Trajectory of the USA

[PureX]

We need some leadership that aren't corrupt and owned by foreign interests. That would be a start.

They aren't owned by foreign interests. They are owned by corporate interests that only their own profit as an agenda. We have a government controlled by the greed of capital investors and their corporate conglomerates.

 

[PureX]

In my opinion, according to what I sense, but have trouble fully articulating, our problems have something to do with the impact of new technology in our lives: specifically the need to make them efficient, and make them grow the economy. I am starting to now understand that maybe, we should view technological power as a gratuity, and not an economic opportunity.

For example, with that train that crashed in ohio, it seems like all the problems there stem from this: stretching material power into efficiency and precision, obviously beyond what was reasonable. Brakes fail, or rail-lines fail, or things bungle up, because the train is undermanned and too long. The specifics don't matter, in the context of the abstract background of it: the economy must grow, and it demands speed, efficiently, and the stretching of material/natural/mathematical laws. It doesn't see technological ability as a mere gratuity

I propose a solution, perhaps via religion. Religion is, actually, possibly, mostly about debating the most efficient and precise way to accomplish a physical action. This had never really occurred to me until now, but it seems like it's mostly true. Think back to the long lists of laws in the Old Testament: it's really mostly about making humans take detours, where they could do a task more directly. It involved the latest technologies, of that time.

So I guess what we need to maybe do, is start thinking about technology in a far more theological sense, because otherwise, we will make demands of it the point, where it will break itself, and possibly us. And I'm not entirely sure about all the details of how this would work, but maybe it would have to be composed of highly detailed tracts, like you would see in leviticus or deuteronomy.

What you are calling "efficiency" is just corporate greed. The rail workers warned the government and anyone else that would listen years ago about the failure of the rail corporations to maintain their equipment to the point of endangering the public, and they were ignored because the rail corporations wanted them to be ignored, and could pay the politicians and the media to ignore them. Which they did. Leading to an inevitable disaster.

It's not about "efficiency", it's about greed and stupidity. It's about maximizing profits to investors and their CEOs by ignoring safety because safety costs money. The oil spill in the Gulf was caused by the same thing. And many of the oil pipeline disasters were caused by the same thing. In fact, most industrial disasters were completely preventable had the corporations involved not chosen maximizing profits over public and environmental safety. But their greed knows no bounds, and accepts no impediments. So they ignored public safety, bribed the people that were intended to safeguard it, and the inevitable occurred. As it will continue to occur because the public's lives and well being are irrelevant in the face of maximizing profits to capital investors.

 

[RestlessSoul]

No. For two major reasons.

One. The Fermi Paradox.

You think the US is at risk of Alien invasion?

 

[Twilight Hue]

You think the US is at risk of Alien invasion?

More like the reason we don't find advanced life out there is the tech and its creators eventually and inevitably destroys its own civilization.

 

[amorphous_constellation]

What you are calling "efficiency" is just corporate greed. The rail workers warned the government and anyone else that would listen years ago about the failure of the rail corporations to maintain their equipment to the point of endangering the public, and they were ignored because the rail corporations wanted them to be ignored, and could pay the politicians and the media to ignore them. Which they did. Leading to an inevitable disaster.

It's not about "efficiency", it's about greed and stupidity. It's about maximizing profits to investors and their CEOs by ignoring safety because safety costs money. The oil spill in the Gulf was caused by the same thing. And many of the oil pipeline disasters were caused by the same thing. In fact, most industrial disasters were completely preventable had the corporations involved not chosen maximizing profits over public and environmental safety. But their greed knows no bounds, and accepts no impediments. So they ignored public safety, bribed the people that were intended to safeguard it, and the inevitable occurred. As it will continue to occur because the public's lives and well being are irrelevant in the face of maximizing profits to capital investors.

Well I think greed exists, but I am beginning to think that modern material conditions might presuppose greed. And whichever branch of ethics is supposed to deal with modern material conditions, may need improvement at this point. Think of any article of efficient modern technology. It could be a train, computer, automated production device of any kind, car, whatever. Once those things are in front of people, they want to maximize the productive capacity of the material by default. Similar to how an addict seeks a fix

And when's the last time you were impatient with anything, that involved technology. Maybe you had to wait in line, to get to a place where someone performed a computerized operation for you. Well whatever that thing was doing for you, it was basically doing it at light-speed, and yet people still get impatient with it. Well part of the problem with that, is that the computer, by merit of its incredible storage capacity, wants more information from each individual than was ever received before, by someone collecting information from another, manually

That's just one example. Transportation is obviously another. Email as opposed to letter, is another. TV and radio, where they deflect the need for real communication and experience, is probably another. The list goes on.

I'm pretty sure one can also read ideas from socialists/communists, about arguing that their systems are more productive - but that's just ants on sugar again. Same exact thing. If the point is to be more productive, then they also need efficiency.

 

[Soandso]

Eh, it's about the same, as such judgements of so-called "good" and so-called "bad" are ultimately arbitrary and meaningless to just about everyone (often including myself). The world is what it is, regardless of what silly judgements I do (or don't) pass on it. Existence keeps existing, changing constantly in the experience of now. Judge less. Live more. Focus on what matters.

Doesn't the future matter? I understand that living for now matters for sure, but imagine if the civil rights movement never happened because people didn't look forward to a better future and just became complacent in the horrible situation they were in. Martin Luther King Jr's speech is all about the dream of a better tomorrow, and that better tomorrow came through hard won effort. I think that's a worthy endeavor

 

[Quintessence]

Doesn't the future matter? I understand that living for now matters for sure, but imagine if the civil rights movement never happened because people didn't look forward to a better future and just became complacent in the horrible situation they were in. Martin Luther King Jr's speech is all about the dream of a better tomorrow, and that better tomorrow came through hard won effort. I think that's a worthy endeavor

This can be a bit confusing, but accepting things for what they are doesn't mean one suddenly stops living life in accordance with one's nature and values. It doesn't mean becoming "complacent" as you put it, or considering tomorrows. It means being at peace with the way things are and walking with humility rather than self-righteousness. Whatever your values are and however you live, you'll come into conflict with someone else's idea of what is good, valuable, and right. Judge less, live more, focus on what matters. What that looks like is different for everyone.

But, in general, I think a lot of humans would be very well served from pausing, taking a step back, and getting outside of their own heads and cultural expectations for a bit. Take a wide view. I often think with an ecologist's eye on geologic time scales, so that's perhaps a bit unusual... but it certainly keeps one humble.