What are your thoughts on Christianity?

[Dan From Smithville]

I believe it has to do with cell death and what science knows about the causes of the process of cell degeneration and death in every organism.

Humans are the only creatures on earth whose mortality bothers them. It’s like we are programmed to go on living, but our faulty genes force us to age, succumb to illness and die. The trouble is, we only age in our body but not in our mind......ask any older person (with their mental faculties intact) who has lost their youth, if they feel old in their head, or is it just a state of body?

It is a very difficult thing to see yourself get old and to lose your youthful looks, and your physical abilities and strength, when you feel the same inside, but the mirror gives you a very different and disturbing picture.

The Bible explains that we were designed to live forever right here on earth, but death was introduced by the disobedience of our first parents, (apparently genetically) and they passed on the faulty genes that interfere with the natural cycle of cell renewal. Science knows that we age, but cannot pin down why the process gets switched off as time goes on. They know that it happens and have been working to reverse it for decades, without success.

So, we all die, but science cannot explain exactly why it happens. It is in our genetics to potentially live forever, if only they can get the process of cell renewal to keep going....

There is quite a bit online about it actually.....like this....

“The Hallmarks of Ageing,”. . . . summed up everything that happens in our bodies biologically as we get old, and categorized those processes into nine “hallmarks.”

They are:



What causes human bodies to age? Here’s what scientists know about the biology behind growing old

Explaining how, does not explain why......I believe that the Bible answers that quite simply....no science degree required.

This is the kind of response I have come to expect from you. A bait and switch. It has nothing to do with the claim you made previously. You said that sin is in our genetics. You said 100%. You were very clear on your position on this.

If sin is 100% in our genes, then it sort of makes Christ's sacrifice meaningless, since his death on the cross has not taken it out of our genes. By the same token, if it were genetic in its nature, then we could circumvent God by traditional breeding methods or gene editing to remove it from the genome.

Again, you claim sin is 100% genetic, so let's stick to that claim. If you could provide the science that supports that claim, that would be just super dooper sweet.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

No, I was not raised to believe in or worship a Christian god of any sort. Whether it's 3 gods in 1, or 1 in 3, or 1 or 3. I hope that clarifies it.

A simple, "no I was not raised Christian" would have sufficed.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

I hope I can say something without offending anyone by answering you. If you believe that Adam and Eve were predestined to die, that would be a problem in figuring why all die as the Bible says. So as the song goes, "Let's start at the very beginning, a very good place to start..." (Sound of Music)
And even if they were predestined to die (which I do not believe), why would that be?

It doesn't sound like you read my post. The questions I have regard the claim that sin is genetic.

 

[YoursTrue]

A simple, "no I was not raised Christian" would have sufficed.

OK, but I heard a lot about it, the main culture promoting various traditions and beliefs of churches, and later as I grew older began to understand the various sects and ideas among those called Christian as I examined the teachings thereof., also I investigated other religions, including Buddhism.

 

[YoursTrue]

It doesn't sound like you read my post. The questions I have regard the claim that sin is genetic.

The passing on of sin, not the origin of sin, is that from Adam's sin onward. If you want to discuss genetics, I can only say what I learned from the Bible about sin and how it says we all inherit sin.
Romans 5:12 puts it in place. Even about genetics, because -- many things are passed on without our even knowing it. "Therefore, as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin; and so death passed unto all men, for that all sinned:--"

 

[Dan From Smithville]

The passing on of sin, not the origin of sin, is that from Adam's sin onward. If you want to discuss genetics, I can only say what I learned from the Bible about sin and how it says we all inherit sin.
Romans 5:12 puts it in place. Even about genetics, because -- many things are passed on without our even knowing it. "Therefore, as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin; and so death passed unto all men, for that all sinned:--"

I am told that sin is genetic. I want to know about the science behind that if that is true.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

OK, but I heard a lot about it, the main culture promoting various traditions and beliefs of churches, and later as I grew older began to understand the various sects and ideas among those called Christian as I examined the teachings thereof., also I investigated other religions, including Buddhism.

I was raised Christian, by Christians. My mother was an adult Sunday school teacher. She thought I would make a great minister one day.

 

[YoursTrue]

This is the kind of response I have come to expect from you. A bait and switch. It has nothing to do with the claim you made previously. You said that sin is in our genetics. You said 100%. You were very clear on your position on this.

If sin is 100% in our genes, then it sort of makes Christ's sacrifice meaningless, since his death on the cross has not taken it out of our genes. By the same token, if it were genetic in its nature, then we could circumvent God by traditional breeding methods or gene editing to remove it from the genome.

Again, you claim sin is 100% genetic, so let's stick to that claim. If you could provide the science that supports that claim, that would be just super dooper sweet.

I have come to understand that sin is in our genetic passage, to put it in a certain way, just as Adam and Eve had children after they sinned. It had to change the genetic structure. As an example, babies in the womb are said to respond to music or the sound of voices they heard while in the womb. So one must consider that Adam and Eve did not pass on perfection to their offspring in word or action. I love many (not all) kinds of music and glad it was invented. (to a degree considering invention given as a quality to humans.) Similarly, infants are sometimes subject to drug abuse or alcohol while in the womb. And I can only surmise (yes, surmise) that they are subject to the mother's stress, perhaps she is abused, overworked, etc. The body's chemistry is changed. So yes, there is no doubt in my mind that the effects of sin are inherited by Adam and Eve's offspring, even though they themselves may not sin in the likeness of Adam.

 

[YoursTrue]

I am told that sin is genetic. I want to know about the science behind that if that is true.

