Understanding Atheism

[we-live-now]

It simply comes down to all religions together not Christianity. The Bible is flawed and its origins are known well enough to say it is not divine. Atheists reject the existence of all gods or any based on the lack of evidence not on their emotional whims.
You can create the nicest god possible like Krishna for example and still an atheist would deny it because of the lack of evidence for this god's existence. That is it simply. Until evidence is provided an atheist will remain an atheist

That is a good point.

What if an atheist could invent his or her own God outside of all religions?

What would they be like?

 

[we-live-now]

That is a big if to an atheist. If there were a god such as this comes under the same category as "if you could go back in time and change your past ...".

But hypothetically ? If there were an all-powerful beneficent loving god would I 'want to be around * ?"

Of course.

I'm happy to engage in those feelings. Those feelings are called 'rasas' in hinduism. I engage my emotions, imagination and intentions in all sorts of ways. It can be very delightful, and often very supportive and healing.

So I don't think atheists lack a belief in god because they are inimical to those positive feelings. Although some may ... I can't presume. It's more an intellectual, rational mind thing. No evidence, no belief.

But there is certainly evidence that invoking positive images of nurturing, compassion etc is healthful for body and mind.

You might like to find out more about bhakti - hindu devotional yoga. It is all about that IMO.

And it is possible to engage in bhakti as an atheist - although many hindus would be appalled at that suggestion.

In Tibetan buddhism, their are 'deities' representing these qualities and feelings, which are visualised and even prayed to. But it is also taught that these deities are aspects of our own nature. So atheism need not exclude employing such practices and feelings.

thank you for writing back. I find that very interesting. I realize my question is kind of dumb in many aspects because on one level I am asking "does everyone want to be loved"? Of course, we all know that is yes, right? But, I love to ponder these things.

I often wonder if there is such a thing as an "atheist" or even a "theist"?

It seems at times that all of us have things we don't accept because they lack "evidence" and then there are things that we simply "accept" without needing "proof". Also, one has to go very deep and come to a very concrete definition of what exactly "proof" is, don't they?

 

[we-live-now]

Yep. They are all just waiting to be bathed in the insight of a true intellect such as yours.

(Get over yourself.)​

I try, but I fail. Can I really separate "me" from myself? Wouldn't that be like trying to "pick myself up"? I may just have to die in order for that to occur.

 

[we-live-now]

Here's a question to challenge your assumptions, why do you focus on atheists not believing in the Christian god? Atheists don't believe in the Christian god, the Hindu gods, the Greek gods, etc.

I can't speak for anyone else, but personally I want to KNOW that deity exists. I want to believe, but cannot in lack of evidence. so if such a god existed as you describe, I'd still need the evidence.

That is fair. I am not focusing on a "Christian" God, but really any God. It/he/she can be whatever you want him/her/it to be. How would you define "evidence"?

 

[Rick O'Shez]

Although not specifically stated as such, it seems that there could be some posters here that may think that beliefs can be consciously chosen. I wonder if that is true?

Beliefs can be consciously challenged, but that takes personal courage, particularly if we have grown attached to them.

 

[we-live-now]

I'm a former theist, and identify as an atheist (with spiritual leanings as of late)
That said...atheism isn't really about rejecting 'god.' For me, it was more of a realization that the idea of god can only really be that...an idea. A subjective idea. For there is no objective proof of a deity's existence. Without proof, there only lies ideas...concepts...beliefs.

2+2 = 4 ...I don't believe it to be true, it just is true.

God exists...in as much as one believes him to. Atheism has showed me that reality can be scary without the crutch of religion helping me, but it has helped me rely on myself more, and grow. Not that religious people can't be introspective, but relying on a deity can cause a person to not learn how to think critically and independently. I grew up in a strict Christian household, so I speak from experience.

I resonate with much of what you said, especially about "thinking critically and independently". That is not allowed in most religions, especially the "Christian" one I used to be part of. I was told just the other day with a friend who is a pastor "I don't use logic, I used scripture".

I agreed!

 

[we-live-now]

It's because I have no reason to believe.


