To the Anti-Religious

[monta]

Atheists have that right in this satanic world that they perpetuate ,but eventually they will lose the argument in a horrific way.

I do hate to be bored.

 

[Smoke]

Atheists have that right in this satanic world that they perpetuate ,but eventually they will lose the argument in a horrific way.

I'm never quite sure whether such smug assertions on the part of believers express their own fear of damnation at the hands of their monstrous god, or their vindictive hatred of their unbelieving neighbors. Or both.

 

[Apex]

Is it just me or have we had a sudden influx of posts and threads claiming religious people are automatically ignorant, pathetic, or uneducated?

It`s just you.

Huh, it wasn't just me.

 

[linwood]

Huh, it wasn't just me.

Actually I think your right.

After the past couple of days Apex I`ll withdraw my comment.

It isn`t just you, there is alot of anti-religious posting going on lately.

Coming from me that`s not a small statement.

 

[Storm]

However, I too think religion can be dangerous. There are many perfectly good reasons to be critical of religion in general, not just the religions I particularly dislike, but also the religions I like -- Buddhism, Quakerism, Hinduism, and others. All the major religions have been used to oppress people. Most expressions of most of the major religions demand the suspension of rational thought in one area or another. Most of the major religions have been used thwart justice, to deaden compassion, and to excuse violence. Religious people are obligated to guard against these things. Most of the time, we don't.

Anything can be dangerous. Anything as pervasive as religion will inevitably be abused.

Is it really so hard to understand why people are anti-religious?

Yes. I've never understood throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

It's the easiest thing in the world for me, to see how people can despise all religion. The uncomfortable truth is that they have a point.

Any point they have is drowned by their bigotry.

It's unfortunate that so many people express that point in juvenile and unproductive ways, but if we aspire to be fair or compassionate or truthful, I think it behooves us to consider the point rather than simply dismissing these people, and especially the young people.

Smoke, I'm pretty sure you know me well enough to know that I appreciate lively, even heated debate. But I don't appreciate being stereotyped and bashed, which I know you understand. How is it any more acceptable to do so by my worldview than my sexuality?

 

[Smoke]

Smoke, I'm pretty sure you know me well enough to know that I appreciate lively, even heated debate. But I don't appreciate being stereotyped and bashed, which I know you understand. How is it any more acceptable to do so by my worldview than my sexuality?

I don't feel bashed if people say my religion is irrational, because it is. I can't give you sound, rational reasons for meditating or chanting, or any rational reason you should prefer mindfulness to mindlessness, or any proof that there is any such thing as enlightenment.

Nevertheless, my religion seems worthwhile to me, and as long as I don't try to impose it on others, I don't see why it should be any more objectionable to them than stamp collecting or genealogical research. (Though I have found there's no shortage of people to criticize you for those things, either.)

 

[Apex]

Is it really so hard to understand why people are anti-religious?

Is it also really so hard to understand why people are anti-atheists?

 

[linwood]

Is it also really so hard to understand why people are anti-atheists?

Kinda, yeah.

I`m a really nice guy..really!

:run:

 

[Sola'lor]

Wouldn't that also be true of you, if you say that any belief other than your own is false?

Exactly, That's why I don't.

 

[gnomon]

Seems we've had an influx of anti-religious atheists lately, making statements like "religion poisons everything," and "a rational religious person is... an oxymoron."

You guys do realize that a goodly number of the religious you love to bash are atheists, right? Agnostics, too. There are strictly atheistic sects of Buddhism and Hinduism. Atheists (along with everyone else) are embraced by UU, and constitute a good chunk of our faith. There are even atheistic neopagans and occultists.

So, how do you deal with these people? Are they subject to your bashing, or do you just ignore their existence?

Many people take the easy road.

I used to lash out against fellow atheists taking the easy argument. But I got tired of having my posts del..........oh well.

There are number of people I work with who are harshly critical of religion but go about it in an irrational way. Often it involves making generalized assumptions regarding history. I challenge them on it. Doesn't usually achieve anything.

Of course, I might be considered anti-religious by some.

 

[Anti-thesisofreason]

No doubt the "areligious" or the non-religious hold unsupported beliefs, the difference is that they are not commonly shared between the non religious nor encouraged and so collectively have no influence on each other, as groups, or on our culture. These unsupported beliefs would be held on an individual basis only.

Uh huh, keep saying it and eventually it will become the truth. :drool:

 

[Smoke]

Is it really so hard to understand why people are anti-religious?

Is it also really so hard to understand why people are anti-atheists?

No, I understand it, even as I note that while I was talking about being against ideas, you chose to talk about being against people.

 

[Apex]

No, I understand it, even as I note that while I was talking about being against ideas, you chose to talk about being against people.

Petty insult aside, I was just making sure you saw both sides of the coin. My statement was not entirely serious as you seem to have taken it. I understand why people are anti-(insert the "other side" here) as being attributed to human stupidity.

 

[Smoke]

Petty insult aside

I don't understand how paying attention to what you say is either petty or an insult.

 

[Storm]

No, I understand it, even as I note that while I was talking about being against ideas, you chose to talk about being against people.

"Anti-religious" strikes me as being about people, too. Especially in practice.

 

[Smoke]

"Anti-religious" strikes me as being about people, too. Especially in practice.

In the following sentence, I spoke about people despising "religion", not "religious people." So I would have thought the context made it absolutely clear what I meant.

But anyway, I was a religious monotheist for most of my life, and have been a religious atheist for the rest so far, and I've never experienced to the slightest intolerance from atheists or from anti-religious people. I can't say the same about religious people.

 

[Fortunato]

How is it any more acceptable to do so by my worldview than my sexuality?

Because one of them is a choice? Sorry, sorry, that was a bad joke... I have a genetic condition that compels me to say stupid things and I'll give anyone free frubals who can help point them out (offer does not apply to jokes though).

I'm an atheist, am relatively new to the RF, and hope that I don't fall into the category of making silly statements about other peoples beliefs. Perhaps the recent influx is part of our countries changing demographics. There are a lot of young people, which as a group are less religious, who have become more socially/politically aware over the past couple of years and after they had a victory getting Obama in office they might be looking for a new challenge. That's my guess at least. Oh, and I better not forget to mention that being on the internet and therefore anonymous, politeness in public discourse isn't held in the same regard as it might normally otherwise be. I am however appalled at some of their comments. They show all the tact of a 4 year old.

 

[Storm]

In the following sentence, I spoke about people despising "religion", not "religious people." So I would have thought the context made it absolutely clear what I meant.

But anyway, I was a religious monotheist for most of my life, and have been a religious atheist for the rest so far, and I've never experienced to the slightest intolerance from atheists or from anti-religious people. I can't say the same about religious people.

I wasn't referring to your behavior, sweetie. Just a general statement.

 

[Apex]

I don't understand how paying attention to what you say is either petty or an insult.

You were not paying attention, you were over analyzing and inserting an assumption that was not there.

 

[Storm]

I want to make something clear.

I do not consider all atheist, nor even all strong atheists, to be anti-religious. My only care for what you believe or disbelieve is how it leads you to treat others.

It is completely possible to (dis)believe strongly without resorting to steroetypes, bigotry, and bashing. When a believer resorts to such tactics, I take it as a sign that their faith is weak. That terminology doesn't fit atheists, but the impression is no more favorable.

OTOH, there are several atheists on this board alone who are exemplory models of respectful disagreement, and have thus won my admiration and respect. They criticze, analyze, debate, and challenge with luadable civility.

I only wish some of our newer members would learn from their example.