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two houses of Israel: Judah and Ephraim

PHOTOTAKER

PHOTOTAKER

Well-Known Member
sience church was canceled today i was thinking about this passage from Ezekiel 37:15-20:
15The word of the LORD came again unto me, saying,
16Moreover, thou son of man, take thee one stick, and write upon it, For Judah, and for the children of Israel his companions: then take another stick, and write upon it, For Joseph, the stick of Ephraim and for all the house of Israel his companions:
17And join them one to another into one stick; and they shall become one in thine hand.
18And when the children of thy people shall speak unto thee, saying, Wilt thou not shew us what thou meanest by these?
19Say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will take the stick of Joseph, which is in the hand of Ephraim, and the tribes of Israel his fellows, and will put them with him, even with the stick of Judah, and make them one stick, and they shall be one in mine hand.
20And the sticks whereon thou writest shall be in thine hand before their eyes.

most people of authority has sugested that the "stick" in verse 16 to mean scriptor or in other works the bible which come from Judah. what is the set of scriptor from Ephraim?
 
NoahideHiker

NoahideHiker

Religious Headbanger
This is speaking of the reunification of the divided kingdom. Judah will be brought back together with Ephraim. This is a pivotal messianic prophecy because this must happen before the new covenant of Jeremiah 31 can take place.

9. Hear the word of the Lord, O nations, and declare it on the islands from afar, and say, "He Who scattered Israel will gather them together and watch them as a shepherd his flock.

30. Behold, days are coming, says the Lord, and I will form a covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah, a new covenant.

Ezekiel 37 is a wonder foretelling of the age of redemption and the world to come.
 
PHOTOTAKER

PHOTOTAKER

Well-Known Member
NoahideHiker said:
This is speaking of the reunification of the divided kingdom. Judah will be brought back together with Ephraim. This is a pivotal messianic prophecy because this must happen before the new covenant of Jeremiah 31 can take place.

9. Hear the word of the Lord, O nations, and declare it on the islands from afar, and say, "He Who scattered Israel will gather them together and watch them as a shepherd his flock.

30. Behold, days are coming, says the Lord, and I will form a covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah, a new covenant.

Ezekiel 37 is a wonder foretelling of the age of redemption and the world to come.
Click to expand...


your currect with what you have shown, but to the passage that i show its about record keeping, i'll respond fully in more detail later...
 
PHOTOTAKER

PHOTOTAKER

Well-Known Member
sorry it took me a long time to respond to this it took me a while to get back on the computer and then to find this forum... i do have a photograph of a "stick" or wooden document but i cannot figure out how to put it on i'll try... the "stick" is like a panel the image i have has three panels connected by brass or leather and can be joined continualy. back around 600 bc they used them for writing documents just like the stone or clay tablets that were found not too many of them survived.

i quoted some these from the "old testament student manual: kings though malachi 2nd edution"

Both stick, in the English King James Version, and rod, in the Greek Septuagint Version, are very unusual translations of the Hebrew word etz . . . whose basic meaning is wood. . . .

The modern nation of Iraq includes almost all of Mesopotamia, the homeland of the ancient kingdoms of Assyria and Babylonia. In 593 B.C., when Ezekiel was called to be a prophet, he was living in exile in Babylonia. . . . As he walked its streets, he would have seen the typical scribe pressing a wedge-shaped stylus into moist clay tablets to make the complex writings familiar to us as cuneiform (wedge-shaped). But scholars today know that other kinds of records were being made in Mesopotamia: papyrus, parchment, and wooden tablets. Though only the clay tablets have survived the millennia, writers referred to the other writing materials on their clay tablets. [One such writing style was called “wood tablets.”]
 
PHOTOTAKER

PHOTOTAKER

Well-Known Member
Aqualung said:
Today? :eek: Where are you?
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this was feb 25 we got about a foot of snow and the stake that i live in the langth is about 75 miles and the width is about 45-50 miles so it was better most of everything closed down... i live in wisconsin... appletion stake... my computer crashed :( and i was really busy to respond
 
Aqualung

Aqualung

Tasty
PHOTOTAKER said:
this was feb 25 we got about a foot of snow and the stake that i live in the langth is about 75 miles and the width is about 45-50 miles so it was better most of everything closed down... i live in wisconsin... appletion stake... my computer crashed :( and i was really busy to respond
Click to expand...
Oh, my bad. This was apparantly a much older thread than I realised.
 
