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Vedanta and science

Aupmanyav

Be your own guru
You are quoting Lord Krishna, but what you are doing is totally different. Krishna says 'Vaasudeva Sarvam', that includes everyone, the swamis, you and me. Still you want to be a dasa to somebody. You say this person or that is Parabrahman, are you not the same? If I am Parabrahman, then to whom should I bow and for what reason. Again, Krishna says 'There does not exist any object other than me'. Again, He reitirates, you, me, and all the swamis are none other than Krishna. Leave seeing duality, see the unity; as Krishna said, 'Pandita Sama-darshinah'. I am just asking you to take Krishna's advice and remove your ignorance and that which your so-called gurus may have instilled in you, I am not doing anything else.
 

santdasji

Member
Vaasudev means the God who resides within the soul. VAAS means to reside. This is Parbrahm Bhagwan Purshottam Shri Krishna is refering to i.e Himself. Im entitled to be daas of whoever i like. So i decided it should be Parbrahm Purshottam Bhagwan. You think you are Parbrahm but you are not. You are in Bhraanti. This is called agyaanta.

When Shri Krishna is talking about 'There does not exist any object other than me'....He is talking of every atom also every soul too as He is Vasudev like i stated earlier. That does not make me Him..just that He resides in me.This is where you fall off the path my friend.

'Pandita Sama-darshinah' means the learned and wise see with sama drasthi. which means they see a lump of clay and gold as equal because he does not care for the gold and how much its worth.He sees all as Naashvant and destroyable and only Parbrahm Bhagwan is saashvat (eternal). Not that he is the same as Parbrahm.This is where you go wrong again. As your views are barren and ignorance prevails your mind from realising.

I am just asking you to take Krishnas full advice instead of cherry picking the ones you prefer and turning a blind eye to the rest of his Subodh given to Arjun, Instead of following how you think its right and being a manmukhi so you can have the easy things in life. As bad things in life are easy to achieve in life. The nishedh (dont do) is easier to follow that the vidhi (the doable deeds).

Looking back both me and Mahesh have pointed out many shlokas spoken by shri krishna which you have not responded too. Its time you looked into them as well.
 

zenzero

Its only a Label
Friend Aupmanyav,

Personal response to *daas* will be that am a *daas* of existence, cause am existing cause of IT, through It and by IT.
Being conscious of IT connects me to IT.
Rest are all forms that keep changing even the form of krishna or gautama or jesus names are just labels.

Love & rgds
 

Satsangi

Active Member
Zenzero,
Are u and "existence" seperate?" Since when? lol. Now coming to the point- yes all forms are subject to change. But devotees see this feeling of change in Lords personal form(e.g. Shri Krishna) as his maya only. They see his form is Satyaswarupa and the apparent perceived change including the Lords returning to his abode is perceived by his devotee as his maya only and NOT that maya is forcing any change in Lord's form.
Regards
 

zenzero

Its only a Label
Friend Satsangi,

Kindly understand that when am addressing a response to someone it is for the specific person and only he has to respond.
The reason is that everything has a meaning against a background. The discussion above too will have a background which and which is understood by the parties involved.
If you have any response to the questioner, kindly do so freely.
Thank you.
Love & rgds
 

Satsangi

Active Member
Understood Zenzero Sir!! I thought it was an open forum and not a discussion between two parties. But anyway if that is the way u want, so be it.
Regards
 

santdasji

Member
No Satsanghi... I want you to respond. ZenZERO was replying to my post previously.... i didnt ask him, yet he did. In same way i dont ask you to respond to mine or his YET i WANT YOU TO. Like you said this is an open forum not a one 2 one, one. ZenZERO should realise this.

