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Virgin-Birth Myth

A. Ben-Shema

Active Member
The myth of the virgin-birth of Jesus came from a desire by early Christians to have him fulfill what they saw as every possible Messianic prophesy from the OT.

Perhaps the most well known of these Messianic passages is from Isaiah. However, this passage is not exactly as it was once perceived by early Greek speaking (i.e. Gentile) Christians. The rendering “virgin” (in Isaiah 7:14) in some translations of the OT (e.g. the Greek LXX and many English / Christian versions) is incorrect; for this, the Hebrew ‘bethulah’ would have been used! The actual word employed here – ‘almah’ – simply means a ‘young woman’. This error, originally made in the Greek ‘Septuagint’ translation of the Old Testament (c. 3rd Century BC), which was used by early Greek speaking (Gentile) Christians, was the source of the myth of Jesus being born of a virgin (i.e. in order, as they thought, to make Him fulfill scripture)! It is important to note that the authors of the earliest extant New Testament books (i.e. the genuine Epistles of Paul and the Gospel of Mark) know nothing of a virgin birth, neither is it mentioned in the Gospel of John!

I don't remember reading any instance of a virgin birth in the OT. However, amongst the Gentiles there are many such accounts.
Zoroaster, the Persian prophet and patriarch who lived and preached in ancient Babylon, was said to have been God-begotten and virgin born. The Zoroastrian cosmology told of the world lasting for twelve thousand years in four, three-thousand year blocks of time. The last block of time began with the divine birth of the prophet and would end by ushering in the apocalyptic end of the world and the restoration of good over evil. Zoraster's birth and teaching in the world marked the opening of the final three thousand of the world span of twelve thousand years -- at the end of which term his spritual son Saoshyant, "the Coming Savior," the World Messiah, would appear, to culminate the victory of Truth over the Lie and establish forever the restoration of the pristine creation of God. As the legend tells, the birthplace of Zoroaster ... was beside the river Daiti, in the central land of the seven lands of the earth, Eran Vej ... Angra Mainyu [Demon of the Lie] rushed from the regions of the north, crying to his horde, "Annihilate him!" But the holy babe chanted aloud ... and the demons were dispersed.

In the Hellenic empire carved out by Alexander the Great during the third century BCE, these eastern beliefs and myths mingled with those of the Greeks, Egyptians, and Semitic peoples. Alexander was anxious to connect the Mediterranean world with the strange ways and customs of the Orient, and sought to connect his two empires culturally as well as politically. The Greeks had already devised well-developed concepts of divine impregnation. The savior-god Dionysus was said to have been born after Zeus visited Persephone in the form of a serpent. The Persian contribution to these Hellenic myths was to bring the fascinating idea of the virgin (parthenioi) birth to the old Dionysus and Herakles stories. Eventually the pagan mysteries had fully incorporated the virgin-birth ceremonies of the Ishtar priestesses into their own beliefs and religions as each savior-god took on the divine attribute themselves.

The Greeks related that Persephone was hidden in a cave by her mother, the goddess Demeter. While there, Persephone began weaving a great tapestry of the universe out of a web of wool. Zeus learned of her presence and approached Persephone in the guise of a serpent. She conceived a son for Zeus and named him Dionysus, whom she cared for and nurtured in the cave to protect the young child from other jealous wives of Zeus. Eventually Herakles, whom the Romans would rename Hercules, was said to have been born of a god as well. In due time Perseus, Minos, Asclepius, Miletus, and many others, were all reputably born of a specially selected mortal woman and a god in the manner of the Ishtar virgin priestesses. Often the god would impregnate the woman as a spirit in special ceremonies. Zeus was said to have impregnated Danae by visiting her as a ray of sunlight, and the dove, sacred to Ishtar, manifests itself as a Holy Ghost to impregnate Mary and announce Jesus as the son of God.

