Trinitarians will win anyway?

[LactoseIntolerant]

I believe that the Trinitarians will win even if the Trinity were not true. The Trinity is of course true, but assuming only that it is wrong, I would say that Trinitarians will still go to paradise. For what does the Father want to say? Does he really want to say to a Trinitarian at the end, "Wait, you believed that my only begotten Son and my Spirit are God as I am? You wicked man! To hell with you!" Never would he say that. He would love it if someone honored his beloved son and spirit like that. But what about Unitarians? If the Trinity is true, then it is a very serious sin not to believe in it, because you would be denying God His deity. Jesus himself said, "If you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins"

You certainly are a gambler.
Revelation 22:18-19 I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: if anyone adds to them, God will add to him the plagues which are written in this book; and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God will take away his part from the tree of life and from the holy city, which are written in this book.

 

[sherifgg]

Does he really want to say to a Trinitarian at the end, "Wait, you believed that my only begotten Son and my Spirit are God as I am? You wicked man! To hell with you!" Never would he say that.

How do you know what God will say? If the trinity does not exist, then you would be falsely associating equal partners with God, and that is one of the biggest sins against God.
“Which commandment is the most important of all?” Jesus replied, “This is the most important: ‘Hear O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is One". Mark 12:28-30. ----Very odd way to describe a "trinity".

If you truly want to believe in a trinity, you better be %100 convinced rather than taking your chances in this wager you mention.

 

[Teritos]

“Which commandment is the most important of all?” Jesus replied, “This is the most important: ‘Hear O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is One". Mark 12:28-30. ----Very odd way to describe a "trinity".

Who is the Lord? Jesus said he is the Lord.
You call me Teacher and Lord—and you are speaking rightly, since that is what I am. John 13:13

If you truly want to believe in a trinity, you better be %100 convinced rather than taking your chances in this wager you mention.

I'm convinced.

 

[firedragon]

I believe that the Trinitarians will win even if the Trinity were not true. The Trinity is of course true, but assuming only that it is wrong, I would say that Trinitarians will still go to paradise. For what does the Father want to say? Does he really want to say to a Trinitarian at the end, "Wait, you believed that my only begotten Son and my Spirit are God as I am? You wicked man! To hell with you!" Never would he say that. He would love it if someone honored his beloved son and spirit like that. But what about Unitarians? If the Trinity is true, then it is a very serious sin not to believe in it, because you would be denying God His deity. Jesus himself said, "If you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins"

But he already has done that kind of red rebuke for calling on other Gods in the Bible itself, so you never know. Since he is a God who said to torch an entire town for following another who is following another God in Devaarim, maybe he will be pretty angry.

 

[TheWingMan]

It's easy to accept a spirit....not so accepting honesty.

Honesty and truth is the Spirit spoken of by Jesus in the book of John. Some people for some reason complicate the simplicity by attempting to apply supernatural elements to simple truth and honesty.

 

[Psalm23]

In ceremonies, they eat the pretend flesh and drink the pretend blood of Jesus. But, that's more like salivation than salvation.

In communion I don’t see the bread and drink as literal but rather symbolic.

 

[1213]

You take single verses to explain the concept of God. I take the whole bible. ..

It seems to me that you ignore those scriptures I gave you.

 

[TrueBeliever37]

You should not compare yourself with God's nature, for can your spirit be sent like God's spirit or can your spirit teach?
But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and remind you of everything I have told you. John 14:26
Can your spirit speak like the spirit of God?
the Holy Spirit said: "Set apart for me Barnabas and Saul for the work to which I have called them" Acts of the Apostles 13:2
Can your spirit be lied to like the spirit of God?
But Peter said, "Ananias, why has Satan filled your heart to lie to the Holy Spirit" Acts of the Apostles 5:3

There are many other passages that make it clear that the Holy Spirit is a separate person.

Hi Teritos,

The Holy Spirit is not another person. The Holy Spirit is the Father. Matthew 1:18-20 God is a Spirit (John 4:24) and God is holy. It is not another person. And there is only one Spirit. Ephesians 4:4

 

[TrueBeliever37]

A serial killer believes in the Bible 5 minutes before he dies. Will he go to paradise according to the Bible? I say yes, what do you say?

I say NO - Except a man be born of the water and of the Spirit he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. John 3:3-5

 

[TrueBeliever37]

Of course he is saved. Only believing in the right thing saves you. He could have believed in Allah, or Buddha, or anything else, but he chose Jesus. That alone is very remarkable. It doesn't matter what kind of life one has led, in truth all Christians are sinners, Paul himself said that. Because sin is in the flesh. No one can live as Jesus demands, every Christian often betrays Jesus. But faith and faith alone justifies the Christian.

James 2:17 - Even so faith, it it hath not works is dead, being alone.
James 2:24 - Ye see how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
James 2:26 - faith without works is dead also.

James 1:22 - But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving yourselves. (You can hear the word and even believe it, but if you don't obey it, you are deceiving yourself.)

 

[TrueBeliever37]

I believe that the Trinitarians will win even if the Trinity were not true. The Trinity is of course true, but assuming only that it is wrong, I would say that Trinitarians will still go to paradise. For what does the Father want to say? Does he really want to say to a Trinitarian at the end, "Wait, you believed that my only begotten Son and my Spirit are God as I am? You wicked man! To hell with you!" Never would he say that. He would love it if someone honored his beloved son and spirit like that. But what about Unitarians? If the Trinity is true, then it is a very serious sin not to believe in it, because you would be denying God His deity. Jesus himself said, "If you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins"

Since he is coming back in flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel - it might be a good idea to figure out what is correct. 2 Thessalonians 1:8 (I myself know the Trinity is false.)

