Understanding Cosmology (Post 1)

[Ben Dhyan]

More assertions without evidence of vague concepts without any logical structure to back them up beyond assuming the conclusion. Yawn.

Your beliefs depend on not understanding. One day though.

 

[shunyadragon]

The ego self believes in soul, whereas the soul is one with the source of life and is not separate from the source, so it comes down to what you self identify with, the body or soul. So a novice spiritual devotee may believe in soul, the more spiritually evolved person will have experienced being united with the source so belief is no longer relevant. Iow, belief in God is only relevant until the union state has been realized, then is not needed any longer.

Again subjective beliefs like this is OK, it is your belief. One of many conflicting beliefs, Not much help understanding factually about the cosmology and physics of our universe,

Your beliefs depend on not understanding. One day though.

Your?!?!!? Accusations and taking some sort of egocentric high road does not contribute to the discussion

The bottom line is you have shown some basic misunderstanding of science, physics and cosmology based on your religious agenda no matter how superior you feel.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Again subjective beliefs like this is OK, it is your belief. One of many conflicting beliefs, Not much help understanding factually about the cosmology and physics of our universe,

Your?!?!!? Accusations and taking some sort of egocentric high road does not contribute to the discussion

The bottom line is you have shown some basic misunderstanding of science, physics and cosmology based on your religious agenda no matter how superior you feel.

I don't need conceptual science, physics, and cosmology to understand that the universe exists, reality is forever on the other side of conceptualization of reality.

Try to understand that as long as you are relying on the conceptualization of reality to understand reality, you can never realize it.

 

[shunyadragon]

I don't need conceptual science, physics, and cosmology to understand that the universe exists,

OK

reality is forever on the other side of conceptualization of reality.

Not comprehendable and terribly open ended.

Try to understand that as long as you are relying on the conceptualization of reality to understand reality, you can never realize it.

Never is one of those that is never true. I do not always rely on the conceptualization of reality, but your problem is you reject it based on a religious agenda.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

OK

Not comprehendable and terribly open ended.

Never is one of those that is never true. I do not always rely on the conceptualization of reality, but your problem is you reject it based on a religious agenda.

I am using conceptualization all the while in these forum exchanges, but yes, as soon as I am not interacting with people, stilling the mind is the priority. Conceptualization has its place, so does a meditative still mind.

 

[shunyadragon]

I am using conceptualization all the while in these forum exchanges, but yes, as soon as I am not interacting with people, stilling the mind is the priority. Conceptualization has its place, so does a meditative still mind.

Actually, I have for many many years studied and practiced meditations and the Arts of the Way (Martial Arts) including nine years in Chinese parks, and stilling the mind. It is very important to one's spiritual well being. Yes the "open mind" is a priority to comprehend the Universal without bias. My belief is it should free us from the burdens of the past, and comprehend reality more clearly as it is and NOT based on ancient tribal paradigms.
The evolving knowledge of the sciences is how we understand the physical universal without the burden of past paradigms. I am 78.

In China the symbol of the mountain is three mountains, and most sacred places in China are three mountains. No matter what mountain you climb there is always one higher. One of the purposes of stilling the mind is still any consideration of self importance.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Actually, I have for many many years studied and practiced meditations and the Arts of the Way (Martial Arts) including nine years in Chinese parks, and stilling the mind. It is very important to one's spiritual well being. My belief is it should free us from the burdens of the past, and comprehend reality more clearly as it is and NOT based on ancient tribal paradigms. I am 78.

"free us from the burdens of the past, and comprehend reality more clearly as it is" is precisely the result. A lot of the old 'tribal paradigms' actually become quite meaningful when 'comprehended more clearly', and take on the deeper significance originally intended.

 

[metis]

God is all that is, nothing does not exist. From the human perspective, there is a creator/unmanifest aspect of God and a creation manifested aspect, but the two are one. The manifested aspect of God is the material universe, including energy.

Thanks for the clarification, and I can accept that as a hypothesis.

 

[shunyadragon]

"free us from the burdens of the past, and comprehend reality more clearly as it is" is precisely the result.

Part of this is the acceptance of science as science without the bias of ancient tribal agendas without science.

A lot of the old 'tribal paradigms' actually become quite meaningful when 'comprehended more clearly', and take on the deeper significance originally intended.

No

 

[wellwisher]

I debated on whether to get into why we know space is expanding, but at a certain point I'd be explaining the basics forever. So, I will answer questions under each different post about the subjects they contain.

The red shift, used to explain expansion, can also be explained with increasing entropy, as a replacement for motion. As a thought experiment, say I had a sphere of compressed gas. There are valves on all sides, so when I open all the valves the sphere is designed to remain stationary; propelling forces all cancel. If you ever used spray paint, the can will get colder as you spray, due to the expansion of the gas; paint, increasing entropy and absorbing heat.

