Were you told what to believe?

[Ryan2065]

I was reading some of the other forums and a topic came up that made me start to wonder... The basic question was "How do you know the bible really is the word of god?" and the answer is you don't. Really anyone who believes that was just told that by another person.

So when it comes to religion in general, aren't you just told what to believe to some extent?

 

[michel]

I was reading some of the other forums and a topic came up that made me start to wonder... The basic question was "How do you know the bible really is the word of god?" and the answer is you don't. Really anyone who believes that was just told that by another person.

So when it comes to religion in general, aren't you just told what to believe to some extent?

Yes, you are; but then you have the option to let your heart tell you what is right and what is wrong..........

 

[Quiddity]

I was reading some of the other forums and a topic came up that made me start to wonder... The basic question was "How do you know the bible really is the word of god?" and the answer is you don't. Really anyone who believes that was just told that by another person.

So when it comes to religion in general, aren't you just told what to believe to some extent?

Yes we are. In Catholic teaching we call this Oral Tradition. God put things in writing and also passed things on orally. But if you really think about isn't most all your information second hand information? Not just on a religious level but in every aspect of your life. Not unless you want to re-invent the wheel. So as we grow we either reject what was told to us or we come to a closer understanding and build upon it. The natural sciences work exactly the same.

~Victor

 

[jewscout]

for me i don't think it was a "believe this!" sort of thing. It was something i came to on my own and chose to believe.

 

[Quiddity]

for me i don't think it was a "believe this!" sort of thing. It was something i came to on my own and chose to believe.

On your own? You basically started from scratch? You reinvented the wheel?

Your beliefs must of been influenced in some way or another on what is already existant. Let me know if I misunderstood.

~Victor

 

[Ryan2065]

I should have expected the science argument.

isn't most all your information second hand information? Not just on a religious level but in every aspect of your life.

This is false, believe it or not. I am an undergrad student studying math. Yes we all use theories and things that were discovered by other people, this is true. We usually don't use another persons theory without proving it to ourselves first, and this usually involves doing the same exact thing the first person did to prove that his theory was right.
Lets use cars for an example. someone once decided that if he invented an engine, and all the other parts to a car, that he could make a car that drives people around. The proof of this is a working product that drives people around.
Your argument is "I was told that the bible was written by god. I believe this because the bible says it was written by god." This is like me saying "I was told I would like this movie. I believe I will like this movie because the commercials of the movie say I will"
Building a whole faith structure on the belief that the first person who said the bible was written by god was telling the truth is kind of sketchy to me...

**Edit** and please don't anyone take offense to any comments I make here, I really am asking this question because I like to find out how others think... I am not religious and I want to know how the religious mind thinks.

 

[Scott1]

I was reading some of the other forums and a topic came up that made me start to wonder... The basic question was "How do you know the bible really is the word of god?" and the answer is you don't. Really anyone who believes that was just told that by another person.

So when it comes to religion in general, aren't you just told what to believe to some extent?

You are quite right... very few "mainstream" religious faiths come from a personal revelation... in most, word is tied to witness.

A person believes Moses/prophets.-Jew

A person believes the nacent church that formed and protected the canon of Scripture.-Christian

A person believes Mohammed.-Muslim

etc, etc.....

 

[jewscout]

On your own? You basically started from scratch? You reinvented the wheel?

Your beliefs must of been influenced in some way or another on what is already existant. Let me know if I misunderstood.

~Victor

no what i'm saying is i was never raised being told what to believe as far as religion goes. But i embraced Judaism and the Torah, a work i had read before from a non-jewish perspective and gained new insight when i started down this path.

my belief in the words of the Torah and how i view them were a result of my own independent study, prayer and work.

 

[Quiddity]

Ryan, I'm not offended at all. I'm here to grow and teach.

This is false, believe it or not. I am an undergrad student studying math. Yes we all use theories and things that were discovered by other people, this is true. We usually don't use another persons theory without proving it to ourselves first, and this usually involves doing the same exact thing the first person did to prove that his theory was right.

If you notice I said "most" not "all". This implies that the everyday joe schmo does not do what you are saying. You basically built upon what I was trying to say.

Your argument is "I was told that the bible was written by god. I believe this because the bible says it was written by god." This is like me saying "I was told I would like this movie. I believe I will like this movie because the commercials of the movie say I will"
Building a whole faith structure on the belief that the first person who said the bible was written by god was telling the truth is kind of sketchy to me...

No this is not my argument. This is how it goes "I was told that the bible was written by god. I believe this because the Chuch told me. The Church got it from the Bible and from Oral Tradition." And in this I grow in my understanding and faith. Keep in mind that I do not believe faith stumps reason, but rather builds upon it. No test you do can prove it. Science obviously functions a bit different.

