Were you told what to believe?

[michel]

i am not told what to believe

i am at the age where i will listen to what other believe and decide if i agree with them - but i can see how a younger child could think they are being told what to believe in church

Having just looked up your age, I am mindful of how lucky you 'youngsters' are today. The resources you have (The internet, this forum, e-books) must have given a 'head start' in working out your beliefs - I am not envious, but I can't help wondering what I would now be like, had this vast aray of information been at hand when I was your age!

Use it wisely, and fruitfully - as you obviously are. Good luck, and happy hunting!

 

[cardero]

You lost me on the bolded area. Are you talking about people who seperated themselves from another group? What about those groups that just started on their own, with no seperation involved?

~Victor

I meant the people who believe or follow the god of Moses, Jesus, Charles T. Russell, Joseph Smith Jr., Oliver Cowdery, John Calvin, Martin Luther….etc.



Each one of these religious leaders had a different relationship with God that attracted some sort of person who decided it would be easier, better or convenient to believe that person’s relationship with God instead of starting their own.

 

[Ryan2065]

Now I really want to do this experiment, but you know... The whole laws against experimenting on children thing...

So I'll pose another question, do you think you were told to believe? One belief I have is that religion is just really an ancient belief in modern day. The experiment I wanted to do is to take alot of babies and raise them all differently. One group of babies don't ever mention any beliefs about any kind of religion, and the other group mention religion. I'd be willing to bet most of the first group of babies would be atheist, while most of the other group of babies would be whatever religion you preached them to be. Others thoughts on this? Could you only believe in god because you have been told there has to be a god since you were little?

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

Now I really want to do this experiment, but you know... The whole laws against experimenting on children thing...

So I'll pose another question, do you think you were told to believe? One belief I have is that religion is just really an ancient belief in modern day. The experiment I wanted to do is to take alot of babies and raise them all differently. One group of babies don't ever mention any beliefs about any kind of religion, and the other group mention religion. I'd be willing to bet most of the first group of babies would be atheist, while most of the other group of babies would be whatever religion you preached them to be. Others thoughts on this? Could you only believe in god because you have been told there has to be a god since you were little?

You can only relate to the input you get.
In time, as you get more and more input, you can make choices.
Religion is no different.
Even the most primitive races have had religion.
It seems to be a human need to explain their life and relationship with nature and their beginning. Christians were fortunate to have Jesus as their example teacher and saviour.

Terry
________________________________
Blessed are those who bring peace, they shall be children of God


Terry

 

[michel]

Now I really want to do this experiment, but you know... The whole laws against experimenting on children thing...

So I'll pose another question, do you think you were told to believe? One belief I have is that religion is just really an ancient belief in modern day. The experiment I wanted to do is to take alot of babies and raise them all differently. One group of babies don't ever mention any beliefs about any kind of religion, and the other group mention religion. I'd be willing to bet most of the first group of babies would be atheist, while most of the other group of babies would be whatever religion you preached them to be. Others thoughts on this? Could you only believe in god because you have been told there has to be a god since you were little?

It is strange that you should ask this question; I have often thought of this hypothetical scenario.

In my view, none of the children should have any input. I believe though, that at the first clap of thunder, the first lightening, dawn, sunrise.....the more imaginative children would ascribe the events to some 'outside' source, power - whatever- possibly a pagan-like belief in different 'Gods' - one for easch of the moon, sun, lightening... I can also see some form of morality develop pretty quickly - rules such as 'Don't take anyone else's coconut if you are hungry - go get your own'; don't try and take my girlfriend - or I'll thump you- which might just work out as a community rule, with some form of punishment being agreed upon as being 'justice'.

Basically therefore, I can imagine much the same as 'tribes' with chiefs, each believing in some sort of divine being - without having much of an Idea about the guy who makes loud noises because someone did something wrong, to displease him....

