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Trump: Against the Electoral College; For National Popular Vote

Nous

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Trump's wide-ranging, freewheeling and very productive interview on Fox Thursday morning seems to have pleased so many people, especially prosecutors investigating his criminal activity and Stormy Daniels' hunky lawyer.

Trump certainly won me over with his comments opposing the electoral college and in favor of electing the President by national popular vote. As Newsweek reports, Trump said, "I would rather have the popular vote because it's, to me, it's much easier to win the popular vote." This article also informs us of his related comments during the interview and his tweets immediately after the 2016 election, where he noted that electing the President by popular vote would mean “a totally different campaign” (he's correct about that), and that if the election were based on national popular vote, he would have campaigned in Florida, New York and California.

Wouldn't you delight in currently having as President the candidate who won the popular vote in 2016, and for Trump to have concentrated his campaign in those 3 states? He lost California by about 4.3 million votes, and New York by about 1.7 million. He won Florida by a margin of 113,000. United States presidential election, 2016 - Wikipedia

I wonder what part of his well-publicized campaign “message” would have coaxed millions upon millions of Floridians, New Yorkers and Californians to vote for him? His invectives about Mexican immigrants being “rapists” and “killers”? His call for “a total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States”? His fluffy promises to resurrect Rust Belt manufacturing?

The fact is that electing the President by national popular vote would undoubtedly result is much greater turnout than the current system, given that the majority of Americans live in states where they know beforehand which candidate will receive their state's electoral votes. This foreknowledge can only discourage people from taking the time and trouble of standing in line on election day to cast an unnecessary ballot for either the sure-fire winner or looser in that state.

Trump's comments on Fox that the “Electoral College is actually genius in that it brings all states, including the smaller ones, into play,” further demonstrate his delusions. The state-winner-take-all electoral method causes candidates to ignore all but a few battleground states. As documented by National Popular Vote:

Two-thirds (273 of 399) of the general-election campaign events in the 2016 presidential race were in just 6 states(Florida, North Carolina, Pennsylvania, Ohio, Virginia, and Michigan).​

In 2012 the story was basically the same. Two thirds of presidential and vice-presidential post-convention campaign events were held in just 4 states (Ohio, Florida, Virginia and Iowa). Post-convention campaign events occurred in only one of the 13 smallest states (New Hampshire). There were no post-convention events in 22 of the 25 smallest states. There were no advertising dollars spent in 38 states after the conventions, while the total of more than $939 million was spent in 12 battleground states. Fifty-five percent of all post-convention advertising expenditures were disbursed in just 3 states (Ohio, Florida and Virginia). See: 9.2. Myths That Candidates Reach Out to All the States under the Current System

In any case, despite the fact that Trump got almost everything about the Electoral College wrong, can't you at least support him in his desire (and hopefully efforts) to elect the President by popular vote? I ask this especially of those people here who often seem to be somewhat on the right side of the aisle and who have suggested that there is something meritorious about the Electoral College method of choosing the President. Or do you think that Trump is just out of his mind in wanting to elect the President by national popular vote?

Electing the President by national popular vote is easily accomplished by the requisite number of states enacting the National Popular Vote Interstate Compact, which 11 states with a total of 165 electoral votes have already done, representing more than 60% of the needed 270 electoral votes. States in which one House has passed the NPVIC bill include Arkansas, Arizona, Colorado, Connecticut, Delaware, Maine, Michigan, North Carolina, New Mexico, Nevada, Oklahoma and Oregon. I particularly encourage people who live in any of these states to bug your state Senators or Representatives to pass this legislation. Trump's dream of electing the President by national popular vote can be realized by the 2020 election.

Indeed, we all should let Trump know how much we appreciate his advocacy on this matter, and encourage him to talk it up even more, especially on Fox. Right? I hear that he likes to be told how well he's doing.
 

Shushersbedamned

Well-Known Member
I don't know what I just read.

Who cares? Trump is nothing. Not a man, not a President, not even a real monster. I just can't place him in a sentence like that.
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
It would be awesome if it passes, because it would make it that much harder for him to win in 2020, and I think it might help, tremendously, with voter turnout if people know their vote won't be a "sure thing" of a wasted vote.
 