Why would he have created evil and made bad things happen to us if he was perfect and loving?

What would stop an all powerful god from being with us?

Why would an all powerful god need our help to rule?

re: "Why would he have created evil and made bad things happen to us if he was perfect and loving?"

Also, why would we be made/created to die? (That's one I would have)

re: "Why would an all powerful god need our help to rule?"

What if he/she/it didn't' need us, but just wanted us to be with him?

 

[we-live-now]

I speak as an pagan who lives as an atheist;

I want a God(read as, the Christo-Islamic Creator Interventionist) who I know to be there, not ones who show up every 1 out of 9,999,999,999,999 times. I want a God who don't let the world turn to **** and allow 6 or more million people to die FOR NOTHING. I want a God who will give me comfort as I suffer.

Give me that and I'll worship. If not, if s/he exists and doesn't do that, I will rebel. Satan can not possibly be worse. In fact, he is better, because atleast he has the balls to say "This shouldn't be".

Awesome. I am totally with you. Btw, what is the difference between a "pagan" and an "atheist"?

 

[we-live-now]

Great questions. For me it is simply the lack of evidence that stands between me and belief in the existence of a god. Well no, and I don't mean to offend you - but you are describing some sort of all powerful parent, I would not want to hang around him mainly because I am an adult and do not need a parent any more - I am a parent.

That is a great point. My parents aren't my best friends... How would you define "evidence"?

 

[we-live-now]

Why do you say atheists reject God? Most atheists are pretty much indifferent to God.

I don't think that is what I am saying, but I like the last part of your statement.

So, do some "atheists" believe "God" exists but simply ignore him/her/it? I am really trying to figure out what an "atheist" is I guess...and then decide if there really is such a thing (as taught and attacked by the Christian religion)

 

[Laika]

I apologize if this is the wrong spot to post this. I am curious.

I am trying to understand Atheism better. I believe most atheists are some of the most intelligent and sharpest people around.

(Just so you understand my viewpoint, I am a person who believes the Bible is God's word and literally true, but we simply can't see this hidden "true reality" yet. However, I don't like to call myself a "Christian" because they have so much religious garbage that man mixed in and has to "do".)

So, my question is this.

Do most atheists reject "God" because of the way he is portrayed by the broken and blind people called "Christians" who follow him/her? Or is it something else?

Let's say we could invent our own God who:

1) Is like the most loving father, brother, mother, best friend that most of us never had that we just wanted to be with all the time.
2) Is all powerful and all knowing and all sovereign with no "buts" ( and not "double-speak" like the Christians teach)
3) Loves us all truly unconditionally exactly as we are and simply wants to spend every moment loving us
4) Requires nothing of us in return (and if he did, he would give it to us)
5) Assures us that "all will see me and be with me one day" and no person will be left out regardless of their religion or beliefs.
6) Overlooks all your wrongs and mistakes but lovingly tries to help you with them.
7) Wants to give us all things and help him rule and reign

If there was such a God as this, would atheists want to be around him/her/it? Why or why not?

Atheism is kind of a large umbrella term, so you will get a lot of different responses.

If God existed, I would probably not worship him as I want to be free- though, if he's decent enough I wouldn't mind getting to know him. Maybe it's my subversive streak, but it would be kind of cool to know which "god" he/she/it was and laugh at our very human failings for thinking we all have know the answer. It's always possible I'm wrong, but that's part of being free.

This puts me on the edge of being a militant atheist, but I'm not really cruel or angry enough to be hostile to religious people. I don't believe that religion and freedom are compatible. I don't want his guidance as I feel it would compromise my individuality; if I want it, I would ask for it. I think if the love of god was unconditional he would understand that. I'd (try to) treat him like an equal, not necessarily out of arrogance, but because I have as much right to be free as anyone else. If god wanted me to give that up... well, I'd tell him where to get off and use my immoral soul and all eternity to fight for my freedom.

God could be my friend, perhaps even a best friend as unconditional love is a rare trait, but not someone who could 'rule' me.

