Trump to Withdraw from Iran Nuclear Deal

[metis]

And where is Christ glorified in such actions? Saving the flesh?

Maybe if you actually read the Sermon On the Mount and Matthew 25's Parable of the Sheep & Goats, you would actually find your answer.

 

[Phantasman]

Yeah sure. Just like Bush had all of his CIA experts telling him Iraq had weapons that didn't exist.

I have no doubt that Iran hasn't given up on all their nuclear ambitions. But to claim that we are better off without a deal that allows inspectors and allows closer monitoring is silly.

But here is the clincher. If Israel had concrete evidence of Iran not following the tenets of the deal, why haven't they presented them to the UN? If Iran were found to be breaking the terms, then the entire deal would be called off, and all of the former embargoes would be reinstated. That tells me the 'evidence' is not conclusive.

Iran is on the border of Israel as I write this (through it's establishment in Syria). Expecting (all out) war at any minute. How did Iran get so many established areas in Syria? Where did the money come from, the weapons?

The minute Trump pulled out, why is Iran attacking Israel?

It's always been their goal to destroy Israel. Every Jew, as their book says. As well as their ideology. If war is inevitable, best to fight it before Iran gets nuclear, if they haven't already.

Trump just called their bluff. Nothing more. And Iran showed their hand.

I just choose a side an watch. And so far, my choice is right.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

And where is Christ glorified in such actions? Saving the flesh?

Given that Christ himself spenyt so much time healing the sick, it seems like something he'd approve of, nes pas?

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

Iran is on the border of Israel as I write this (through it's establishment in Syria). Expecting (all out) war at any minute. How did Iran get so many established areas in Syria? Where did the money come from, the weapons?

The minute Trump pulled out, why is Iran attacking Israel?

It's always been their goal to destroy Israel. Every Jew, as their book says. As well as their ideology. If war is inevitable, best to fight it before Iran gets nuclear, if they haven't already.

Trump just called their bluff. Nothing more. And Iran showed their hand.

I just choose a side an watch. And so far, my choice is right.

What a load of nonsense. FYI, The Late Great Planet Earth is not a text book.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

The minute Trump pulled out, why is Iran attacking Israel?

Where? When?

 

[Phantasman]

Maybe if you actually read the Sermon On the Mount and Matthew 25's Parable of the Sheep & Goats, you would actually find your answer.

Maybe you should understand the sword (of Christ) that separates even fathers from sons, and mothers from daughters.

Matthew 10:
32 Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven.

33 But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.

35 For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.

36 And a man's foes shall be they of his own household.

37 He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.

38 And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me.

39 He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it.
Flesh/spirit. Goats/sheep.

So who's flesh do you save with such rhetoric? Where is the peace you provide for such actions?

You see life and death as flesh. Which is why spiritual understanding evades you. Caught up in the world.

 

[Phantasman]

What a load of nonsense. FYI, The Late Great Planet Earth is not a text book.

Read it. Just another "revelation" that made the author millions.

Do you believe it was the "Word" (of God)?

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

Read it. Just another "revelation" that made the author millions.

Do you believe it was the "Word" (of God)?

No. It's pulp fiction, not a basis for foreign policy.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

Maybe you should understand the sword (of Christ) that separates even fathers from sons, and mothers from daughters.

Matthew 10:
32 Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven.

33 But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.

35 For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.

36 And a man's foes shall be they of his own household.

37 He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.

38 And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me.

39 He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it.
Flesh/spirit. Goats/sheep.

So who's flesh do you save with such rhetoric? Where is the peace you provide for such actions?

You see life and death as flesh. Which is why spiritual understanding evades you. Caught up in the world.

Translation: "Don't bother me with Christ's message of peace, love and forgiveness, I've got people with different beliefs I need to vilify"

 

[metis]

You see life and death as flesh. Which is why spiritual understanding evades you. Caught up in the world.

First of all, your entire post evades what I posted in terms of what Jesus actually taught in the Sermon and Matthew 25 and, secondly, you again have shown that you really do not also even accept Jesus' teachings on not judging others, such as what you have done with the above.

So, do you have any inclination whatsoever to maybe convert to actually following what Jesus taught?

 

[Phantasman]

Where? When?

Where you been? Get off of CNN.

Iran launched a missile strike on northern Israel late Wednesday night, with 20 Grad and Fajr rockets taking off from Syria in what was widely seen as retaliation after months of Israeli airstrikes punishing their forces — but it looks like it got crushed.

Not only does Israel say it intercepted a number of the Iranian missiles, it says the other missiles failed to reach their target and sputtered out while still in Syria.

The response from Israel included many more missiles, and, according to Israel, did serious damage that will take a long time to rebuild.