 

[Ryan2065]

In my view, none of the children should have any input. I believe though, that at the first clap of thunder, the first lightening, dawn, sunrise.....the more imaginative children would ascribe the events to some 'outside' source, power - whatever- possibly a pagan-like belief in different 'Gods' - one for easch of the moon, sun, lightening... I can also see some form of morality develop pretty quickly - rules such as 'Don't take anyone else's coconut if you are hungry - go get your own'; don't try and take my girlfriend - or I'll thump you- which might just work out as a community rule, with some form of punishment being agreed upon as being 'justice'.

When I first said what I said I was more thinking the children could be taught real scientific facts, like exactly what thunder and lightning is, but then when they ask questions about things we don't know, like where we go when we die, they would only be told, I don't know. Though this might be teaching them to be atheists now that I think of it...

 

[Quiddity]

Up until about the age of 6 I went to a Christian church, all of them years, I was being forced to beleive in God, all I ever heard was "if you dont do (...) you will burn in Hell", over and over, at about the age of 6 years old, my mother was told never to return to the church, for questioning a priest on The Holy Bible, 2 weeks later, my dad decided to leave the church.
Early this year I decided to reseach into all that "evil" I was "warned" of as a child, I was rather shocked at what I found when looking at Wicca, Paganism and Satanism. I decided to follow Satanism.
So for a good peice of my childhood, before it all got messed up, I was told what to beleive in, now, I choose my own religion, however I dont tell alot of people.

Nic

Sorry to hear about this. Keep in mind that not everybodys experience of Chrisitianity is like this. I could tell you stories of my friend Susan who was an independant witch who began in the paths of Wicca and Satanism. It took her a trip to the hospital to finally leave all that stuff behind. She is now what she used to hate, a Christian.

~Victor

 

[Nic_Italiano]

Sorry to hear about this. Keep in mind that not everybodys experience of Chrisitianity is like this. I could tell you stories of my friend Susan who was an independant witch who began in the paths of Wicca and Satanism. It took her a trip to the hospital to finally leave all that stuff behind. She is now what she used to hate, a Christian.

~Victor

Sorry to hear that.
I dont hate Christians, I just dont beleive that Christianity is the religion for me. Most Satanists think in a similar way. I havent attended any Satanic rituals or performed any magic to do with Satanism as of yet.
Anyway, were getting off topic. Back to thread's original topic now, we can continue this in Private Messages if you would like.

 

[Quiddity]

I dont hate Christians,

Good to hear.....

we can continue this in Private Messages if you would like

I think many people will benefit from what we both have to say. I would rather have you start a thread that you are interested in talking about and I'll be there...

The Least
~Victor

 

[cardero]

Now I really want to do this experiment, but you know... The whole laws against experimenting on children thing...

So I'll pose another question, do you think you were told to believe? One belief I have is that religion is just really an ancient belief in modern day. The experiment I wanted to do is to take alot of babies and raise them all differently. One group of babies don't ever mention any beliefs about any kind of religion, and the other group mention religion. I'd be willing to bet most of the first group of babies would be atheist, while most of the other group of babies would be whatever religion you preached them to be. Others thoughts on this? Could you only believe in god because you have been told there has to be a god since you were little?

It is an interesting hypothesis but the research for your experiment is on-going. You can ask RF members how they got to their present belief system. From my observances, children will eventually adopt, change, or drop their inherited belief as they grow older. They usually implement this by themselves.

 

[cardero]

When I first said what I said I was more thinking the children could be taught real scientific facts, like exactly what thunder and lightning is, but then when they ask questions about things we don't know, like where we go when we die, they would only be told, I don't know. Though this might be teaching them to be atheists now that I think of it...

It would be teaching them honesty, that there may be a limit to their parent's intellgence or it just may teach them to find a way to discover the answers for themselves.

 

[Quiddity]

It would be teaching them honesty, that there may be a limit to their parent's intellgence or it just may teach them to find a way to discover the answers for themselves.

I certainly don't intend to take words out of your mouth, but are you asserting that all religious aren't honest?

~Victor

 

[Quiddity]

Each one of these religious leaders had a different relationship with God that attracted some sort of person who decided it would be easier, better or convenient to believe that person’s relationship with God instead of starting their own.