Krishna, Gautam etc are not labels. LOL. They are divine names which can absolve all sin and liberate. But like i said Manmukhis like Zenzero will never accept such. Whereas mumukshus would.
 

santdasji

Member
Zenzero,
Are u and "existence" seperate?" Since when? lol. Now coming to the point- yes all forms are subject to change. But devotees see this feeling of change in Lords personal form(e.g. Shri Krishna) as his maya only. They see his form is Satyaswarupa and the apparent perceived change including the Lords returning to his abode is perceived by his devotee as his maya only and NOT that maya is forcing any change in Lord's form.
Regards

I totally agree. What is Zenzeros relpy to this?
 

zenzero

Its only a Label
Friends,

Once again kindly note that all the responses is always addressed to a particular person or to everyone as this one.
The reason is simple. Each response is against a background against which response come and if stating that even in a open forum is not against any rules.
Rgds any response to posts in any thread is a matter of free will which every human has as a part of nature for a purpose.
Best Wishes.
Love & rgds
 

zenzero

Its only a Label
Friend santdasji,
the point is being missed, over and over again.
EXACTLY.
any post with addressed specifically to an individual is meant for the individual's understanding as all responses have a background. When it is not labelled specifically then it is free for all to understand.
The individual addressed to is free to exercise his will as it is natures gift.

Love & rgds
 

Satsangi

Active Member
Friend Santdasji,
It does not make sense to respond when the person u are responding to is saying not to. There are many who advocate the concept of "unity", "consciousness", "existence" etc, and that is fine- it is their spiritual path. But, when they start saying that the Avatars of God are just like other humans, then it is THEIR HUGE SPIRITUAL MISTAKE and it is their loss. Yes, the "tej" of Atma and Parmatma is same as per scriptures and Saints, but it is just like a small lamp and the Sun respectively. That is, the "tej" is similar qualitatively only, but if Atma is a lamp, then Parmatma is the Sun.
Regards,
 

zenzero

Its only a Label
Yes, EXISTENCE IS.
There is none here!
just a medium of existence carrying out its work.

Love & rgds
 

santdasji

Member
Friend Santdasji,
It does not make sense to respond when the person u are responding to is saying not to. There are many who advocate the concept of "unity", "consciousness", "existence" etc, and that is fine- it is their spiritual path. But, when they start saying that the Avatars of God are just like other humans, then it is THEIR HUGE SPIRITUAL MISTAKE and it is their loss. Yes, the "tej" of Atma and Parmatma is same as per scriptures and Saints, but it is just like a small lamp and the Sun respectively. That is, the "tej" is similar qualitatively only, but if Atma is a lamp, then Parmatma is the Sun.
Regards,

Yes you are right. But the likes of Zen Zero like to follow a barren philosophy. Even when the truth has been witnessed by the millions.

He thinks He is parmatma. The Supreme Parbrahm. lol.
 

santdasji

Member
Then Gopalanand Swami asked, ‘Oh Maharaj ! certain Vedantis hold that God has no form and cite in support of their statement such Shrutis. Whereas devotees like Narad, Shuka and the Sanaks hold that God has form and cite such Pramans of Shrutis. Who out of these is correct ?’
Shriji Maharaj replying to the question said,‘ ‘Lord Purushottam6 is always Sakaar with form and resplendent with divine light. His Antaryami from, which is Satchitanand and which is all prevading is the divine light emanating from the divine form of Shri Purushottam Bhagvan. The Shruti says, ‘The lord looks towards Maya. When the lord sees, has he only eyes and no other limbs? Therefore he is always Sakar. Varuna, the God of water is Sakar8 in his Loka9 and in the form of water, he is formless. The God of fire is Sakar in his Loka9, Where as the flames emanating have no form. and again the Sun God has a form in his Loka9, Whereas in the form of rays, he is formless. Similarly Sat-Chit-Anand, the all pervading divine light of Lord Purushottam, is formless but Lord Purushottam is always Sakar.
Now if a doubt is raised that the Shrutis describe God as having no limbs and is all pervading, one should understand the correct interpretation of such Shrutis which imply that God has no physical limbs but possess a divine form. The Antaryami11 form of God who pervades the Jivas and Ishwaras is the divine light emanatimg from the divine form of Purusottam, and yet since it is the giver of fruits to the Jivasand Ishwaras according to their Karmas, Sat-Chit-Anand the divine light of Purusottam6 is also described as Sakar8 and those who describe it as formless have no knowledge.
Out of thousands of men, but a single one endeavors for perfection, and of those endeavoring thus, there is indeed but a single one who really knows Me in essence. At the end of many births, the wise man comes to Me, realizing (Vaasudeva is all that is) - such a great soul is indeed very rare.”