B

Bick

Member
Quote by Phototaker

"most people of authority has sugested that the "stick" in verse 16 to mean scriptor or in other works the bible which come from Judah. what is the set of scriptor from Ephraim?"

My favorite commentary is the Companion Bible by E.W. Bullinger.

Concerning the "sticks" in Ezek. 15-21, it is noted that the word was "wood" in the Hebrew, and figurative for anything made of it.

IMO, they were "sticks" of such size that Ezekiel could write on them, and binding the two together, indeed represented the 'oneness' of the house of Israel when The Lord will gather them from where they have been scattered around the world.

As you have quoted, Phototaker, they will then have one king over them, who, IMO, will be Jesus the Messiah (Immanuel--God with us). And this will occur when Messiah Jesus returns in power and great glory to defeat the enemies of Israel, and establish His Kingdom with Israel as head of the nations.

Bick
 
S

strengthofthepower

Bible Bully
It's amazing how Latter Day Saints take that scripture and run with it like it's talking about the Bible and the Book of Mormon being records together to testify about Christ. When if you read verses 21 and 22 it says..

21And say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will take the children of Israel from among the heathen, whither they be gone, and will gather them on every side, and bring them into their own land: 22And I will make them one nation in the land upon the mountains of Israel; and one king shall be king to them all: and they shall be no more two nations, neither shall they be divided into two kingdoms any more at all.


After the death of Solomon the Nation of Israel Split. Into the Southern Kingdom or the Kingdom of Judah led by Judah (the Tribes of Judah, Benjamin and Levi) and the Northern Kingdom or the Kingdom of Israel tribe led by the tribe of Ephraim (Ephraim, Simeon, Zebulon, Manasseh, Asher, Issachar, Gad, Reuben and Napthali). 1st. Kings 12th chapter. The Southern Kingdom over time, did not acknowledge the Northern Kingdom as part of the nation of Israel. That's why Ezekiel was instructed to take the two sticks signifying that one day the Kingdoms would come back as one and put in their rightful place.


So the sticks in the chapter are just that...sticks. Not Books...not scrolls.

Now the question you need to ask yourself is who are those tribes today.
 
Aqualung

Aqualung

Tasty
You should read Hugh Nibley on this. He does a good job defending the idea they are scrolls. Even if you don't believe it, it makes for a good read.
 
R

roberto

Active Member
PHOTOTAKER said:
sorry it took me a long time to respond to this it took me a while to get back on the computer and then to find this forum... i do have a photograph of a "stick" or wooden document but i cannot figure out how to put it on i'll try... the "stick" is like a panel the image i have has three panels connected by brass or leather and can be joined continualy. back around 600 bc they used them for writing documents just like the stone or clay tablets that were found not too many of them survived.

i quoted some these from the "old testament student manual: kings though malachi 2nd edution"

Both stick, in the English King James Version, and rod, in the Greek Septuagint Version, are very unusual translations of the Hebrew word etz . . . whose basic meaning is wood. . . .

The modern nation of Iraq includes almost all of Mesopotamia, the homeland of the ancient kingdoms of Assyria and Babylonia. In 593 B.C., when Ezekiel was called to be a prophet, he was living in exile in Babylonia. . . . As he walked its streets, he would have seen the typical scribe pressing a wedge-shaped stylus into moist clay tablets to make the complex writings familiar to us as cuneiform (wedge-shaped). But scholars today know that other kinds of records were being made in Mesopotamia: papyrus, parchment, and wooden tablets. Though only the clay tablets have survived the millennia, writers referred to the other writing materials on their clay tablets. [One such writing style was called “wood tablets.”]
Click to expand...

Read the context :

Eze 37:11 Then he said to me, Son of man, these bones are the whole house of Israel:
 
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