 

[Phantasman]

First of all, your entire post evades what I posted in terms of what Jesus actually taught in the Sermon and Matthew 25 and, secondly, you again have shown that you really do not also even accept Jesus' teachings on not judging others, such as what you have done with the above.

So, do you have any inclination whatsoever to maybe convert to actually following what Jesus taught?

Not to follow orthodox catholic? They've murdered as well in the "name" of (their) god.

The God I follow never murdered anyone.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

Where you been? Get off of CNN.

Iran launched a missile strike on northern Israel late Wednesday night, with 20 Grad and Fajr rockets taking off from Syria in what was widely seen as retaliation after months of Israeli airstrikes punishing their forces — but it looks like it got crushed.

Not only does Israel say it intercepted a number of the Iranian missiles, it says the other missiles failed to reach their target and sputtered out while still in Syria.

The response from Israel included many more missiles, and, according to Israel, did serious damage that will take a long time to rebuild.

So you answered your own question. "why is Iran attacking Israel?"" months of Israeli airstrikes punishing their forces".

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

Not to follow orthodox catholic? They've murdered as well in the "name" of (their) god.

The God I follow never murdered anyone.

Cool goal post shift. So killing people, or letting them die through inaction is ok, so long as it's not explicitly murder.

 

[columbus]

, why is Iran attacking Israel?

taking off from Syria in what was widely seen as retaliation after months of Israeli airstrikes punishing their forces

I am not justifying any of the violence.
But do you not see the difference between "attacking" and "retaliation"?
Tom

 

[Koldo]

I couldn't agree more with the last line. Who came to the rescue of OUR civil war?

Let the people decide their own future (government). Not us.

But also on that same note, don't expect the US to be a place to run to as well (like San Salvador). Fight to win or die, just as we did. No refugee's.

I am sorry, but 'we' who ?
I don't think you are that old, are you ?

 

[Shad]

Well Europe is pissed at us over Trumps tariffs, now the US broke a deal that benefits Europe.

Those European nations signed the deal as well, as P-5. If the deal is void only because the US dropped out then, again, nations are useless addition to the deal. So they benefit from a deal they had no real stake in.

Flip sides? Probably not. But if they can continue the deal with Iran without us, I have no doubt they will.

I doubt members of NATO are going to turn their backs on the backbone and wallet of the organization.

Germany is loving their new role as global leader.

Yes... and my niece enjoyed pretending to be a princess but lets talk about reality.

You have a skewed view of how international relations work. No, it isn't about pleasing other nations. But breaking agreements is serious business that has lasting impacts.

The deal was not legally binding. If nations want to spin their PR as if it is in order to score points they can do so. It makes them looks like liars but that is on them. However I doubt any of those talking heads have any serious plans or counters for this deal ending. Unless Dems mess up again there will be a new POTUS that will reopen negotiations. Hopefully with the intelligence to get it ratified.

If we break the deal we become powerless when it comes to Iran.

Nope.

I don't see how us pulling out shows them to be powerless.

As the deal seems to be solely dependent on America while there are 4 other security council members still involved. If the deal collapse only due to American withdrawal it establish the other 4 were useless additions in the first place.

 

[Shad]

Virtually every treaty ever made makes such concessions. Which is the point...

Your examples contain clauses granting the authority to to end those treaties. There is no such clause in this deal nor was one negotiated and ratified by Congress. Your source omitted those clauses as if the POTUS could end a treaty on a whim.

 

[columbus]

Unless Dems mess up again there will be a new POTUS that will reopen negotiations.

If Iran decides to renegotiate.
They don't have much pressure on to do so. When Obama negotiated the last one it was Iran v UN security council. Now, it's the USA against the Security Council. And the USA has demonstrated that it cannot be trusted.

Why do you think that Trump will do better?
Tom

 

[Shad]

If Iran decides to renegotiate.

Depend on what happens with NK and the weak will of the remaining "deal" members, which hang on the coat tails of America, doing something on their own.... Hahah

They don't have much pressure on to do so. When Obama negotiated the last one it was Iran v UN security council.

The so-called security council seems useless without the US

Now, it's the USA against the Security Council. And the USA has demonstrated that it cannot be trusted.

Nope. Trump demonstrated talking heads manipulate the public by treating Obama's deal as legally binding on the US when it wasn't. Trump made statements about the deal prior to running for GOP nomination. He promised to scrap it during both campaign for GOP and POTUS. So the so-called security council and Obama had almost 2 years to do something to plan for that. They didn't as many most likely assumed Hillary would win the election and keep deal.

The security council is a paper tiger. Veto bickering will return but the SC isn't going to be able to do anything to the US.

Why do you think that Trump will do better?
Tom

Never said he would do better. I am waiting to see what Trump's NK deal is going to look like.