To Christians: When is Christ Returning?

[loverofhumanity]

If the second coming of Christ happened a long time ago where is the Millennial Kingdom of peace He promised where the lion lays down with the lamb and weapons are turned into plows?

It’s unfolding as we speak. The Bible nowhere says the Kingdom would be established instantly. People of different cultures, religions, races and nations are gradually coming together. Signs of this are multi cultural nations and things like interfaith. You can’t get anymore wolf and lamb than the hate between religions but they are learning to live in peace. This is happening and is the fulfilment of prophecy.

The oneness and equality of all humans be they wolf or sheep, (antagonistic sects, races and nations) is being extolled and acknowledged all over the world by such things as the universal declaration of human rights. There are so many signs that this prophecy is being fulfilled right now that it’s impossible to miss.

 

[loverofhumanity]

If Jesus didn't know, how on earth are you going to get an answer from the internet?

We know He’s returned because He returned. The ‘Hour’ that was hidden I believe has now passed and He has appeared. Once the event has occurred it is no longer a secret. Now I believe is the time the sheep are being separated from the goats.

The sheep know Him and hear His Voice

My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: John 10:27

But they who are following strangers Instead as in priests, ministers and Popes who are not the voice of Christ know not the Voice of Christ when He calls to them.

I follow naught but the Voice of Christ and knew His Voice when He returned but strangers such as those mentioned above knew Him not so did not respond to His Voice when He Spoke and led their followers astray I believe. That is the great sadness of our time I believe.

 

[PruePhillip]

We know He’s returned because He returned. The ‘Hour’ that was hidden I believe has now passed and He has appeared. Once the event has occurred it is no longer a secret. Now I believe is the time the sheep are being separated from the goats.

The sheep know Him and hear His Voice

My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: John 10:27

But they who are following strangers Instead as in priests, ministers and Popes who are not the voice of Christ know not the Voice of Christ when He calls to them.

I follow naught but the Voice of Christ and knew His Voice when He returned but strangers such as those mentioned above knew Him not so did not respond to His Voice when He Spoke and led their followers astray I believe. That is the great sadness of our time I believe.

Jesus made it clear that when He returns EVERYONE will know.
The charlatans who say that He has returned but is hidden are
on a fool's errand to find fools. On the long list you can add the
Adventists and Jehovah Witnesses who gave us a long list of
failed dates.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Jesus made it clear that when He returns EVERYONE will know.
The charlatans who say that He has returned but is hidden are
on a fool's errand to find fools. On the long list you can add the
Adventists and Jehovah Witnesses who gave us a long list of
failed dates.

Yes everyone will know. You are being told now. But so unfortunate and as in the days of Noah so shall the coming of the Son of Man be. Noah was rejected, scorned, mocked and laughed at just as we are being mocked and laughed now and when they turned away from Him a great calamity overtook them.

 

[PruePhillip]

Yes everyone will know. You are being told now. But so unfortunate and as in the days of Noah so shall the coming of the Son of Man be. Noah was rejected, scorned, mocked and laughed at just as we are being mocked and laughed now and when they turned away from Him a great calamity overtook them.

"As lightning from one side of heaven to the other..."
ALL will know, it won't just be a religious belief. Jesus
made it clear it won't be some "invisible kingdom" or
He is come back but is hiding in someone's closet.

 

[loverofhumanity]

"As lightning from one side of heaven to the other..."
ALL will know, it won't just be a religious belief. Jesus
made it clear it won't be some "invisible kingdom" or
He is come back but is hiding in someone's closet.

Matt 24:27

For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.


He shall come from the east and His influence will shine to the west.


Jeremiah 49:38

I will set my throne in Elam (Persia, Iran)

 

[74x12]

The Jews still maintain that He didn’t come the first time so if you think they are wrong then Christians today also might have read the signs wrong too and He could hsve already appeared which I believe He has but people weren’t watching.

I'd be more concerned with missing Jesus right now than His return. When Jesus returns it will probably be too late for anyone to make a decision. We don't believe He returned in secret or in the desert or anything like that. When Jesus returns every eye will see Him. There won't be any mistaking it. First though, the world will be tested and there will be false returns of Christ.

