Top 10 Reassons Jesus is not God

[savagewind]

If it is so very important to know that Jesus is God, then there would be more real evidence and nothing would be written which suggests he isn't and there is a lot of that.

 

[outhouse]

Jesus never claimed divintiy. I believe that is false. He equated Himself with Goid by saying "I and my Father are one."

But we don't know he said that at all.


We do know the unknown authors who were not witness to any event in his life wrote that.


You need more evidence to substantiate your claim.

 

[outhouse]

If it is so very important to know that Jesus is God, then there would be more real evidence and nothing would be written which suggests he isn't and there is a lot of that.

We see text of a human who was martyred after his death.

We have a Galilean who was born from a human birth, and a died a human death.


We have later authors far removed from his life who compared and paralleled his actions to those of the living Emperor first called "son of god"

We also see different parallels to different important characters in the OT text as well, by the different authors who each had their own vision of what and who the Galilean was.

 

[Muffled]

If it is so very important to know that Jesus is God, then there would be more real evidence and nothing would be written which suggests he isn't and there is a lot of that.

I believe one should say what they think that is. It appears to me that there is plenty of real evidence.

I believe this is more perceived than real.

 

[Muffled]

But we don't know he said that at all.


We do know the unknown authors who were not witness to any event in his life wrote that.


You need more evidence to substantiate your claim.

I believe I know He said it and what He meant by saying it. I believe if you don't know this, the reason is that you don't know Jesus.

I believe that is fantasy on your part.

The thread "Did Jesus Say He is God" over 1000 pages but very old and not presently active.

 

[Muffled]

Matt.5

1. [16] Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works and give glory to your Father who is in heaven.
2. [45] so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven; for he makes his sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust.
3. [48] You, therefore, must be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect.

Matt.6

1. [1] "Beware of practicing your piety before men in order to be seen by them; for then you will have no reward from your Father who is in heaven.
2. [4] so that your alms may be in secret; and your Father who sees in secret will reward you.
3. [6] But when you pray, go into your room and shut the door and pray to your Father who is in secret; and your Father who sees in secret will reward you.
4. [8] Do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask him.
5. [9] Pray then like this: Our Father who art in heaven,
   Hallowed be thy name.
6. [14] For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father also will forgive you;
7. [15] but if you do not forgive men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.
8. [18] that your fasting may not be seen by men but by your Father who is in secret; and your Father who sees in secret will reward you.
9. [26] Look at the birds of the air: they neither sow nor reap nor gather into barns, and yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not of more value than they?
10. [32] For the Gentiles seek all these things; and your heavenly Father knows that you need them all.

Matt.7

1. [11] If you then, who are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father who is in heaven give good things to those who ask him!
2. [21] "Not every one who says to me, `Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.

Matt.10

1. [32] So every one who acknowledges me before men, I also will acknowledge before my Father who is in heaven;
2. [33] but whoever denies me before men, I also will deny before my Father who is in heaven.

Matt.11

1. [25] At that time Jesus declared, "I thank thee, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that thou hast hidden these things from the wise and understanding and revealed them to babes;
2. [26] yea, Father, for such was thy gracious will.
3. [27] All things have been delivered to me by my Father; and no one knows the Son except the Father, and no one knows the Father except the Son and any one to whom the Son chooses to reveal him.

Matt.12

1. [50] For whoever does the will of my Father in heaven is my brother, and sister, and mother."

Matt.15

1. [13] He answered, "Every plant which my heavenly Father has not planted will be rooted up.

Matt.16[17] And Jesus answered him, "Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jona! For flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but my Father who is in heaven.

Matt.23

1. [9] And call no man your father on earth, for you have one Father, who is in heaven...

Notice that God is always being referred to as a separate entity from God.

I believe your assessment has no basis. There is no statement in there anywhere that there is a separate entity. This is imagined by the person doing the assessment.

That would be like if I imagined "my Father" as being my earthly father who is dead and buried.

 

[metis]

I believe your assessment has no basis. There is no statement in there anywhere that there is a separate entity. This is imagined by the person doing the assessment.

That would be like if I imagined "my Father" as being my earthly father who is dead and buried.

Believe what you want, but the minute that you talk about your "father", you are talking about a different entity. There simply is no logical way they could be the same because Jesus states he does not know when the end times are and that only the Father knows for sure.

 

[Muffled]

Believe what you want, but the minute that you talk about your "father", you are talking about a different entity. There simply is no logical way they could be the same because Jesus states he does not know when the end times are and that only the Father knows for sure.

