yep, he didn't really agree with their austerity either. he became more like buddha and the middle WAY.
the essenes were ultra orthodox
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Was Jesus a Prophet, One Sent as a Messenger?
- Thread starter Fool
- Start date
yep, he didn't really agree with their austerity either. he became more like buddha and the middle WAY.
the essenes were ultra orthodox
allfoak
Alchemist
Perhaps.
allfoak
Alchemist
I am convinced that this is where Jesus was born and raised along with his cousin John and the rest of the family.
He certainly did not get his understanding of the Law from the locals.
Since the discovery of the Qumran texts this has all been made very clear.
The religious authorities at the time of the discovery however could not allow the truth to get out so all of the writings of these people along with the Naghammadi texts were discredited.
If a person would study the material for themselves they would see what i see, which is that the roots and tenets of Christianity have been hidden and corrupted to keep the general public under control.
The truth frees people, government does not want free people.
i actually should have noted that it was Jesus who rejected their asceticism.
The Essenes were an ascetic and mystical group devoted to strict discipline. They lived in isolation from the world. The Dead Sea Scrolls are believed to be the product of an Essene sect. Some scholars believe that early Christianity was influenced by the mystical and hermetical teachings of the Essenes.
The moment we claim to be taking a Historical view, everything falls apart. We are no longer working with anything but trinkets. The official site of the Dead Sea Scrolls says "While rabbinic and Christian texts were not discovered among the ancient manuscripts, many of the thoughts and practices discovered in the Scrolls resurface in later Jewish and Christian writings." The Dead Sea Scrolls contain writing which the museum labels 'Parabiblical' but which does not consider itself 'Parabiblical'. These writers are neither Ultra Orthodox nor Christian and do not in any way verify whether Jesus is a prophet. Instead what they redundantly show is ideas in the gospels are not original, not new, not brand new revelations. So your question about whether Jesus is a prophet really depends upon you expanding your definition of a prophet, because he doesn't bring any new information to the table. He brings a lot of heart and emphasis to a discussion already in progress. Anything Jesus says can be reconstructed, or at least sourced, by someone with a firm grasp of the Tanach. Aside from miracles he functions a lot like Maimonides, making clarifications and comments.
"Before the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls, Second Temple Judea was perceived as a monolithic society. Influenced by preconceived notions, scholars mistakenly thought this idea of uniformity was supported in relevant primary sources, such as Josephus Flavius and other Greek and Roman authors, the New Testament Gospels, and rabbinic texts. In actuality, these sources offer a picture of diversity which can now be identified and supported by the Dead Sea texts. Specifically, these works allude to a number of different Jewish sects, such as the Pharisees, Sadducees, and Essenes." --Taken from The Dead Sea Scrolls - Historical Background
These scrolls -- these ancient scrolls somehow discovered just this past century are so well timed. If these had not been discovered the world might lay in ruins at the moment.
allfoak
Alchemist
As far as i can tell there is no evidence that Jesus rejected anything of what he grew up learning.
Living in a communal setting for the purpose of training your children in the way that they should go is not asceticism.
ideas are never new. ideas have always existed, they have just been rediscovered and assimilated into a culture's unique way of transference. like transmigration, or transmutation, there is nothing new under the sun; except a form. fashioning never goes out of style.
What I am suggesting is that your definition of a prophet is incomplete.
the ultra-orthodox would have been much like the brahmans of hinduism. the untouchables would have been shunned by priests. jesus didn't shun anyone, not even the prostitutes, or the lepers.
love does not ignore the suffering of another for the salvation of self vs other as self.
allfoak
Alchemist
There is no evidence that these people shunned anyone.
The ultra orthodox were the Pharisees and Sadducees of the day.
Jesus was very liberal in his teachings compared to them.
the prophets for the most part were nazarites, separated.
the essenes separated themselves from society.
You said they were preparing the way for the Lord. What exactly were the Essenes preparing for in their mind?
The Essenes are what we might best call an apocalyptic sect of Judaism. An apocalyptic sect is one that thinks of itself as, first of all, the true form of their religion. In fact, that's part of their terminology. Again, using the prophet Isaiah, they think of themselves as the righteous remnant ... the chosen ones ... the elect. But they're also standing over against the mainstream ... most of Jewish life, and especially everything going on at Jerusalem. So they're sectarian. They're separatists. They're people who move away.
jesus said the kingdom was already here. and he scattered his disciples to the four winds; as a sower will do.
allfoak
Alchemist
You are confused by the rhetoric of the people that tried to discredit these people.
Do your own research.
i have.
a revolution never starts outside self but from within.
Then war broke out in heaven. Michael and his angels fought against the dragon, and the dragon and his angels fought back.
Love is the everlasting kingdom.
Love changes everything. It uplifts the lowly valleys and humbles the haughty mountains. It makes all things equal. It brings all things back into balance. It returns all forms to their Formless Self.
Paramatman vs Atman
Parable of the Two Birds
The word, Paramatman, is not to be found in the Rig Veda but through allusion referring to Paramatman as Isha. This distinction is made because all of its mantras which in the form of prayers are addressed to gods. In its great Riddle Hymn (Sukta I.164) is the famous mantra - R.V.I.164.20, that was revealed to Rishi Deergatamaah Auchathyah and borrowed by Mundaka Upanishad III.1.1-3, which belongs to Atharva Veda, to weave the parable of the Two Birds:-Two birds.
Two birds, beautiful of wings, close companions, cling to one common tree: of the two one eats the sweet fruit of that tree; the other eats not but watches his companion. The self is the bird that sits immersed on the common tree; but because he is not lord he is bewildered and has sorrow. But when he sees that other who is the Lord and the beloved, he knows that all is His greatness and his sorrow passes away from him. When, a seer, he sees the Golden-hued, the maker, the Lord, the Spirit who is the source of Brahman, then he becomes the knower and shakes from his wings sin and virtue; pure of all stains he reaches the supreme identity.
-Translation of Verses 1-3 of Third Mundaka Upanishad by Sri Aurobindo.
Here at, Aurobindo makes the Spirit or Purusha as the Source of everything, including Brahman. He makes Purusha more fundamental. Thus, he does not have to say Brahman to be the source of inferior Brahman, and he also dismisses the sense of Reality revealed in imaginative and emotional build-up.[11]
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allfoak
Alchemist
allfoak
Alchemist
Thank you
allfoak
Alchemist
Fragments of a Faith Forgotten
by G.R.S. Mead
THE EBIONITES.
Jesus was a man, born as all men, the human son of Joseph and Mary. It was only at his baptism, at thirty years of age, that the Spirit descended upon him and he became a prophet. They, therefore, guarded his Sayings as a precious deposit, handing them down by word of mouth. The Ebionites knew nothing of the pre-existence or divinity of their revered prophet. It is true that Jesus was "christ," but so also would all be who fulfilled the Law.
Sacred Texts.com
by G.R.S. Mead
THE EBIONITES.
Jesus was a man, born as all men, the human son of Joseph and Mary. It was only at his baptism, at thirty years of age, that the Spirit descended upon him and he became a prophet. They, therefore, guarded his Sayings as a precious deposit, handing them down by word of mouth. The Ebionites knew nothing of the pre-existence or divinity of their revered prophet. It is true that Jesus was "christ," but so also would all be who fulfilled the Law.
Sacred Texts.com