Matthew 24:26
Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.

Revelation 1:7
Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.

Acts 1:9-11
And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.
And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel;
Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

We even know He will appear on the mt of Olives at Jerusalem. There will be an earthquake. The mt. will split in half ...

Zechariah 14:4
And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

Finally when He returns it will be unveiled glory.

Matthew 16:27
For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

 

[74x12]

There is just one small detail you are overlooking... Jesus never promised to return to earth.
Jesus said His work was finished here, and He was no more in the world, and He was going to the Father.

John 17:4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.

John 17:11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.

Yes, His work in the flesh was finished. He was going to return to the Father as He promised. However, that doesn't mean He would never return ... In fact, He indicates He would return in Acts 1:6-7.

Acts 1:6-7
When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel? And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.

IN Matthew 24 when Jesus speaks of the return of the Son of man in the clouds; He is actually asnwering their question about his own return. Just check Matthew 24:3. His whole prophecy is in response to these questions.

• when shall these things be?
• what shall be the sign of thy(Jesus) coming?
• and the end of the age?

Matthew 24:3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

John 19:30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

There is not one single verse in the NT wherein Jesus promised to return.

Well, there is Acts 1 and you don't count Revelation?

• Revelation 3:11
• Revelation 22:7
• Revelation 22:12

Jesus saying we will see the Son of man in the clouds does not count because that is not Jesus saying He will return. It is Jesus saying what we will see.

More than once Jesus indicates He is the "Son of man". The history of this phrase "Son of man" should be understood in light prophecies predicting His coming at the time. For example the Son of man of the book of Daniel and also in the book of Enoch which would have been familiar to many Jews of the time. Which we see from the dead sea scrolls. To claim to be the Son of man was to claim to be the prophesied One. The Messiah and Son of God.

John 8:28
Then said Jesus unto them, When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things.

John 12
32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.
33 This he said, signifying what death he should die.
34 The people answered him, We have heard out of the law that Christ abideth for ever: and how sayest thou, The Son of man must be lifted up? who is this Son of man?
35 Then Jesus said unto them, Yet a little while is the light with you. Walk while ye have the light, lest darkness come upon you: for he that walketh in darkness knoweth not whither he goeth.
36 While ye have light, believe in the light, that ye may be the children of light. These things spake Jesus, and departed, and did hide himself from them.

 

[74x12]

The Jews still maintain that He didn’t come the first time

And one reason they don't believe is because Jesus didn't fulfill every prophecy the first time. Jews point out that Jesus left many prophecies of the Messiah undone. This is one reason we know He is coming again to fulfill the rest of the prophecies. Jews themselves believe in two Messiahs. Which they refer to as Son of Joseph and Son of David.

The Son of Joseph is a suffering Messiah (Jesus' first coming) and the Son of David a triumphant reigning King.

We believe that when Jesus returns being the prophesied "Son of David" it will be in the Light of the glory of God. As it is prophesied the "house of David" shall be as "God". (Zechariah 12:8)

 

[Trailblazer]

Yes you are correct in as much as Christ, the personality and body was never to return ever again, By Chrust saying He would go away and com back again refers to the Promised One to come after Him with the Kingdom of God.

Abdul-Baha explains what is actually meant by the Second Coming of Christ.

Know that the return of Christ for a second time doth not mean what the people believe, but, rather, signifieth the One promised to come after Him. He shall come with the Kingdom of God and His power which hath surrounded the world. This power (or reign) is in the world of hearts and spirits and not in that of matter (or bodies). For the material world is not comparable to a single wing of a fly, or rather less in the sight of thy Lord, wert thou of those who know! Verily Christ came with His Kingdom from the beginning which hath no beginning and will come with His Kingdom to the eternity of eternities, inasmuch as in this sense Christ is an expression of the divine reality, the simple essence and heavenly entity which hath no beginning or ending. It hath appearance, arising and manifestation and setting in each of the cycles.

Thee is not much I can say except how sad, how very sad, that millions of people worldwide are still waiting for the Second Coming, when it already happened over 150 years ago and all the prophecies were fulfilled....

