UnChristian - What A New Generation Really Thinks About Christianity

[Thesavorofpan]

UnChristian - What A New Generation Really Thinks About Christianity . . . and Why It Matters | Future Majority

The results of this study pleasantly surprised me. Yes many Christians are not antiscientific, antihomosexual, etc. But many are these things, and it because of their Christianity. If the pros of religion, such as having a good moral compass and empathy, can be had without religion, and I and all the atheists I know are proof of this, then religion's only value is in its cons.

There is a war of ideas out there. I find great hope in the fact that many young people are opposed to antiquated and irrational belief systems, instead being attracted to social libertarianism and the marvelous fruits that science has to offer. What this world needs is more live and let live, and less priests and more scientists. Its time to leave ancient cryptic metaphysical poems that lead to belief in ridiculous concepts, like hell being just, gays being an abomination, and the earth being a few thousand years old, behind.

Perhaps there is much more hope for this uniquely and unfortunately religious modern country than I thought there was. We apparently just need to let the older generations die out.

Lets say that we did remove all religion from our society. Will people still wonder what will happen to them when they die? Will people still ask why are we here?

Lets say that in the final days of religion, will people persucute those who still held to their religious beliefs?

 

[Smoke]

And that is what I was trying to say in response to the claim that atheists are just as guilty of thinking they have the truth. In my experience, most atheists hold the opinion that they don't have any absolute truth. They yield their beliefs to the observable and the testable, which is the exact opposite of just blindly thinking one has the truth.

I don't believe there's any absolute truth to be had -- or at the very least, not any absolute truth that's accessible to us. And I think a healthy mind continues to learn and change. Anybody who still has all the same opinions he had twenty years ago probably quit thinking twenty years ago.

 

[Smoke]

But we as a species have proven time and time again we don't need religion to fight.

Of course we don't. But while you may fight the people across the river regardless of religion, believing that they're heretics or infidels definitely gives you some extra motivation. Quite often, it motivates you to fight people you wouldn't otherwise fight at all.

 

[Smoke]

Lets say that we did remove all religion from our society.

I'm not interested in eliminating religion. I just think religion can be refined to be better than it is.

Will people still wonder what will happen to them when they die? Will people still ask why are we here?

A lot of them probably would. But I've never found religion or anything else to give any convincing answers to those questions.

 

[sandandfoam]

I don't believe there's any absolute truth to be had -- or at the very least, not any absolute truth that's accessible to us. And I think a healthy mind continues to learn and change. Anybody who still has all the same opinions he had twenty years ago probably quit thinking twenty years ago.

I agree 100%.

I also think it's pertinent to the thread that despite our identifying as an atheist and a Christian - when you pare everything back our core understanding of the world is the same. There's no absolute truth to be had by us.

 

[jmvizanko]

Lets say that we did remove all religion from our society. Will people still wonder what will happen to them when they die? Will people still ask why are we here?

Lets say that in the final days of religion, will people persucute those who still held to their religious beliefs?

Of course we'll still wonder about the main philosophical questions, but at least hopefully we won't be consulting ancient ridiculous books for the answers.

And what do you mean by persecute? Ridicule? I'm sure. But hopefully freedom of religion will always remain, and I for one would never push to try to force people to believe anything, which doesn't work anyway.

 

[jtartar]

UnChristian - What A New Generation Really Thinks About Christianity . . . and Why It Matters | Future Majority

The results of this study pleasantly surprised me. Yes many Christians are not antiscientific, antihomosexual, etc. But many are these things, and it because of their Christianity. If the pros of religion, such as having a good moral compass and empathy, can be had without religion, and I and all the atheists I know are proof of this, then religion's only value is in its cons.

There is a war of ideas out there. I find great hope in the fact that many young people are opposed to antiquated and irrational belief systems, instead being attracted to social libertarianism and the marvelous fruits that science has to offer. What this world needs is more live and let live, and less priests and more scientists. Its time to leave ancient cryptic metaphysical poems that lead to belief in ridiculous concepts, like hell being just, gays being an abomination, and the earth being a few thousand years old, behind.

Perhaps there is much more hope for this uniquely and unfortunately religious modern country than I thought there was. We apparently just need to let the older generations die out.