"After attaining Me, the great souls do not incur rebirth in this miserable transitory world, because they have attained the highest perfection."
Fix your mind on Me, be devoted to Me, offer service to Me, bow down to Me, and you shall certainly reach Me. I promise you because you are My very dear friend
"Setting aside all meritorious deeds (Dharma), just surrender completely to My will (with firm faith and loving contemplation). I shall liberate you from all sins. Do not fear.
To those who are continually devoted and worship me with love, I give the understanding by which they can come to me." (10.10)
"O Arjuna! There does not exist any object other than Me. The whole world is tied inside Me, like the pearls in the string of a necklace. Those who are entangled in the material world do not know of this true form of Mine. But the person who surrenders himself to Me completely and remembers Me regularly, is able to reach the stage which is beyond birth and death. Even though the solution is so simple, but all those whose mind has been misguided by the spell of materialistic pleasures, have devilish tendencies, and are indulged in corruption and petty acts, foolishly do not meditate on Me."

I would rather take Krishnas advice than yours lol.
 

Satsangi

Active Member
Shree Adi Shankaracharya was the Great Acharya who made Advaita famous and probably is held in very high esteem by all Advaitins. Can anyone explain who he followed all the Varnashram Dharmas of a Sanyasi? He need not follow any Dharmas if "everything including himself is Brahman". Not only he followed the Dharmas, but even his Sanyasi disciples were told to follow the Dharma. Please do not give the example of "the Chandala who taught Shankaracharya" here. Even after bowing to the Chandala (Shiva himself in disguise), Adi Shankara and his disciples tilll today follow Dharmas of Sanyasi. Also, why did he compose the maximum stotras of devotion to all dieties (Shiva, Vishnu, Ganesh, Surya etc) e.g Achyutam Keshavam..., Bhaj Govindam....etc if he thought he was God?

I do not doubt for even a split second that Shree Adi Shankara was a God realized Saint. He is the true Advaitin who had an Advaitic realization of God. He saw Brahman in each and every nook and corner and in each and every living being including in himself.

The answer to the above questions lies in Shrimad Bhagvatam. Shukdevji was considered as one of the greatest Atmadarshi- he who is constantly Atmaswarup and always merged in the bliss of Atma. When he saw the Child Krishna coming from the Jungle after grazing the cows, a beautiful shloka describing that moment is there in the Bhagvatam. Basically, Shukdevji's vrittis which were always submerged in the Atma were attracted like a magnet into Parmatma Shri Krishna.

This is for all Advaitins- even if you have had "Atma darshan", do not stop Bhakti and God will surely bless you with His glory.

All the greatest Saints of India - Advaitins or Dvaitins or any other philosophy- none of them have said that the Avatars of God were humans; in fact they all also followed Bhakti after their Gyan of God. I would rather follow these great Saints and what they did rather than what my mind says after reading few books or getting a degree and thinking "I am intelligent and educated person." None of the great Saints were Harvard, Oxford or IIT graduates and none were doctors or engineers!! They got their PhDs from God's University!!

Remember "no thought" is also a "thought".

Regards,
 

zenzero

Its only a Label
Friend Satsangi,

Remember "no thought" is also a "thought".
No thought or no-minds does not mean that they are not there it only means a STILL MIND and in that stillness, witnessing is complete then it is no more TWO [adwaita].

Take light when it goes to a place darkness recedes it is not that there is no more darkness. Light never knows what darkness is though darkness may know what light is.

Request kindly read other sections on RF like science and religion and a Thread that have started titled *TRUTH* [digestable form?] discuss -under comparative religion.

Love & rgds
 

Satsangi

Active Member
Friend Zenzero,
Kindly see "Ramana Maharshi speaks" thread started by Anti Religion. He clearly says goal is not to have a still mind, but destruction of mind. By nature, mind is "chanchal." Even if still now, it can run amok anytimes. There are numerous examples in Sanatan Dharma of Great Rishis getting "Yoga Bhrashta" due to their mind only.

In my opinion, Science has nothing to do with spirituality although there is a great urge in people to explain that Sanatan Dharma is scientific.

Regards,
 

zenzero

Its only a Label
Friend Satsangi,

Thank you for your response. Yes have read the lines pointed but then have not met him to understand what those words mean actually. Personal understanding on the issue is clear.
Love & rgds
 

santdasji

Member
Zenzero....just like you have not met Shri Krishna,Shri Ram or Shri Vyasji? You have not met them to understand what they say.
 
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