I disagree, when I was an atheist it was ever so easy to not adopt anything and just go with what I understood to be right and wrong and whatever floated my boat. That was way easier !!!!!

~Victor

 

[Sabio]

I was reading some of the other forums and a topic came up that made me start to wonder... The basic question was "How do you know the bible really is the word of god?" and the answer is you don't. Really anyone who believes that was just told that by another person.

So when it comes to religion in general, aren't you just told what to believe to some extent?

Ryan, you should not accept the Bible without any proof. Nor should you accept religion just because someone tells you to believe. Here are some facts that provide reliable proof that the Bible is God's word:

66 Books
40 Authors, most had no contact with one another
Written over 1500 year period
Written in multiple countries
Written in 3 languages
Complete harmony of all main themes and teachings

Now those are some reasons to believe....
(just scratched the surface)

Sabio

 

[michel]

for me i don't think it was a "believe this!" sort of thing. It was something i came to on my own and chose to believe.

It was much the same for me. Because of my 'unusual' youth and education, I missed out on certain topics - and religious education was definitely one of those. I picked up a bible one day, thinking "I'd like to read this..."; well, of course, after the first page, I felt a bit discouraged..........

One day, a great friend of mine mentioned a chapter of ecclesiastes, and I looked it up when I got home - I was hooked.

 

[greatcalgarian]

As a kid, I was told to believe christianity. I did for the longest time until I realized it didn't fit for me. I knew I should be happy, being saved and going to heaven and all, but I was never truly happy. I had to force myself to be happy about it.
I latter discovered Wicca, and then other Pagan believes, and I was then happy. But I wasn't told to believe that.

When you read about Wicca and about Pagan believes, you are being 'told' (may be indirectly) by those written words or articles to believe them. Those articles would have been written in a very convincing and persuasive way proving to you that the concept is more believeable then those you read via bible class or learn from other evangelicals. Perhaps what is described in those literature appeal to your own life experience and you find yourself agreeing with what is stated. So you started believing in that instead of christianity.

In general what one believes is a function of both (1) what he has gone through in life and the (2) ideas that have been presented to him, whether verbally, or through books, or through TV. The combination of the two will then decide what he will believe in.

 

[cardero]

I certainly don't intend to take words out of your mouth, but are you asserting that all religious aren't honest?

~Victor

No, I am asserting that most religions are faithful.

 

[Katzpur]

I was reading some of the other forums and a topic came up that made me start to wonder... The basic question was "How do you know the bible really is the word of god?" and the answer is you don't. Really anyone who believes that was just told that by another person.

So when it comes to religion in general, aren't you just told what to believe to some extent?

My parents and their parents and their parents' parents were LDS. I was raised in the LDS faith, taken to Church every Sunday and taught the doctrines of the LDS Church. But my parents (and especially my dad) always stressed to me that I wasn't ever to just believe everything I heard taught in church. I was always encouraged to question and figure things out for myself. I think my parents hoped I'd come to the same conclusions they came to (which I did), but I was never told that if I didn't, I'd be damned by God and rejected by my family. As a matter of fact, I never really was convinced that what I believed was true until I was old enough to start hearing the anti-Mormon rhetoric. When exposed to it, I decided that if I was going to be able to continue to call myself a Latter-day Saint, I had better examine the claims of the opposition and find out if what they had to say about the Church could be substantiated or not. It has only been within the last 15 years (and I'm 56) that my convictions have really been strong, and it definitely hasn't been because I simply believed what I was taught.

 

[chuck010342]

I was reading some of the other forums and a topic came up that made me start to wonder... The basic question was "How do you know the bible really is the word of god?" and the answer is you don't. Really anyone who believes that was just told that by another person.

So when it comes to religion in general, aren't you just told what to believe to some extent?

not me Ryan, my parents were skeptics so I was a skeptic but I did alot of reading and research and now I'm a disciple of Jesus also an apologetic.

Ryan you seem to be the new TVOR, I miss that guy.

 

[Quiddity]

I hear that name alot...who is TVOR?

~Victor