Jmvizanko,
Do you really think that when the old generation dies out things will be better?? Exactly what direction do you think is better??? Please do a little ratiocination on this; Are more wars better, what about immorality, crime of every kind??? Since 1914 all these things have gotten much worse. There was killed in wars during the last century, more people than was killed in all wars during the centuries after Christ until now, some say 200,000,000 people. Look at the papers, rapes, murders, thefts, home invasions, carjacking, kidnapping, and many crimes not even heard of during cnturies past. Do you really think the we are really headed in the right direction??? The truth is: when the older ones die out, there will be NO stabilizing force left to hold this world in check.
The thing happening today are exactly what happened to Rome. Rome was never conquered, it fell because of it's own immorality. The same thing is going to happen to this country.
When Jesus walked the earth, he gave a longrange prophecy about this generation. The prophecy is recorded in Matt chapter 24, Mark chapter 13, and Luke chapter 21. One of the most outstanding things would be wars, but also an increase in violence of every kind, as well as earthquakes, pestilence, and famine. Since 1914 ther has been an unprecidented increase in major earthquakes, famine is greater than at any time in history, and pestilences, such as diseases, kill more that all these combined, exactly as was recorded at Rev 6:2-8.
What you believe about religion is exactly right, following the great religions of the world has led to nothing but disaster, what the world has become today.
The real truth is: What is called Christianity today has very little, if anything, to do with the truth of the Holy Scriptures.
Jesus, Peter, and Paul recorded in the Bible what would happen after they died. They said that false teachers would arise to mislead people, for their own gain, and because of their actions many would speak abusively about true Christianity. Paul wrote much about what would happen after the Apostles died, they were the RESTRAINT Paul talked about at 1Thes 2:6-10. All Christians knew they were the authority about the Holy Scriptures, and listened to them. When they died there started the great apostasy, Acts 20:29,30, 2Tim 3:1-7, Matt 7:15-23. Notice that in these scriptures Jesus said that you can recognize false teachers by their FRUITS. The fruits of supposed chrisendom has not been good, as can easily be seen by the direction this world is heading. Notice that many would think they were pleasing God but Jesus said to get away from him, they were workers of lawlessness.
The Bible tells us that the WORD of God is ALIVE and POWERFUL, Heb 4:12,13, but false teachers put forth NO POWER to lead their followers in the right direction.
Jesus even said they would get so far from the truth that people who thought they were right, would kill God's people, thinking that they were doing God a favor, John 16:2,3.
Understand that calling yourself a Christian does not make a person a Christian, Titus 1:16. The Bible even says that people of the nations will blaspheme the name of God, because people who are CLAIMING to obey God are not doing God's will, Rom 2:23,24.
True Christianity leads the world toward a better life, false chrisendom leads the world into what we have today, and even worse into the future. This is why Jesus said that God is looking for ones to worship Him in spirit and truth, John 4:23,24.

 

[jmvizanko]

Jmvizanko,
Do you really think that when the old generation dies out things will be better?? Exactly what direction do you think is better??? Please do a little ratiocination on this; Are more wars better, what about immorality, crime of every kind??? Since 1914 all these things have gotten much worse. There was killed in wars during the last century, more people than was killed in all wars during the centuries after Christ until now, some say 200,000,000 people. Look at the papers, rapes, murders, thefts, home invasions, carjacking, kidnapping, and many crimes not even heard of during cnturies past. Do you really think the we are really headed in the right direction??? The truth is: when the older ones die out, there will be NO stabilizing force left to hold this world in check.
The thing happening today are exactly what happened to Rome. Rome was never conquered, it fell because of it's own immorality. The same thing is going to happen to this country.
When Jesus walked the earth, he gave a longrange prophecy about this generation. The prophecy is recorded in Matt chapter 24, Mark chapter 13, and Luke chapter 21. One of the most outstanding things would be wars, but also an increase in violence of every kind, as well as earthquakes, pestilence, and famine. Since 1914 ther has been an unprecidented increase in major earthquakes, famine is greater than at any time in history, and pestilences, such as diseases, kill more that all these combined, exactly as was recorded at Rev 6:2-8.
What you believe about religion is exactly right, following the great religions of the world has led to nothing but disaster, what the world has become today.
The real truth is: What is called Christianity today has very little, if anything, to do with the truth of the Holy Scriptures.
Jesus, Peter, and Paul recorded in the Bible what would happen after they died. They said that false teachers would arise to mislead people, for their own gain, and because of their actions many would speak abusively about true Christianity. Paul wrote much about what would happen after the Apostles died, they were the RESTRAINT Paul talked about at 1Thes 2:6-10. All Christians knew they were the authority about the Holy Scriptures, and listened to them. When they died there started the great apostasy, Acts 20:29,30, 2Tim 3:1-7, Matt 7:15-23. Notice that in these scriptures Jesus said that you can recognize false teachers by their FRUITS. The fruits of supposed chrisendom has not been good, as can easily be seen by the direction this world is heading. Notice that many would think they were pleasing God but Jesus said to get away from him, they were workers of lawlessness.
The Bible tells us that the WORD of God is ALIVE and POWERFUL, Heb 4:12,13, but false teachers put forth NO POWER to lead their followers in the right direction.
Jesus even said they would get so far from the truth that people who thought they were right, would kill God's people, thinking that they were doing God a favor, John 16:2,3.
Understand that calling yourself a Christian does not make a person a Christian, Titus 1:16. The Bible even says that people of the nations will blaspheme the name of God, because people who are CLAIMING to obey God are not doing God's will, Rom 2:23,24.
True Christianity leads the world toward a better life, false chrisendom leads the world into what we have today, and even worse into the future. This is why Jesus said that God is looking for ones to worship Him in spirit and truth, John 4:23,24.