One result of the Persian-Hellenic blend of myths was Mithras. Mithras was a Persian deity, but other than his name used "to give itself an exotic oriental flavor," Hellenic Mithraism was distinctly pagan. Mithraism began and flourished at the same time as did Christianity. The cult gained enormous popularity and by the third century hundreds of mithraeum -- underground temples where Mithras was worshipped -- were spread out across Asia Minor, Africa, Italy, Greece, and the German and Scottish frontiers where Roman soldiers were stationed. Mithras is the most recognizable of the Mediterranean gods that was said to have been physically virgin-born; a flattering imitation of the Ishtar priestesses of Babylon.

Also, many stories about Jesus have close parallels with previous stories of Moses: as a new-born, Moses was hidden by his mother because of Pharaoh’s command that all male Hebrew infants were to be killed (EXOD.1:15-22; cf. MATT.2:16); Moses communed with God for forty days and forty nights in the wilderness (EXOD.24:18 & 34:28; cf. MATT.4:1-2); he chose twelve helpers (NUM.1:4-15; cf. MARK 3:14); he rode into Egypt on a mule; his face shone brightly after communing with God (EXOD.34:29-30; cf. MATT.17:2); he also performed many miracles, as many other prophets (see e.g. 1KINGS 17:17-24, where Elijah revives a dead boy; and 2KINGS 4:42-44, Elisha feeds a multitude). In fact, there is hardly a detail in the recorded life of Jesus that does not have an exact parallel in one or more older stories of other Divine men. Mithraism was similar to Christianity in many respects, e.g. baptism, the rite of communion, the use of holy water, the adoration by shepherds at Mithra's birth, the adoption of Sundays and of December 25 (Mithra's birthday) as holy days, and the belief in the immortality of the soul, the last judgment, and the resurrection. Jesus’ resurrection is also prefigured in many other ancient religions, e.g. the Babylonian account of the death and resurrection of the god Tammuz; the Egyptian belief that Osiris came back to life after being killed; the Greek story of the death and return to life of Dionysus; and the Phrygian tale of the death and resurrection of Attis.
 

MOZedek

Member
This would be a good topic if we discussed the Virgin of this virgin birth theory rather than the theory- for I think she is a more enigmatic entity than even the Hebrew scriptures allow
 

Smoke

Done here.
The myth of the virgin-birth of Jesus came from a desire by early Christians to have him fulfill what they saw as every possible Messianic prophesy from the OT.

Perhaps the most well known of these Messianic passages is from Isaiah.
I don't think that's a messianic prophecy at all. I think the early Christians came up with the Virgin Birth first, and then connected it to Isaiah.
 

MOZedek

Member
I think your sources are misleadingif there are any- The Virgin-GodMother was around way before Isiah- it is evident in every major myhtological cycle on a oecumenical scale.
But again- was Mary-the Mother of Christ a Hebrew or rather Christian representation of this myth- or is there more to Mary of Galilee- the Half Levite
 

Popeyesays

Well-Known Member
Well, for me it's a no-brainer. Even if the old testament Isaiah is cloudy, the Qur'an is quite clear that Mary gave birth without 'knowing'a man. The entire Surah of Maryam is dedicated to the story. Mary is in fact a cousing of John the Baptist's as Mary was the cousin of the wife of Zecharias. John the Baptist's birth is also highly unlikely without divine intervention.

Regards,
Scott
 

xexon

Destroyer of Worlds
There are stories of virgin births throughout mythology.

These are symbolic for something else, as is the virgin birth of Jesus.

It is possible to have offspring without being fertilzed by a male. This is known to happen in lower animals and most recently with a hammerhead shark. I'm unaware of any humans that have pulled it off beyond the mythological examples.

For Jesus, the virgin birth means he incarnated by his own will to do so. He was already spiritually advanced before he arrived here, and completed his perfection in the life we all know so well.

In eastern though, it is well known that spiritual masters incarnate by their own will. They do not have the karmic obligation to return here as others do. They have little or no karmic debt left to pay off.

They return out of great compassion to help along those who still struggle in the darkness of the material world.

Jesus was known for his compassion.


x
 

Kaysar

Legatus Legionis
Can you please prove this point.