Say I place that sphere in space and have a team, without them knowing, do a doppler shift analysis on it. I say I just found a strange fast moving object. I open the valve, and the sphere will appear to red shift as it gets colder; longer and longer wavelength from the gas expansion, while not actually moving. If they were Doppler shift biased, they will tell me it is moving fast, although stationary.

If the entropy of the universe has to increase, and an entropy increase absorbs energy, one would expect an entropic red shift in the ambient energy. These emissions, from distant objects, can take millions of years to reach us. What are the odds the 2nd law, via intergalactic matter, will not take way energy from this emitted energy, and entropy red shift it, knowing the entropy has to increase?

If the laws of physics are the same everywhere, and the galaxies are expanding relative to each other, we should see a uniform final energy background due to the similar galactic emissions of all, more of less processing energy via entropy the same way. Distant objects will get more time to entropy process energy; more time red shifting all the way to microwaves. I think they need to adjust for entropy based red shift beyond motion or Doppler shift.

Typically, for any given material, if confined in less space, the entropy goes down and energy is given off; compressor is exothermic. When expanded to have more space, entropy goes up; evaporator is endothermic. If we approach another object this means less space between; entropic blue shift. If we move away means, more space between appear; entropic red shift. This is more general and can be due to motion, as well as changes between space-time references; GR and SR.

Say we had to factories one is on a space-time contracted reference were time slows. The other is on a space-time expanded reference, where time speeds up. We sit on a middle reference between, watching both and comparing. If the laws physics are same in all there references, and two bookend factories are the same and each sees 10 defects; measure of entropy in their reference per hour, the expanded reference, relative to us in the middle, will appear to add more defect per house; our reference, than the time dilated reference.

As the universe expanded the rate of the 2nd law increases. The expanding universe is quickening over time with then rate of change to increasing complexity speeding up. This needs to be added to the entropic red shift as a function of space-time expansion.

 

[gnostic]

If the laws of physics are the same everywhere, and the galaxies are expanding relative to each other, we should see a uniform final energy background due to the similar galactic emissions of all, more of less processing energy via entropy the same way. Distant objects will get more time to entropy process energy; more time red shifting all the way to microwaves. I think they need to adjust for entropy based red shift beyond motion or Doppler shift.

While the redshift used in astrophysics do has it root in the Doppler Shift, it differed from the original redshift theory (Doppler Shift), as the cosmological redshift are not just based on motion (distance & velocity), but also on gravitational effects that play a huge role to the redshift, in which the Doppler Effect completely ignored.

Do not confuse Gravitational Redshift and Doppler Effect as if they are one and the same.

 

[paarsurrey]

Understanding Cosmology

The truthful religion encourages to study cosmology, to those who are interested in it, as it explains as to how One G-d created the universe and whatever is in it, right, please?:

6:1
بِسۡمِ اللّٰہِ الرَّحۡمٰنِ الرَّحِیۡمِ ﴿۱
In the name of Allah, the Gracious, the Merciful.
6:2
اَلۡحَمۡدُ لِلّٰہِ الَّذِیۡ خَلَقَ السَّمٰوٰتِ وَالۡاَرۡضَ وَجَعَلَ الظُّلُمٰتِ وَالنُّوۡرَ ۬ؕ ثُمَّ الَّذِیۡنَ کَفَرُوۡا بِرَبِّہِمۡ یَعۡدِلُوۡنَ ﴿۲
All praise belongs to Allah Who created the heavens and the earth and brought into being every kind of darkness and light; yet those who disbelieve set up equals to their Lord.

Holy Quran: Read, Listen and Search

In Arabic, Chinese, English, French, German, Italian, Spanish and Urdu.

www.alislam.org

Original Arabic narration/text from Muhammad's time together with its English translation rendered by Maulawi Sher Ali, is given above ^.
Right?

Regards

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Part of this is the acceptance of science as science without the bias of ancient tribal agendas without science.


No

And part of this is the acceptance of religion as religion without the bias of modern tribal agendas without religion.

Yes

 

[shunyadragon]

And part of this is the acceptance of religion as religion without the bias of modern tribal agendas without religion.

Yes

If you are referring to science. It does not represent a modern tribal agenda with or without religion, It is simply science as science without an agenda. Science as science is accepted in academics worldwide without tribal boundaries as with religions.

Acceptance of religion as religion? Which one of the many contradictory conflicting religions do propose we should accept above others without the bias.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

If you are referring to science. It does not represent a modern tribal agenda with or without religion, It is simply science as science without an agenda. Science as science is accepted in academics worldwide without tribal boundaries as with religions.

Acceptance of religion as religion? Which one of the many contradictory conflicting religions do propose we should accept above others without the bias.

I was referring to the tribal atheists, agnostics, and lukewarm religious types.

They are not necessarily contradictory to the adherents of each, so accept that which one understands, water finds its own level.