Nous

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
I don't know what I just read.
You didn't understand something in the OP? What did you not understand? Did you read and understand the Newsweek article and the information provided at the National Popular Vote links?

Who cares? Trump is nothing. Not a man, not a President, not even a real monster. I just can't place him in a sentence like that.
That doesn't seem to be an answer to any question I asked.
 

Nous

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
It would be awesome if it passes, because it would make it that much harder for him to win in 2020, and I think it might help, tremendously, with voter turnout if people know their vote won't be a "sure thing" of a wasted vote.
Yes, it would be awesome if enough legislatures adopted the NPVIC to put it into effect. It would be even more awesome if Trump's advocacy were to help it along. Notice at the NPV website how many state legislatures that presumably have large portions, if not majorities, of Republicans that have considered or even made headway into adopting it. Of course, surveys show that huge majorities of people want the president elected by national popular vote.
 

tytlyf

Not Religious
Elections should be based on popular vote. Don't expect to see republicans in congress on-board with this though.
 

Nous

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Don't expect to see republicans in congress on-board with this though.
No one in Congress needs to be "on board" with the NPVIC. Obviously a number of Republicans in state legislatures have supported and/or voted for the NPVIC. We should support those Republicans.
 

Shaul

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
It would be awesome if it passes, because it would make it that much harder for him to win in 2020, and I think it might help, tremendously, with voter turnout if people know their vote won't be a "sure thing" of a wasted vote.
It would awesome but not in a good way. It would be mob rule and tyranny by majority.
 

Shaul

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Elections should be based on popular vote. Don't expect to see republicans in congress on-board with this though.
Take a moment to think of the many unjust things that have been popular throughout history.
 

Nous

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
It would awesome but not in a good way. It would be mob rule and tyranny by majority.
What does any of that mean? The great majority of candidates who became President won the national popular vote.
 

Shaul

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
It would be awesome if it passes, because it would make it that much harder for him to win in 2020, and I think it might help, tremendously, with voter turnout if people know their vote won't be a "sure thing" of a wasted vote.
Making fundamental changes to our government because of a visceral dislike of one particular office holder is astoundingly short sighted and horrifying.
 

Nous

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Making fundamental changes to our government because of a visceral dislike of one particular office holder is astoundingly short sighted and horrifying.
You should put forth the effort to try to understand @Shadow Wolf 's comment about why it would be awesome for the NPVIC to become activated. Obviously she didn't even vaguely suggest any such thing as you said.
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
Making fundamental changes to our government because of a visceral dislike of one particular office holder is astoundingly short sighted and horrifying.
Actually, I've had a visceral disliking of the EC for most of my life. Everyone's vote should be counted, counted towards something meaningful, and counted equally as one vote. I was one of the millions more who voted for Hillary rather than Trump, but because I live in Indiana my vote was utterly wasted. Which tends to happen a lot, in many states. "Winner take all" is a poison for democracy and the political system.
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
Yes, it would be awesome if enough legislatures adopted the NPVIC to put it into effect. It would be even more awesome if Trump's advocacy were to help it along. Notice at the NPV website how many state legislatures that presumably have large portions, if not majorities, of Republicans that have considered or even made headway into adopting it. Of course, surveys show that huge majorities of people want the president elected by national popular vote.
We'd probably have a much easier time installing a national popular vote than making regulations for redistricting.
 

Shushersbedamned

Well-Known Member
You didn't understand something in the OP? What did you not understand? Did you read and understand the Newsweek article and the information provided at the National Popular Vote links?

That doesn't seem to be an answer to any question I asked.
I know. I've been so confused ever sense I bumped into that door in the kitchen. I don't really understand the American politics so I- or rather bc I don't care to understand - remain in the foreign politics.
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
You're not for electing the president by national popular vote? Why not?
It eliminates all the small state's ability to have a voice. It ends of being the metropolitan areas of four states of which NY and California would weigh in the most.

