Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
If you can't admit to campaign finance violations then you are a no-hoper.
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Trump would have been charged with obstruction were he not president
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anna.
colors your eyes with what's not there
Their targeted audience is conservative. Did you know that?
Start with his minions such as Barr who are refusing the lawful need of the House to see specific records.
PureX
Veteran Member
He's also obviously guilty of colluding with the Russians to bias an election even though it could not be proven according to a legal standard (which is nearly impossible to meet).
BSM1
What? Me worry?
Where is a real charge, not just wishful thinking, speculation, and innuendo? Again, you have absolutely nothing; but thanks for playing.
and who have fallen away, to be brought back to repentance. To their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.
FragrantGrace
If winning isn't everything why do they keep score
No. Because it isn't true. Good luck though .
FragrantGrace
If winning isn't everything why do they keep score
The $84 million that Hillary illegally stole during the 2016 campaign? No, people readily admit to that evidence being present. However, she's still free of jail.
As to Trump and the alleged monies paid to the Porn-Whore Stormy Daniels, that's old news that has been rectified and no longer applies.
Anyone that can't face that is a no-clue'er
this thread isn't about hillary. bait and switch is just another way of attempting to avoid the issue. RED HERRING
Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
We are not talking about Hillary, but thanks for admitting that Trump is guilty.
Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
You are not being consistent. This is a dishonest debating techniques that implies you know that Trump is guilty. You should know why he Mueller could not charge him with this crime. This is a crime that he might have to wait to face until he gets out of office.
If Donald Trump robbed a bank his supporters would defend him by claiming Hillary Clinton robbed a bigger bank.
BSM1
What? Me worry?
You are starting to come across as unhinged, IMHO. I don't quite understand what you're trying to say. Mueller couldn't charge him with a crime because (simply put) there was no crime committed.
Erebus
Well-Known Member
Sadly, "Whataboutism" is a very convenient deflection technique. There are perfectly valid criticisms one can level at Clinton and Obama, none of which detract from or negate the criticisms leveled at Trump.
FragrantGrace
If winning isn't everything why do they keep score
That's a lie. Never said that. So you're as false as your claims against Trump.
You ignore at your peril of being taken seriously here as everything you and the other Anti-Trumpers spew as charges against Trump and that actually bear no truth is in reality, reality, key word there not known to Anti-Trumpers, is that there is real evidence of those false Trump claims are guilt on two Democrats in particular.
Hillary Rodham Clinton and her traitor boss Barack H. Obama.
The slight of hand the corrupt Left leaning media spins and that the corrupt Left demographic swallows hopes to draw attention from real crime by Hillary and Barack. And put their crimes on the back of Donald J. Trump.
It is called scape goating! And in this case it is a metaphor the corrupt Left and Hillary and Barack hopes comes to fruition.
Only rather than the afflicted goat being sent into the desert to perish and having carried away the sins of the ones that loaded him up with them, the corrupt Left hopes Trump is sent out of the White house to live under the shame of the outright lies the Left and its co-conspirators, like yourself, pray stick to Trump. Despite the evidence none of it applies to Trump but applies to Hillary, Barack, Comey, and many others.
FragrantGrace
If winning isn't everything why do they keep score
Please, the negative criticisms leveled at Trump are derived from the deflective efforts of the Left that wish to put the truth of certain Democrats criminal acts upon Trump.
The porn-whore issue is over and done with and never had any merit. The real crimes, Russia collusion, campaign finance illegality, and much more, including tampering with evidence, espionage, and treason, are all in evidence facts against Barack Obama and his SoS Hillary R. Clinton! And of course Comey, who violated the records act.
The unholy threesome. Comey exonerated Hillary Clinton from any wrong doing in the illegal server inquiry before Congress BEFORE he began his investigation. And Hillary is so cock-sure of her Teflon ability to do anything illegal and never answer for it that she didn't even hide the monetary paper trail back to her corrupt family and its foundation and from whence Comey was paid for that pre-investigation acquittal!
This is all on the record with hard evidence. It has been revealed to the public over these three years. Hillary tampered with subpoena evidence! Bleach-Bit used on the illegal basement computer hard drive so as to wipe all evidence clean.
The man who leaked DNC emails to Wikileaks and those emails outlining how the DNC was going to tank Bernie Sanders run for office in 2016 was murdered in D.C. Shot in the back, the D.C cops claim it was a robbery. Not a thing was taken from the young man but his life. And that case is closed.
Why not look for the murderer?
Oh, it was a robbery. That means no murder? That's a real surprise to his family. Still. Because they want answers they'll never get.
It isn't an urban legend that there are bodies of Clinton associates that line from Arkansas to the White house. All people who knew their corruption in the Governor's office and the White house. Dead before they could give testimony. So many "suicides". So many "violent crime victims".
Right!
Trump was good friends with Bill and Hillary. Very good friends. But Donald took something Hillary lived for and now she's obsessed with payback. And she has the money to make it happen. Like the stolen campaign funds from her 2016 campaign. Think of what you could do with $84 million dollars!
Oh, but it isn't the first time HRC did that. Money! HRC's god is money!
And who remembers the $35,000 fine Hillary was charged for federal campaign donation fraud?