First off, please link me evidence that there is a stastically significant increase in earthquakes in recent time. And the end times events you say Jesus "prophesized" are a pretty generic list of bad things. And the reason more people have died in wars is because there are so many more people, and wars now can reach a much larger scale. And why if atheism is leading to more rape and murder are there less of these evils in the most irreligious nations? Surely there are other factors, but religion is certainly one that factors in.

I don't buy your whole true scotsman argument. Christians today literally believe that the form of Christianity they are practicing is correct. Of course nobody knows what Christ would have exactly wanted, since the bible is all we have of him, and is incredibly nebulous, cryptic, vague, and open to inerpretation. I'm sure you could find a thousand biblical scholars that think your whole interpretation of Christianity is flawed on many counts.

And I fail to see your whole immorality leading to the destruction of civilaztion argument as valid at all either. Most unbelievers I know are good people with good moral compasses. Do you really think things like gay marriage and legalized prostitution are going to destroy everything? Because I don't buy it.

 

[Thesavorofpan]

Of course we'll still wonder about the main philosophical questions, but at least hopefully we won't be consulting ancient ridiculous books for the answers.

quote]

What would we use instead. I find the Scientific Method wouldn't really work for those questions.

 

[no-body]

Lets say that we did remove all religion from our society. Will people still wonder what will happen to them when they die? Will people still ask why are we here?

Of course people still would, but it would be a better world if they would look inside themselves for the answer instead of clinging to meaningless dogma and symbols.

 

[indian tea]

Christianity is terrible...look at al the undue cruelty done to rocks...

Churches should be banned

 

[indian tea]

power means responsibility.
imo...

and electricity...

 

[jmvizanko]

What would we use instead. I find the Scientific Method wouldn't really work for those questions.

That's what philosophy is for. And independent of theology, you rarely find it justifying antiscience or intolerant authoritarianism.

 

[indian tea]

That's what philosophy is for. And independent of theology, you rarely find it justifying antiscience or intolerant authoritarianism.

philosophy is as equally useless

its a bunch of sweaty naked greek men all sitting around
discussing butter, like in a HE Bates novel....

A real man goes down the pub and has a curry

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Lets say that we did remove all religion from our society. Will people still wonder what will happen to them when they die? Will people still ask why are we here?

No doubt people still will. But God and the afterlife would likely become more of a non-issue since we don't really have any proof either way, and people will still wonder but probably worry less as a concept of eternal damnation isn't prominent. As for asking why we are hear, there are many ways to approach that question so it will still be around.

Of course we don't. But while you may fight the people across the river regardless of religion, believing that they're heretics or infidels definitely gives you some extra motivation. Quite often, it motivates you to fight people you wouldn't otherwise fight at all.

It does. But it also takes a corrupt individual to take on the role of puppet master to use religion to manipulate people. There is no denying religion is a very convenient excuse, but I really doubt the amount of violence would decrease by any significant amount if religion vanished. Rather, religious superiority and violence would be replaced by other ideologies. The Cold War showed us that government superiority is very capable of breeding hostilities for no other reason than America was different from Russia and other Communist nations and vice versa.