What is even more sad is that Jesus never promised to return, not once in the entire NT.

Given my academic background is psychology it is obvious to me why they cannot fact the fact that the same Jesus who walked the earth 2000 years ago is never coming back in the same body. Christians have built up an entire belief system around the return of Christ, and if they accepted the fact that Jesus is not coming back, what would they have? Well, they would still have the NT and the wonderful teachings of Jesus, and they could still look forward to seeing Jesus in heaven, so why is it so important that Jesus returns to earth? Jesus never promised to build the Kingdom of God on earth, but Christians also believe this in spite of the fact that Jesus said that His Kingdom was not of this world.

John 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

John 18:37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.

Jesus came into this world to bear witness unto the truth about God. He did that so there is no reason for Jesus to ever return to this world.

How much more evidence do Christians need that proves that Jesus is not coming back? Sadly, it does not matter how much evidence you give them, they want Jesus and only Jesus, not another man with another name, and emotions rule.

 

[cataway]

Yes everyone will know. You are being told now. But so unfortunate and as in the days of Noah so shall the coming of the Son of Man be. Noah was rejected, scorned, mocked and laughed at just as we are being mocked and laughed now and when they turned away from Him a great calamity overtook them.

and just how would we know his pa·rou·siʹa has begun ? hummm could it be signs Jesus said to look out for ?

 

[MJFlores]

And what about those who don’t ‘watch’ ? Simple. They miss His Coming.

Revelation 1:7
“Look, he is coming with the clouds,” and “every eye will see him, even those who pierced him”; and all peoples on earth “will mourn because of him.” So shall it be! Amen.

According to the Bible, every eye will see him - and that includes those who pierced him.
Needless to say, those who pierced Jesus have long died, buried and turned to dust.
But according to the Bible, these people will see him coming with the clouds.
Everybody - you, me, those who do not believe, those who believe wrongly.
And all races on earth - will mourn

So I can see the scenario where the majority say He hasn’t come and a small minority who Did recognise Him are saying He has. Is this the separation of the sheep from the goats Jesus spoke of?

The parable of sheep and the goats are described in Matthew 25:31-46
The allegory say what will happen to those who are going to be saved and those who will not.

As long as we see this world as it is and life as we know it - we can deduce that we are living in the world reserved for judgement and God has yet to send His Son for the last time.

Luke 21:11

There will be great earthquakes, famines and pestilences in various places, and fearful events and great signs from heaven.

The things we are witnessing today are one of the signs as mentioned by Jesus Christ that the time nears when God will send His Son, Jesus Christ for the last time.

As to when...

Only the Father, who is the only true God.

 

[Trailblazer]

Revelation 1:7
“Look, he is coming with the clouds,” and “every eye will see him, even those who pierced him”; and all peoples on earth “will mourn because of him.” So shall it be! Amen.

That verse does not say when every eye will see Him. You Christians just assume it means every eye will see Him when he drops down from the clouds, but the verse does not say that.

Every eye will see Him does not mean that every physical eye in the world will see Him, because that is physically impossible for the eyes of 7.8 billion people to see Him. Baha'is believe that means that everyone will see Him in the sense they everyone in the world will recognize Baha'u'llah as the Christ Spirit returned, and we believe that will happen eventually, based upon this passage:

“Warn and acquaint the people, O Servant, with the things We have sent down unto Thee, and let the fear of no one dismay Thee, and be Thou not of them that waver. The day is approaching when God will have exalted His Cause and magnified His testimony in the eyes of all who are in the heavens and all who are on the earth.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 248

Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven means that the return of the Christ Spirit promised in the Bible will be made manifest from the heaven of the will of God, and will appear in the form of a human being. The term “heaven” means loftiness and exaltation. Although Jesus was delivered from the womb of His mother, in reality He descended from the heaven of the will of God. Though dwelling on this earth, His true habitation was the realms above. While walking among mortals on earth, Jesus soared in the heaven of the divine presence.