Hillary Campaign Finance Director Indicted
Rosen charged with fudging numbers for 2000 Hollywood fundraiser
And the porn-whore retained an attorney as corrupt as she is. Not rumor. Fact!
Trump foe Avenatti charged with trying to extort $20 million from Nike - Reuters
NEW YORK (Reuters) - Attorney Michael Avenatti, who represented adult film star Stormy Daniels in her legal battles with U.S. President Donald Trump, was charged on Monday with what prosecutors said was an attempt to “shake down” Nike Inc for over $20 million.
Avenatti, who was also hit with separate embezzlement and fraud charges in U.S. District Court in Los Angeles, was arrested in New York.
NEW YORK (Reuters) - Attorney Michael Avenatti, who represented adult film star Stormy Daniels in her legal battles with U.S. President Donald Trump, was charged on Monday with what prosecutors said was an attempt to “shake down” Nike Inc for over $20 million.....
Meanwhile, for the purveyors of falsehood against Trump when they regurgitate the ridiculous lie about Trump paying Stormy Daniels hush money , lets refresh reality with old reported facts shall we?
Cohen says Stormy Daniels payment was transferred from his home equity line
© Getty
President Trump's personal lawyer Michael Cohen said he transferred $130,000 to adult-film actress Stormy Daniels from his home equity line as scrutiny rises over the reported nondisclosure payment from October 2016.
Cohen told ABC News that "the funds were taken from my home equity line and transferred internally to my LLC account in the same bank." The comments came the same day as a report that Cohen used his Trump Organization email to facilitate the payment.
Daniels sued Trump this week in an effort to void a 2016 nondisclosure agreement that she says prevents her from speaking publicly about an alleged affair with Trump more than a decade ago. Trump allegedly never signed the deal himself, which Daniels's attorneys say invalidates it.
The Wall Street Journal reported in January that Cohen arranged the $130,000 payment to Daniels mere weeks before Election Day as part of a deal requiring her to keep silent about the alleged affair.
The White House has denied that Trump ever carried on an affair with Daniels, whose real name is Stephanie Clifford.
Cohen acknowledged last month that he made the payment, but has insisted that it came from his own personal funds and was not tied to Trump's presidential campaign. "
Cohen says Stormy Daniels payment was transferred from his home equity line
Remember Daniels tried to sue Trump for NOT signing her non-disclosure agreement copy? LOL What an idiot! http://www.avclub.com/stormy-daniels-is-now-suing-trump-for-not-actually-sign-1823568801
FragrantGrace
If winning isn't everything why do they keep score
Edited to comment on the "Optimistic" rating. Facts are not grounded in optimism. The Left thinking Trump is going to be taken out of office, barring a life threatening crime HRC is known for arranging against her enemies, is optimism!
Trump 2020! Watch-N-C
Erebus
Well-Known Member
Okay so that post was definitely ... long.
I'm not sure what, if anything, it has to do with the subject though. I actually thought you'd engaged in a particularly elaborate whataboutism yourself but your opening line gave me pause.
It appears you're suggesting that criticisms of Trump are universally false and part of a smear campaign by the left. Am I interpreting you correctly?
FragrantGrace
If winning isn't everything why do they keep score
Yes, it was long.
I'll make it simple for you. The what you call, whataboutisms, in that post was actually a clearly failed effort to turn reasonable readers toward the facts when they're looking for evidence of corruption in politics.
The effort was to show evidence abounds, hard evidence, against Democrats .
While none, including the Mueller report, proves the false allegations against Trump.
In fact, as a matter of record, everything that has been charged against Trump as wrong doing and from Russia collusion to campaign finance issues, has been proven to have real evidence of those wrong doings against Hillary R. Clinton, Barack Obama, and James Comey.
So the whataboutism means to turn people who are offended by criminal behavior by our elected officials past or present toward the reality that it is there. Only not attaching itself to Trump!
But he's a Republican! That makes him guilty just when someone whispers the latest conspiracy.
While Democrats are more than happy, clearly as Hillary isn't in prison, Barack isn't in prison, Comey isn't in prison, to look away from real proof of real crime.
Liberal partisanship condones Liberal crime. And scapegoats Christian Republicans.
Erebus
Well-Known Member
Oh make no mistake, I perfectly understood that you wanted to point to criminal activity coming from Democrats. It's worth pointing out though that even the most serious problems with one person don't negate the problems with another.
To illustrate:
Imagine that I commit armed robbery but don't end up actually shooting anybody. My partner on the other hand does shoot somebody. If I faced trial, the fact that my partner shot somebody and I didn't doesn't change the fact that I still committed armed robbery.
So, even if you argue that Clinton/Obama are worse than Trump, that still doesn't negate any problems Trump himself has. If the discussion is about Trump's shortcomings and your response is to simply point out those of Clinton/Obama, that's whataboutism. It's an attempt to muddy the waters.
That doesn't actually seem to be what you're doing though. You really do appear to believe that criticisms of Trump are entirely baseless. Now I have very little affection for either Clinton or Obama (or the overwhelming majority of politicians for that matter) but if that's your stance, we're definitely going to struggle to find any common ground here.