When he said If you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins. He meant that if you don't believe he is the one and only God, you will die in your sins. He was not the 2nd person in the Godhead. He was the one and only God, dwelling in a fleshly body, which he sacrificed for our sins.

 

[BrightShadow]

I believe that the Trinitarians will win even if the Trinity were not true. The Trinity is of course true, but assuming only that it is wrong, I would say that Trinitarians will still go to paradise. For what does the Father want to say? Does he really want to say to a Trinitarian at the end, "Wait, you believed that my only begotten Son and my Spirit are God as I am? You wicked man! To hell with you!" Never would he say that. He would love it if someone honored his beloved son and spirit like that. But what about Unitarians? If the Trinity is true, then it is a very serious sin not to believe in it, because you would be denying God His deity. Jesus himself said, "If you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins"

I think actually it will be the other way around!
If Trinity is true then Unitarians will be just fine like the rest of the believers of any monotheistic religion because Jesus didn't decisively declare that he was God or son of god. He did not try to prove his divine status. He actually did the opposite and tried to conceal it by saying he was just a messenger of God and on his own he can do nothing! So, I think in a rare scenario where trinity is correct - God should not punish non-believers who did not believe in Jesus' as a deity.

But if Trinity is a fabricated lie then big problem for Trinitarians because I don't believe it will be just a simple case of mistaken identity! Because in my personal opinion it will be failing the test for the second time!
I have written bits here and there but let me try to explain what I personally believe....
I believe God sent us to this world for a specific reason. I personally believe we have a history with God in our soul form. I believe that memory has been erased from our mind by God to facilitate the next step.
In my opinion God created all souls (billions or trillions of them) simultaneously millions of billions of years ago. Everything was fine until we questioned God's absolute authority and asked for proof. I believe that disappointed God. But I believe God did show us the proof!
After that - I believe God decided to give us a second shot at redemption and started to send us to this world one by one so that we can try and redeem ourselves. I believe Angels (who did not question God's absolute authority) remained with God and they did not want us to get a second shot at redemption. But God decided to give us the opportunity anyhow!
So, in this world I believe we are required to adopt a singular God concept in our hearts where we do not put anyone else on the same "standing" as God by any means! This is very important to God!
So, the name of the game is to authenticate and celebrate absolute authority of God and do so without actually being in direct presence of God! In a "setting" like that - regardless of God loving his messenger (Jesus) or not- if we put Jesus on the same 'standing" as God then we may fail the test yet again!

 

[lewisnotmiller]

Everyone and only those who believe that God became man and was crucified will go to paradise.

Bugger.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

Well, all you doubters better hope the Mormons got it right, because they don't believe in that eternal torture nonsense -- not even for you wicked atheists.

I'm happy if they put you in charge of the afterlife. Pretty sure we'll get a fair shake of the stick.

And if we atheists are right, I'll put in a good word for you with...err...hmmm....

 

[Windwalker]

Everyone and only those who believe that God became man and was crucified will go to paradise.

Isn't that legalism? God requires you to have a certain theological knowledge, and accept it as taught by men in order for God to let you into heaven? Isn't that "earning" salvation by passing a knowledge test?

Does God really care if we're all idiots when it comes to comprehending the Divine? I think the only ones who believe that live in fear. I personally do not see God being that small.

 

[Windwalker]

The Bible: If you believe in the incarnation of God and in his crucifixion and resurrection, you are saved.

"Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by my deeds. You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe that—and shudder."

James 2:18,19

 

[Windwalker]

A serial killer believes in the Bible 5 minutes before he dies. Will he go to paradise according to the Bible? I say yes, what do you say?

I have never read anywhere that believing in the Bible gets anyone saved. Is the Bible God? Does God sit on coffee tables and bookshelves inside believers homes? If you have more than one Bible, does that make you a polytheist?

"In the Beginning, the Bible created the heavens and the earth". "For the Bible so loved the world, he sent his only begotten son..." etc.?

 

[Teritos]

James 2:17 - Even so faith, it it hath not works is dead, being alone.
James 2:24 - Ye see how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
James 2:26 - faith without works is dead also.

James 1:22 - But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving yourselves. (You can hear the word and even believe it, but if you don't obey it, you are deceiving yourself.)

It's really fascinating how often James is misunderstood.

Interestingly, James takes in the same chapter two examples of works, once Abraham who wanted to kill his own son and once Rahab, a whore who betrayed her own people and thereby killed them.
What two beautiful works. However, both of these wonderful works contradict the moral law of the Bible.

Romans 4:2-5
If Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about—but not before God. For what does the Scripture say? Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him for righteousness. Now to the one who works, pay is not credited as a gift, but as something owed. But to the one who does not work, but believes on him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited for righteousness.

 

[TrueBeliever37]

It's really fascinating how often James is misunderstood.

Interestingly, James takes in the same chapter two examples of works, once Abraham who wanted to kill his own son and once Rahab, a whore who betrayed her own people and thereby killed them.
What two beautiful works. However, both of these wonderful works contradict the moral law of the Bible.

Romans 4:2-5
If Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about—but not before God. For what does the Scripture say? Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him for righteousness. Now to the one who works, pay is not credited as a gift, but as something owed. But to the one who does not work, but believes on him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited for righteousness.

You can't just ignore the other scriptures. They all apply. James 2:21-22

 

[Teritos]

You can't just ignore the other scriptures. They all apply. James 2:21-22

I don't ignore.