Yes I believe there is a way. I as a living person at this time do not know the time of my death but a future me (that is still me, the same entity) does know the time of my death.

I don't believe you can prove that.

 

[Sand Dancer]

The person in the video claims that Jesus never claimed divintiy. I believe that is false. He equated Himself with Goid by saying "I and my Father are one."

Only John had him say that. It's not one of the synoptic gospels. It was the last written and the most embellished.

 

[Muffled]

Only John had him say that. It's not one of the synoptic gospels. It was the last written and the most embellished.

I believe John is a reliable witness being one of the three close to Jesus. I believe there is no evidence of embellishment.

Also I believe John lived longer than the others so he could write at a later date and that should not be accounted as slackness.

However there is also Matthew calling Jesus, Immanuel - God with us.

 

[viole]

Muffled said: ↑
I believe I have shown where the gospels agree with me and that you have not shown where you think they disagree.

Right here:

May I add an eleventh one?

11) Jesus is not God because there is no God.

Ciao

- viole

 

[Muffled]

May I add an eleventh one?

11) Jesus is not God because there is no God.

Ciao

- viole

I believe you may but you will have no evidence to support the claim and I do have evidence to support the claim that there is God.

 

[Muffled]

#7 (#4 in video) Jesus said He wasn't God in John 17:3.

John 17:3 And this is life eternal, that they should know thee the only true God, and him whom thou didst send, even Jesus Christ.

I believe Jesus is saying He is God in this verse.

Also th reference to "My God" do not mean that Jesus isn't God but simply is Jesus tieing Himself in to God.

 

[Theweirdtophat]

According to the Old Testmanet, it never said the Messiah would be the Son of God or God himself. Just an enlighten human being who would help Israel. I don't believe he was God but I do believe he was a descendent of King David and believe he was trying to fufill the prophecy.

 

[Theweirdtophat]

May I add an eleventh one?

11) Jesus is not God because there is no God.

Ciao

- viole

A rather sarcastic and arrogant claim. I don't believe you traveled all over the universe in search of God. Otherwise, how could you know? People shouldn't pretend they have the answers when they really don't. To say there is no God because "He's not right in front of me." is rather arrogant.

 

[viole]

A rather sarcastic and arrogant claim. I don't believe you traveled all over the universe in search of God. Otherwise, how could you know? People shouldn't pretend they have the answers when they really don't. To say there is no God because "He's not right in front of me." is rather arrogant.

I did not travel around the Universe to check that the speed of light is constant everywhere, either. That does not prevent me from claiming to know that the speed of light is indeed constant everywhere (in vacuum).

Ciao

- viole

 

[Muffled]

According to the Old Testmanet, it never said the Messiah would be the Son of God or God himself. Just an enlighten human being who would help Israel. I don't believe he was God but I do believe he was a descendent of King David and believe he was trying to fufill the prophecy.

The evidence is to the contrary that the Messiah would be God.

God never has to try anything; He engineers it.

 

[Muffled]

I did not travel around the Universe to check that the speed of light is constant everywhere, either. That does not prevent me from claiming to know that the speed of light is indeed constant everywhere (in vacuum).

Ciao

- viole

I believe you know the speed of light because you have heard and believed the evidence. I believe you need to do the same with God.

 

[viole]

I believe you know the speed of light because you have heard and believed the evidence. I believe you need to do the same with God.

How? I can measure the speed of light in vacuum in a very objective way. Can you provide to me an epistemology to do the same with God? If yes, what about convincing your fellow believers who believe in a completely different God, first? I have no problems to show the evidence about the speed of light to anyone, from Timbuktu to Sydney, and make them accept it.

Can you do the same with your very special version of God?

Do you think I need a "speed of light measurements" DIR?

Ciao

- viole

 

[Muffled]

How? I can measure the speed of light in vacuum in a very objective way. Can you provide to me an epistemology to do the same with God? If yes, what about convincing your fellow believers who believe in a completely different God, first? I have no problems to show the evidence about the speed of light to anyone, from Timbuktu to Sydney, and make them accept it.

Can you do the same with your very special version of God?

Do you think I need a "speed of light measurements" DIR?

Ciao

- viole

I believe it has been a log time since I reviewed the physics of maesuring the speed of light but I believe it is done by the affect that the light makes. It is the same with God He is measured by the affect that He makes. We had a speaker recently who said he was taking drugs that would eventually kill him and he had no power within himself to stop but after receiving Jesus as Lord, He stopped taking the drugs. The power of God was at work and the affect was freedom from addiction.