The term “clouds” as used in the Bible means those things that are contrary to the ways and desires of men. Just like the physical clouds prevent the eyes of men from beholding the sun, the desires of men hindered men from recognizing the return of Christ. Thus the meaning of clouds is symbolic, not literal. Their judgment was clouded.

 

[loverofhumanity]

I'd be more concerned with missing Jesus right now than His return. When Jesus returns it will probably be too late for anyone to make a decision. We don't believe He returned in secret or in the desert or anything like that. When Jesus returns every eye will see Him. There won't be any mistaking it. First though, the world will be tested and there will be false returns of Christ.

Matthew 24:26
Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.

Revelation 1:7
Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.

Acts 1:9-11
And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.
And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel;
Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

We even know He will appear on the mt of Olives at Jerusalem. There will be an earthquake. The mt. will split in half ...

Zechariah 14:4
And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

Finally when He returns it will be unveiled glory.

Matthew 16:27
For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

Jesus said He was in heaven while He walked the earth so yes He comes from the Heaven of the Will of Gid but I wouldn’t equate heaven with the earthly sky as Jesus didnt.

John 3: 12-13

If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things? And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

That to me is where a literal interpretation of heaven as being the earthly sky has been misunderstood by most Christians as with clouds also.


What is the spiritual meaning of clouds?
Clouds Covering the Sunlight
Spiritually, it means Christ's coming as man in the flesh, covering the spiritual glory of God in the flesh so that it would be hard for people to recognize the true identity of the Christ.
This is how Christ came down from heaven the first time but the Jews looked for an earthly king and Jesus was a spiritual King so they couldn’t identify Him with their understanding of their expected messiah so rejected Him.

Christ often said ‘ He that hath eyes let him see and he that has ears let him hear but all men at birth have eyes to see and ears to hear with. When He told His followers to watch and pray He meant with a spiritual heart and conscience not earthly ears or eyes or the earthly sky so millions missed His coming because they didn’t watch for a Great Heavenly King like the Jews but instead are looking at the earthly sky.

So all will see Him, that is, those with eyes to see ie spiritual eyes not outward sight. The Jews made this same mistake and now Christians I believe have fallen into the same trap.

Again, Christ and His return is about a great Spiritual Heavenly Being not an earthly king appearing from the earthly sky. As He came the first time as a man so it is with His return.

The clouds are that His human body will cover His inward glory so only those with eyes to see will know Him. All those with eyes to see have seen Him coming. But others who are looking for a fantastic light show see nothing because He came in the form of a human being but was from the Heaven of God’s Will.

 

[loverofhumanity]

That verse does not say when every eye will see Him. You Christians just assume it means every eye will see Him when he drops down from the clouds, but the verse does not say that.

Every eye will see Him does not mean that every physical eye in the world will see Him, because that is physically impossible for the eyes of 7.8 billion people to see Him. Baha'is believe that means that everyone will see Him in the sense they everyone in the world will recognize Baha'u'llah as the Christ Spirit returned, and we believe that will happen eventually, based upon this passage:

“Warn and acquaint the people, O Servant, with the things We have sent down unto Thee, and let the fear of no one dismay Thee, and be Thou not of them that waver. The day is approaching when God will have exalted His Cause and magnified His testimony in the eyes of all who are in the heavens and all who are on the earth.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 248

Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven means that the return of the Christ Spirit promised in the Bible will be made manifest from the heaven of the will of God, and will appear in the form of a human being. The term “heaven” means loftiness and exaltation. Although Jesus was delivered from the womb of His mother, in reality He descended from the heaven of the will of God. Though dwelling on this earth, His true habitation was the realms above. While walking among mortals on earth, Jesus soared in the heaven of the divine presence.

The term “clouds” as used in the Bible means those things that are contrary to the ways and desires of men. Just like the physical clouds prevent the eyes of men from beholding the sun, the desires of men hindered men from recognizing the return of Christ. Thus the meaning of clouds is symbolic, not literal. Their judgment was clouded.

Beautifully explained.

 

[loverofhumanity]

and just how would we know his pa·rou·siʹa has begun ? hummm could it be signs Jesus said to look out for ?