It is the the same reason why we have a Senate as well as a House of Representatives... to give equal footing between the small states and the large ones.

I believe there was wisdom when they put up that fence in the first place.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
Trump's wide-ranging, freewheeling and very productive interview on Fox Thursday morning seems to have pleased so many people, especially prosecutors investigating his criminal activity and Stormy Daniels' hunky lawyer.

Trump certainly won me over with his comments opposing the electoral college and in favor of electing the President by national popular vote. As Newsweek reports, Trump said, "I would rather have the popular vote because it's, to me, it's much easier to win the popular vote." This article also informs us of his related comments during the interview and his tweets immediately after the 2016 election, where he noted that electing the President by popular vote would mean “a totally different campaign” (he's correct about that), and that if the election were based on national popular vote, he would have campaigned in Florida, New York and California.

Wouldn't you delight in currently having as President the candidate who won the popular vote in 2016, and for Trump to have concentrated his campaign in those 3 states? He lost California by about 4.3 million votes, and New York by about 1.7 million. He won Florida by a margin of 113,000. United States presidential election, 2016 - Wikipedia

I wonder what part of his well-publicized campaign “message” would have coaxed millions upon millions of Floridians, New Yorkers and Californians to vote for him? His invectives about Mexican immigrants being “rapists” and “killers”? His call for “a total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States”? His fluffy promises to resurrect Rust Belt manufacturing?

The fact is that electing the President by national popular vote would undoubtedly result is much greater turnout than the current system, given that the majority of Americans live in states where they know beforehand which candidate will receive their state's electoral votes. This foreknowledge can only discourage people from taking the time and trouble of standing in line on election day to cast an unnecessary ballot for either the sure-fire winner or looser in that state.

Trump's comments on Fox that the “Electoral College is actually genius in that it brings all states, including the smaller ones, into play,” further demonstrate his delusions. The state-winner-take-all electoral method causes candidates to ignore all but a few battleground states. As documented by National Popular Vote:

Two-thirds (273 of 399) of the general-election campaign events in the 2016 presidential race were in just 6 states(Florida, North Carolina, Pennsylvania, Ohio, Virginia, and Michigan).​

In 2012 the story was basically the same. Two thirds of presidential and vice-presidential post-convention campaign events were held in just 4 states (Ohio, Florida, Virginia and Iowa). Post-convention campaign events occurred in only one of the 13 smallest states (New Hampshire). There were no post-convention events in 22 of the 25 smallest states. There were no advertising dollars spent in 38 states after the conventions, while the total of more than $939 million was spent in 12 battleground states. Fifty-five percent of all post-convention advertising expenditures were disbursed in just 3 states (Ohio, Florida and Virginia). See: 9.2. Myths That Candidates Reach Out to All the States under the Current System

In any case, despite the fact that Trump got almost everything about the Electoral College wrong, can't you at least support him in his desire (and hopefully efforts) to elect the President by popular vote? I ask this especially of those people here who often seem to be somewhat on the right side of the aisle and who have suggested that there is something meritorious about the Electoral College method of choosing the President. Or do you think that Trump is just out of his mind in wanting to elect the President by national popular vote?

Electing the President by national popular vote is easily accomplished by the requisite number of states enacting the National Popular Vote Interstate Compact, which 11 states with a total of 165 electoral votes have already done, representing more than 60% of the needed 270 electoral votes. States in which one House has passed the NPVIC bill include Arkansas, Arizona, Colorado, Connecticut, Delaware, Maine, Michigan, North Carolina, New Mexico, Nevada, Oklahoma and Oregon. I particularly encourage people who live in any of these states to bug your state Senators or Representatives to pass this legislation. Trump's dream of electing the President by national popular vote can be realized by the 2020 election.

Indeed, we all should let Trump know how much we appreciate his advocacy on this matter, and encourage him to talk it up even more, especially on Fox. Right? I hear that he likes to be told how well he's doing.

Your argument gives me a good reason to oppose the popular vote for the presidency. I don't live in a battleground state. As a result I was not bombarded with political ads. In fact it a almost as there was no election for the President.

Aaah! Peace and quiet.
 
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