Satan, and she ate the fruit of the tree of good and evil. Instantly she fell into a state of imperfection and when Adam saw her he could see what she had done. If Adam were to obey God and multiply the earth he had to eat of the fruit as well and both of them noticed their nakedness and we're ashamed. When God called to them they hid themselves because of what they had done. God spoke to them, he did not appear to them. He could not because they had both entered into mortality and perfect beings could no longer mix with them. They were expelled from the garden to where they would have to feigned for themselves in the lone and dreary world. That may be a allegorical story, however, the sentiments are true. Man separated himself from God. The only way that we will be reunited is if we can claim eternal life. That is Christian doctrine that can be found in every Christian Bible. Unless you have knowledge of these things you should not judge the whole idea of Christianity. This is a short account of the fall of mankind. What a lot of Christians do not believe is that God gave Adam and Eve two Commandments. One was to not partake of the tree of knowledge and the other was to multiply and replenish the earth. One was not possible without breaking the other. If she did not eat from the tree of knowledge she and Adam would not know how to procreate. They would have remained in a state of perfection forever. That breaks the second commandment, to multiply and replenish the earth. Mankind had to fall so that mankind could be. The fall is a necessary part of the plan of salvation. Unfortunately, when man fell we were cut off from God as no unclean thing can dwell in his presence and live. We then entered into a period of trails and temptation with Satan being allowed to test us in the flesh. If we pass that test we will be reunited with God.

I am a Christian, I follow the teachings of Jesus Christ. I follow no congregation.
 
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Serenity7855

Lambaster of the Angry Anti-Theists
Makes perfect sense to me.

After all, it IS God.

Glad we agree.

Wait, what?

You mean, the same God that made everything in 7 days has limits?

You will also be surprised to hear then that God made the earth in six periods of time. It was not a 24 hour day.

Yes, God has limits. He always has been portrayed as a God with constraints. One such constraint is that he cannot sin. As soon as he sins he would become like Adam and Eve, a fallen God.

This is the first time I've ever heard that.

That is probably because you belonged to a main stream religion that does not preach the whole truth.

Got a source or scriptural reference to that statement?

Yes, the entire story of the fall of mankind.

And are you stating that there is more than one God?

I have no reason to believe that there is anymore then one God but I do not see the relevance of the question.
 
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ScuzManiac

Active Member
Glad we agree.



You will also be surprised to hear then that God made the earth in six periods of time. It was not a 24 hour day.

Yes, God has limits. He always has been portrayed as a God with constraints. One such constraint is that he cannot sin. As soon as he sins he would become like Adam and Eve, a fallen God.



That is probably because you belonged to a main stream religion that does not preach the whole truth.



Yes, the entire story of the fall of mankind.



I have no reason to believe that there is anymore then one God but I do not see the relevance of the question.

1. Common belief is that God DID in fact create everything as we know it in 7 days (with the 7th day being a resting day). The only evidence you have of this is the fact that "day" CAN mean several things but that doesn't mean it does.

2. Says who? Got a scriptural reference for that?

3. I've never belonged to any religion much less Christianity. I'm just someone who finds mythology and religion (kind of the same thing) to be enjoyable.

4. The story of the fall of mankind? Um....

5. The relevance of the question was that you said:

"..there are things that a God cannot know because they are unknowable and cannot do because they are not doable."

You didn't say THE God, you said A god.

But even if you didn't mean to, I agree. Man has made many, many, many gods.
 

Bunyip

pro scapegoat
It does not relate to Christian theology that the condition within the garden of Eden were perfect? Adam and Eve stood in perfection not knowing good from evil. Everything that lived in the garden of Eden was in a state of perfection and God walked in the garden and conversed with Adam and Eve because all was perfect and able to coexists with each other. Then Eve fell pray to the Serpent, Satan, and she ate the fruit of the tree of good and evil. Instantly she fell into a state of imperfection and when Adam saw her he could see what she had done. If Adam were to obey God and multiply the earth he had to eat of the fruit as well and both of them noticed their nakedness and we're ashamed. When God called to them they hid themselves because of what they had done. God spoke to them, he did not appear to them. He could not because they had both entered into mortality and perfect beings could no longer mix with them. They were expelled from the garden to where they would have to feigned for themselves in the lone and dreary world. That may be a allegorical story, however, the sentiments are true. Man separated himself from God. The only way that we will be reunited is if we can claim eternal life. That is Christian doctrine that can be found in every Christian Bible. Unless you have knowledge of these things you should not judge the whole idea of Christianity. This is a short account of the fall of mankind. What a lot of Christians do not believe is that God gave Adam and Eve two Commandments. One was to not partake of the tree of knowledge and the other was to multiply and replenish the earth. One was not possible without breaking the other. If she did not eat from the tree of knowledge she and Adam would not know how to procreate. They would have remained in a state of perfection forever. That breaks the second commandment, to multiply and replenish the earth. Mankind had to fall so that mankind could be. The fall is a necessary part of the plan of salvation. Unfortunately, when man fell we were cut off from God as no unclean thing can dwell in his presence and live. We then entered into a period of trails and temptation with Satan being allowed to test us in the flesh. If we pass that test we will be reunited with God.

I am a Christian, I follow the teachings of Jesus Christ. I follow no congregation.

Wow. My poor friend, you appear to have gone off on yet another unrelated tangent.
 
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