 

[we-live-now]

It's impossible to be indifferent towards something one does not believe exists. So perhaps better to say indifferent to ideas about god ?

.

What a great point.

 

[we-live-now]

Regarding op.

It's due to the fact that information such as that of there being a god is introduced by which before, there was no such introduction at the start by any sort of deity.

Atheism imc is simply returning to what's original and letting god himself/herself /itself actually make the introductions provided of course any god is there to even make one. Human descriptions and allusion is not enough if they are the only ones doing all the talking with nothing going on anywhere else.

Otherwise there is just simply no god to speak of and the matter is settled by default.

Nice. I have an innate sense that as soon as we define "God" or even give him/her/it a name, we already missed him/her it.

 

[we-live-now]

Atheism is kind of a large umbrella term, so you will get a lot of different responses.

If God existed, I would probably not worship him as I want to be free- though, if he's decent enough I wouldn't mind getting to know him. Maybe it's my subversive streak, but it would be kind of cool to know which "god" he/she/it was and laugh at our very human failings for thinking we all have know the answer. It's always possible I'm wrong, but that's part of being free.

This puts me on the edge of being a militant atheist, but I'm not really cruel or angry enough to be hostile to religious people. I don't believe that religion and freedom are compatible. I don't want his guidance as I feel it would compromise my individuality; if I want it, I would ask for it. I think if the love of god was unconditional he would understand that. I'd (try to) treat him like an equal, not necessarily out of arrogance, but because I have as much right to be free as anyone else. If god wanted me to give that up... well, I'd tell him where to get off and use my immoral soul and all eternity to fight for my freedom.

God could be my friend, perhaps even a best friend as unconditional love is a rare trait, but not someone who could 'rule' me.

I like and agree with what you said about "religion and freedom" not being compatible.

Imagine if we found out one day that our very being and person we think we are on earth (in a human body) was really a part of the eternal "God", "source", "universe" or (whatever name you give him/her/it) hidden inside a human body?

 

[Cephus]

Beliefs can be consciously challenged, but that takes personal courage, particularly if we have grown attached to them.

Beliefs should *ALWAYS* be consciously challenged, every single one of them, regardless of one's personal and emotional attachment. That's the only way to see if they are actually true.

 

[Nietzsche]

Awesome. I am totally with you. Btw, what is the difference between a "pagan" and an "atheist"?

Pagans is an umbrella term for the Non-Abrahamic religions. The Greeks were pagans, the Norse, the Celts, Ancient Egypt, Native Americans, Hindus are technically pagans, so on and so forth.

Pagans do believe in Gods. They just tend to believe in pantheons rather than a singular deity.

I believe in the Norse Gods. But as I stated, I live as though they are not real, because within Asatru, the Gods do not expect things from you. Not worship, not reverence, ect. I make my decisions with my own reason.

 

[Laika]

I like and agree with what you said about "religion and freedom" not being compatible.

Imagine if we found out one day that our very being and person we think we are on earth (in a human body) was really a part of the eternal "God", "source", "universe" or (whatever name you give him/her/it) hidden inside a human body?

I'd prefer not to be immortal. I think it's kind of greedy in a way. I'd much rather the world can move on without me; that way I let others be free. immortality implies some kind of control and I don't really need it. Dying will still suck though- whenever it comes.

 

[fantome profane]

That is a good point.

What if an atheist could invent his or her own God outside of all religions?

What would they be like?

Invented.

 

[we-live-now]

I'd prefer not to be immortal. I think it's kind of greedy in a way. I'd much rather the world can move on without me; that way I let others be free. immortality implies some kind of control and I don't really need it. Dying will still suck though- whenever it comes.

Interesting viewpoint. I can see that.

Part of me things that the entire world is my family but we just don't know or see it yet. That one day we will all celebrate together. "God" will bring the drinks and the food! Maybe I am a dreamer...

 

[Rick O'Shez]

Beliefs should *ALWAYS* be consciously challenged, every single one of them, regardless of one's personal and emotional attachment. That's the only way to see if they are actually true.

I agree, but I wonder how many really manage to do it?