In the time of Christ the Jews had the Messiah Himself to turn to but they allowed their egos to get in the way so rejected Him. After His Ascension the world had His disciples and His teachings and in God’s good time all eyes that had eyes to see embraced the Cause of Jesus including kings, queens and entire nations.

Now Baha’u’llah has come and we have His Writings to turn to. When He appeared He addressed all humanity, the Pope and leaders of all religions and all the kings and queens of His appearance.

Again, I believe in God’s good time, all eyes that have eyes to see as with Jesus will recognise Baha’u’llah as Christ returned in the glory of the Father.

Some excerpts from His Tablet to the Christians

He once again has revealed Beatitudes. Here are just a few from that Tablet but I encourage Christians to read the entire Tablet as it addresses not only them but priests, bishops and monks as well.


Say: Blessed the slumberer who is awakened by My Breeze. Blessed the lifeless one who is quickened through My reviving breaths. Blessed the eye that is solaced by gazing at My beauty. Blessed the wayfarer who directeth his steps towards the Tabernacle of My glory and majesty. Blessed the distressed one who seeketh refuge beneath the shadow of My canopy. Blessed the sore athirst who hasteneth to the soft-flowing waters of My loving-kindness. Blessed the insatiate soul who casteth away his selfish desires for love of Me and taketh his place at the banquet table which I have sent down from the heaven of divine bounty for My chosen ones. Blessed the abased one who layeth fast hold on the cord of My glory; and the needy one who entereth beneath the shadow of the Tabernacle of My wealth...... (Baha’u’llah)

 

[cataway]

In the time of Christ the Jews had the Messiah Himself to turn to but they allowed their egos to get in the way so rejected Him. After His Ascension the world had His disciples and His teachings and in God’s good time all eyes that had eyes to see embraced the Cause of Jesus including kings, queens and entire nations.

Now Baha’u’llah has come and we have His Writings to turn to. When He appeared He addressed all humanity, the Pope and leaders of all religions and all the kings and queens of His appearance.

Again, I believe in God’s good time, all eyes that have eyes to see as with Jesus will recognise Baha’u’llah as Christ returned in the glory of the Father.

Some excerpts from His Tablet to the Christians

He once again has revealed Beatitudes. Here are just a few from that Tablet but I encourage Christians to read the entire Tablet as it addresses not only them but priests, bishops and monks as well.


Say: Blessed the slumberer who is awakened by My Breeze. Blessed the lifeless one who is quickened through My reviving breaths. Blessed the eye that is solaced by gazing at My beauty. Blessed the wayfarer who directeth his steps towards the Tabernacle of My glory and majesty. Blessed the distressed one who seeketh refuge beneath the shadow of My canopy. Blessed the sore athirst who hasteneth to the soft-flowing waters of My loving-kindness. Blessed the insatiate soul who casteth away his selfish desires for love of Me and taketh his place at the banquet table which I have sent down from the heaven of divine bounty for My chosen ones. Blessed the abased one who layeth fast hold on the cord of My glory; and the needy one who entereth beneath the shadow of the Tabernacle of My wealth...... (Baha’u’llah)

no offence, but the words of Baha’u’llah mean the same to me as the words of David Koresh

 

[1213]

Its already been preached all over the world a hundred times over. ....

Sorry, I don’t think it has. Christian religion and doctrines are not in my opinion the same as the Gospel of the Kingdom.

 

[1213]

...There were many additional references which made it clear that the Gospel of Christ, and its teachers, had entered every continent by the year 1844, spreading the Word of Jesus the Christ throughout the world....

Yes, “Christians” have been all over the place, but it is not necessary the same as the Gospel of the Kingdom. “Christians” have many non-Biblical teachings that they have taught, but not necessarily what Jesus as speaking of. For example, the whole concept of Trinity is not what Jesus had. And obviously, because the end has not yet happened, at least not by how I see and understand, it is strong evidence for that people have not really done what was required.

 

[loverofhumanity]

no offence, but the words of Baha’u’llah mean the same to me as the words of David Koresh

The Jews had the same sentiments towards Christ and had Him crucified. It didn’t mean that He wasn’t the Messiah. It only meant that they failed to recognise the Son of God.