Peace
~Victor

 

[Quiddity]

no what i'm saying is i was never raised being told what to believe as far as religion goes. But i embraced Judaism and the Torah, a work i had read before from a non-jewish perspective and gained new insight when i started down this path.

my belief in the words of the Torah and how i view them were a result of my own independent study, prayer and work.

That is similar to how I came to my beliefs.....thanks for the clarification.

~Victor

 

[Ryan2065]

If you notice I said "most" not "all". This implies that the everyday joe schmo does not do what you are saying. You basically built upon what I was trying to say

Right, but after I said the part that you quoted, I applied it to the "everyday joe schmo" and gave the car example. Where I said that the proof something works could very well be it working. That is a valid proof in math believe it or not.

 

[fromthe heart]

I was reading some of the other forums and a topic came up that made me start to wonder... The basic question was "How do you know the bible really is the word of god?" and the answer is you don't. Really anyone who believes that was just told that by another person.

So when it comes to religion in general, aren't you just told what to believe to some extent?

That's very true should you chose to question that the Bible is the true word of the true and living God. I don't so Perhaps I'm just being me. I didn't come to my faith in God by being taught to feel that way. I almost think I was born searching and believing in God. I just had to learn all the details of my yearning from deep within my gut(so to speak) from someone who knew about what the Bible said. I listened to hundreds of sermons but how I feel about God I determined for myself through the words written by mans hand given by God in words to those men. Some well meaning ministers say this church has it wrong or that church has it wrong and THAT I can not trust in because these are MANS words. I do feel some of the scripture in places got lost in translation after translation but I do feel these are the words God wants for us to hear,learn,live...and respect. :162:

 

[Quiddity]

Right, but after I said the part that you quoted, I applied it to the "everyday joe schmo" and gave the car example. Where I said that the proof something works could very well be it working. That is a valid proof in math believe it or not.

I gotcha now. Although you know full well that mathematics has solution and laws that do not deviate. 1+1=2....Human behaivor or rather people are much more complex and do not have a fixed formula to figure them out. I could argue that my life and that life of many others is proof, but that is subjective and would most likely not make you believe.

~Victor

 

[blueman]

We all have to make our own decisions regarding our faith and what we believe in. The more and more I took time to reference the Word of God, there were so many compelling truths to my life circumstances, even today, that I could not deny it's power or validity. If you take time to read and medidate on the Word of God, it is amazing what God will reveal to you about Him and about your own life.

 

[Quiddity]

We all have to make our own decisions regarding our faith and what we believe in. The more and more I took time to reference the Word of God, there were so many compelling truths to my life circumstances, even today, that I could not deny it's power or validity. If you take time to read and medidate on the Word of God, it is amazing what God will reveal to you about Him and about your own life.

Amen blueman...:jiggy:

~Victor

 

[cardero]

Ryan writes: So when it comes to religion in general, aren't you just told what to believe to some extent?

Each religion starts with someone else’s relationship/interpretation/perspective of God. If you look at many of the origins of some religions each one has a human’s belief system at its foundation that was shared and accepted by a group of people who believed that they could not have the same relationship with God.

 

[Quiddity]

If you look at many of the origins of some religions each one has a human’s belief system at its foundation that was shared and accepted by a group of people who believed that they could not have the same relationship with God.

You lost me on the bolded area. Are you talking about people who seperated themselves from another group? What about those groups that just started on their own, with no seperation involved?

~Victor

 

[Shadow Wolf]

As a kid, I was told to believe christianity. I did for the longest time until I realized it didn't fit for me. I knew I should be happy, being saved and going to heaven and all, but I was never truly happy. I had to force myself to be happy about it.
I latter discovered Wicca, and then other Pagan believes, and I was then happy. But I wasn't told to believe that.

 

[Nic_Italiano]

Up until about the age of 6 I went to a Christian church, all of them years, I was being forced to beleive in God, all I ever heard was "if you dont do (...) you will burn in Hell", over and over, at about the age of 6 years old, my mother was told never to return to the church, for questioning a priest on The Holy Bible, 2 weeks later, my dad decided to leave the church.
Early this year I decided to reseach into all that "evil" I was "warned" of as a child, I was rather shocked at what I found when looking at Wicca, Paganism and Satanism. I decided to follow Satanism.
So for a good peice of my childhood, before it all got messed up, I was told what to beleive in, now, I choose my own religion, however I dont tell alot of people.

Nic

 

[Mike182]

i am not told what to believe

i am at the age where i will listen to what other believe and decide if i agree with them - but i can see how a younger child could think they are being told what to believe in church