For example, the twelve "signs" of the zodiac go back to the foundation of the world. Jewish tradition, preserved by Josephus, assures us that this Bible astronomy was invented by Adam, Seth, and Enoch. Proof of this is found in Egyptian & Greek mythology, heroes, the creation of the Sphinx, myth of Horus, Isis etc.
 

Azakel

Liebe ist für alle da
For example, the twelve "signs" of the zodiac go back to the foundation of the world. Jewish tradition, preserved by Josephus, assures us that this Bible astronomy was invented by Adam, Seth, and Enoch. Proof of this is found in Egyptian & Greek mythology, heroes, the creation of the Sphinx, myth of Horus, Isis etc.

That really don't make sense to me. Just because cultures that where 1,000s of year before them had the stories doesn't mean that Adam, Seth, and Enoch know they where going to happen. The Sphinx for one was created(or at lest thought to be) by the Pharaoh Djedefra, which would date its construction from the fourth dynasty (2723 BC–2563 BC) to honor his father pharaoh Khafra.

And for Zodiac:
Etymology

The term zodiac comes from the Latin zodiacus, from the Greek ζῳδιακός [κύκλος], meaning "[circle] of animals", derived from ζῴδιον, the diminutive of ζῷον "animal". Another suggested etymology is that the Greek term is cognate with the Sanskrit sodi, denoting "a path", i.e., the path through which the Sun travels.

History:

By 2,000 BC, the Egyptians and Mesopotamians marked the seasons by the constellations we now call Taurus, Leo, Scorpio, and Aquarius. However, the marking of seasons by constellations may go back to 5,000 BC.[1] The division of the ecliptic into the zodiacal signs originates perhaps in Babylonian ("Chaldean") astronomy as early as the 1st millennium BC (likely during Median/"Neo-Babylonian" times) (Powell 2004).

The Babylonian calendar assigns each month a constellation, beginning with the position of the Sun at vernal equinox. Babylonian astronomers at some point during the 1st millennium BC divided the ecliptic into twelve equal zones of celestial longitude to create the first known celestial coordinate system: a coordinate system that boasts some advantages over modern systems (such as equatorial coordinate system or ecliptic coordinate system).

The zodiac is also understood as a region of the celestial sphere that includes a band of eight arc degrees above and below the ecliptic, and therefore encompasses the paths of the Moon and the naked eye planets (Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, and Saturn). The classical astronomers called these planets wandering stars to differentiate them from the fixed stars of the celestial sphere (Ptolemy). As with the Chinese zodiac, Indo-European astrologers understand the movement of the planets and the Sun through the zodiac as a method to explain and predict events on Earth.

The constellations are stars grouped together into patterns which the ancients thought resembled the object which gave the constellation its name. For example, the stars of the constellation Leo were thought to form a pattern in the shape of a lion.

I just don't believe that they knew all this was going to happen, and not to offend anyone but I just believe that back then people just took stories from other cultures they know about, I mean the Jews where in Egypt so they might have known about the story of Horus and Isis. Plus and you show in the Bible where it says any of this. I must have missed it when I read though it, or the Book of Enoch.
 

Ozzie

Well-Known Member
This would be a good topic if we discussed the Virgin of this virgin birth theory rather than the theory- for I think she is a more enigmatic entity than even the Hebrew scriptures allow
Ok. In what way is a virgin of artificial insemination different to a virgin of divine intervention?
 

Blindinglight

Disciple of Chaos
Jewish tradition, preserved by Josephus, assures us that this Bible astronomy was invented by Adam, Seth, and Enoch. Proof of this is found in Egyptian & Greek mythology, heroes, the creation of the Sphinx, myth of Horus, Isis etc.
There are many flaws in that POV.
The Sphinx is extremely ancient, and has markings that suggest it was built when Egypt was a flourishing jungle.
Also, there are many things in Christianity that are derived from Egyptian believes. The fish symbol for example. This was used in the Egpyt religion LONG before Jesus walked the earth and used it.
Also, alot of Jewish tradition, especially Jewish mysticism and the Kabbalah, are heavily influenced by Egyptian mysticism.
 
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