There are no facts here.
That's public opinion.
It's a social poll, just like the approval rating of the president.
It's an opinion. You do know how to distinguish an opinion from a fact?
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University poll finds most Americans fear the “Deep State”
- Thread starter Shaul
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There are no facts here.
That's public opinion.
It's a social poll, just like the approval rating of the president.
It's an opinion. You do know how to distinguish an opinion from a fact?
tytlyf
Not Religious
If there is a deep state, it's not democratic. And yes, there are the likes of the Mercers and Kochs who would definitely be in the 'deep state' camp. People that take advantage of the middle class for their own benefit. If you listen to Rush, you'll hear him refer to Trump as an 'outsider.' Rush is part of the circle of republican establishment elitists and would definitely be part of that club.
So, who are the insiders Rush is referring to? If you listen carefully to Rush, you'll hear him give up the game. Rush likes to talk about receiving emails from certain people, but doesn't ever mention names.
So you have this insider circle of greedy individuals trying to take advantage of America for their own gain. Only 1 party is in favor of unlimited, anonymous donations buying elections. Only 1 party supports 'citizens united.'
When it comes to the Koch's, they're Big Oil and will do whatever they can to stomp on anything that can hurt profits. Regulations, safety laws, etc are viewed as profit-reducers. Doesn't matter if the pollution harms us normal folk. They don't care.
Hmmm.
If “Deep state” is meant to refer to a unified secret cabal within our government, then no, I don’t believe such exists.
But I don’t think it’s unlikely that there are unelected government officials who seek to secretly manipulate policy. Advisors and chiefs of staff, for instance, can regulate the information the president receives or who is allowed access.
It depends, too, on what is meant by “secret”: simply things that are unknown or unpublicized to the public? or secret to those in office as well?
Also, what of lobbyists/ large donors? They are not government or military but they certainly secretly coordinate national policy among their beneficiaries. Again, not sure I’d label them “deep state”; but the idea is similar— a group of unelected people secretly controlling the government.
Instead of right wing media I should have said fox news. Hope that clarifies.
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
That's kind of what I'm feeling about it.
There's a "surface" for what everybody sees in news and media. Then there's the behind the doors, closed room kind of deals that goes on that nobody ever will know about.
I'm not going so far to say there is a Illuminati running national and world affairs, but I do think the government does a lot of things incognito that it will never tell the public.
Stanyon
WWMRD?
It's been clear for quite a while now, hopefully that thinking does not cloud your assessments and judgements from here on out, I am counting the minutes on my watch in hopeful thinking.
What do you spend your minutes thinking about?
I dont let fox news bother me its pretty entertaining stuff and most of the Trump supporters tend to parrot the stuff.
Woberts
The Perfumed Seneschal
And?
If they truly believe that {conspiracy} happened, then their motive for going around telling people about it could be justified as their patriotic and moral duty.
I don't think it's a question of demonization. After all, the demonization of government is one of Americans' favorite pastimes.
But something within them leads away from more direct explanations,
& to blaming unseen conspirators, ie, the demons who cause the trouble.
Some would excuse government by blaming the conspirators for what they force government to do.
An example is those who blame the Military Industrial Complex for the wars.
The better explanation is that voters elect & re-elect politicians who start &
continue wars. There's no observable correlation between this nebulous
MIC & wars, but there is between voters & wars.
Kangaroo Feathers
Yea, it is written in the Book of Cyril...
Never heard of Monmouth University before.
It may be more a matter of projection and/or exaggeration of known and proven examples of government corruption or other malfeasance, incompetence, or general foolishness. There's no shortage of "demons" out there one could trot out, if one has a serious grudge with government and wants to generate hatred against the government.
We've all heard the stories about crooked politicians, Mafia bosses, evil corporate overlords out to control everything. It's in all the movies, so the public is already primed towards believing in these kinds of things.
Well, yes and no. True, the voters elect the politicians who make policy and start wars, but voters are selecting what they see as a public face and often (albeit naively) believe what they say and promise. Likewise, they might believe all the negative stuff they say about their opponents. Politics is a dirty business, and the voters have very little viable choice. Lesser of two evils.
They could vote for the Communist Party. Or they could vote for the Libertarian Party. A lot of people don't even bother to vote at all.
But as to whether we should go to war or not, the politicians present the information to their constituents (who also get a lot of their information from the media), and they try to get the public to support the idea of going to war. Or there might be some heinous event like 9/11 to fire up the public into a war fever.
In other words, I don't believe the voters deliberately vote in warmongering politicians just because they actually want the US to go to war, not without a good reason anyway. I think that the politicians and media might present a certain skewed and biased perception of the outside world in such a way that makes people believe that some wars or other military actions are necessary. A lot of voters believe it and actively try to persuade others to believe it, and this is how voters ending selecting politicians who then order the military to do what they do. The military then goes to the private sector and buys whatever materials and equipment they need, for which the private sector contractors and vendors make money.
It's not necessarily far-fetched or even a conspiracy theory that a private businessperson would support any and all governmental policies which he/she believes to be profitable and lucrative for his/her own business interests. It doesn't have to prove or even imply that anything illegal is going on, but it stands to reason that they could donate to political campaigns and candidates which favor their economic interests.
But I recognize that there are those who take it too far. When I look at the larger picture, I don't really see the MIC as some kind of evil nefarious bunch as some people would paint them. I look more at the ideas propagated by our politicians and others and try to evaluate it on that basis. It's possible that their intentions may be good and honorable. Even if there are underhanded dealings and other morally questionable actions, it could be argued that it's for the greater good of protecting America and Americans from harm.
At least we never had a nuclear war. If the MIC does exist, I would at least give them credit for that. The main thing I consider regarding our military, its leadership and relationships with private military contractors, I mostly hope that they're mostly sane individuals. There may be corruption at the Pentagon - like $15,000 toilet seats and whatnot - and I would like to see them do their best to thwart that. That's wasting and stealing the taxpayers' money. There may be some private deals made between military personnel and contractors - bribery, kickbacks, whatever. That seems plausible, although perhaps on a lower level.
But I don't think they're madmen, warmongers, or out to conquer the world. At least I hope not. That's why I don't really see the MIC in the same way that others do. I don't necessarily disagree with what they do as much as their reasoning for doing it, which is more of ideological/philosophical issue than a conspiracy theory.
So you can't name a single example of "'national policy' that you believe 'unelected government and military officials . . . secretly manipulate'"? On what basis do you believe that the "Deep State" exists, then?Um, “secretly manipulate” would be something done in secret.
So you want people to post examples like some sort of debate piñata since they don’t know what criteria you would use. Why don’t you describe the sort of evidence you would find acceptable so people could then know how to reply to your request?
Wow. Don’t lose your tin-foil hat.
tytlyf
Not Religious
Those are the facts. I'd suggest you look into the Kochs. If the game was obvious, it wouldn't be so successful.Wow. Don’t lose your tin-foil hat.
You have these oligarchs writing laws at our expense. Kochs created the Tea Party. The republican party uses conservatives for their votes. Outside of that, they get nothing.
Look up 'dark money.' That will lead you.
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Whoa, backup there buckeroo. Did I post saying I believed there is a deep state? I simply asked you to post what criteria would acceptable as proof there was such a thing. Do that before asking before asking for examples. The examples depend on the criteria of acceptable.
Are they worse than George Soros?
Yes, because they best indicator of authority is whether you have heard of something.
How do you answer the poll question cited in the OP?