OK, I gave you both biblical and rational reasoning. Not all have sinned in the likeness of Adam. But yes, everyone alive inherits sin. Except Jesus, of course. Your question is a good one. Again -- Romans 5:12 - "Therefore, as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin; and so death passed unto all men, for that all sinned." There's a difference between sin and perfection.

 

[YoursTrue]

I was raised Christian, by Christians. My mother was an adult Sunday school teacher. She thought I would make a great minister one day.

 

[Aupmanyav]

My only questions simply with no judgement: Something you found in the bible you did not agree with, or do not understand? What are some of your thoughts on Christianity?

Zoroaster's monotheism came up because he was not getting enough clientele (he was a priest of Athravan clan). I do not believe that any Ahur Mazda met Zoroaster (just as I do not believe that Moses met YHWH). So he came up with a new religious thought rejecting the prevalent belief of his people in many Gods (same with the Israelites). I have not studied the reasons for Egyptian monotheism. Moses also came up with Judaic monotheism so as to dominate his people (which he did for 40 years). Jesus failed in his time, but Mohammad was successful. Monotheism, IMHO, is basically a ploy to dominate, not that it involves any 'divine truth'.

Yeah, I hugely differ from views in Bible because I am a strong atheist and do not find any evidence of existence of God, soul, heaven, hell, end of days, judgment or any need for salvation. The Son of God born immaculately is as big a big laugh as there can be other than rising up on the third day. Unfortunate that I understand Bible a bit too well.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

I have come to understand that sin is in our genetic passage, to put it in a certain way, just as Adam and Eve had children after they sinned. It had to change the genetic structure. As an example, babies in the womb are said to respond to music or the sound of voices they heard while in the womb. So one must consider that Adam and Eve did not pass on perfection to their offspring in word or action. I love many (not all) kinds of music and glad it was invented. (to a degree considering invention given as a quality to humans.) Similarly, infants are sometimes subject to drug abuse or alcohol while in the womb. And I can only surmise (yes, surmise) that they are subject to the mother's stress, perhaps she is abused, overworked, etc. The body's chemistry is changed. So yes, there is no doubt in my mind that the effects of sin are inherited by Adam and Eve's offspring, even though they themselves may not sin in the likeness of Adam.

I think you are missing the point. If there is a sin gene or genes, the implications are tremendous. At the very least, these should be capable of being characterized to support a claim that sin is genetic. Is sin a dominant or a recessive trait? Which gene or genes is it? If they are known, the could be removed from the genome by some means. If you are born without these genes, why would you not be sinless? If sin is a gene and having it is unavoidable, what does that say about the necessity for the crucifixion of Christ? What does accepting Christ as your savior do to your genotype if sin is genetic? We should be able to detect the change.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

OK, I gave you both biblical and rational reasoning. Not all have sinned in the likeness of Adam. But yes, everyone alive inherits sin. Except Jesus, of course. Your question is a good one. Again -- Romans 5:12 - "Therefore, as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin; and so death passed unto all men, for that all sinned." There's a difference between sin and perfection.

That is the problem. I have seen no valid reasoning to claim that sin is a genetic trait.

What about people that are born sociopathic, schizophrenic, bipolar, autistic, etc. Are these manifestations of sin? It seems pretty severe to be born with a genetic trait associated with sin you did not even commit. What about the Bible's claim that the sins of the father are not visited on the son. Where is that in this? Is that son missing the genetic traits that his father has?

I am afraid I need more than just claims and Bible verses. I want the actual evidence of these sin genes.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

Hey, my cousin!

Which gene is that? Or is it polygenic? Can you show me the genetics and molecular biological evidence you are using to declare sin genetically heritable? I would really be interested to see that science.

I’d be interested, too!

What science has discovered, is that as we age, the ends of our telomeres, on our chromosomes, get shorter & shorter. This increasing reduction is somehow linked to our inability to rejuvenate the older we get.

Someday, we’ll learn it. There are studies underway already.

So this would be a gene or genes that is found in every human on earth. This gene or these genes must be highly conserved and resistant to mutation. I am guessing they express some sort of sin protein or pathway.

“Sin protein” — lol!

Since the Bible distinguishes between animals & humans (we were created to be sons - and daughters - of Jehovah God, but animals weren’t; we can eat animals, we can’t eat other humans....even most atheists will recognize that difference), I would be very interested in finding out whether there are subtle dissimilarities between our telomeres, and those of animals.

I’ve been wanting to do more research into what scientists have uncovered in this regard, but I’m just too busy.

Take care. You know I wish you the best. Some day, I think we’ll meet.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

What is that way? The word 'worship' is problematic. What is 'worship'? Is worship loving devotion? Is it doing work in that God's name? Is it spending time in prayer and offerings rituals? What methods has God, any God given to man? How does God want to be worshiped? Does he even want or need to be worshiped? (our belief is no, God needs or wants nothing).



Again, how does he want to be worshiped?

Ekam sadviprah bahuda vadanti, "One Truth the sages give many names". Rig Veda 10.146.64

Quotes of Sri Ramakrishna Paramahansa:





That's a belief I categorically and unequivocally reject, at least in that form, i.e. as the last stop. Our belief is that it goes on ad infinitum in the cycle of rebirth until all karma has been exhausted and the soul achieves moksha. One's current life and stockpile of karma from previous lives determines our "reward" or "punishment". Moreover, it's not God who does the judging and meting out of that reward and punishment. Sometimes though, for whatever reason known only to him God overrides a soul's karma and grants liberation.

Informative, thank you.

“How does God want to be worshipped” is a very good question.

Let me ask you this...
If there is only one God, and He is the ultimate Father of all of us, would He want us to be kind to (and concerned about) other humans, i.e., our “cousins”, or hurt others? I think you know....it’s what you’d want as a father, too....genuine concern between your sons & daughters.

And guess what?....That’s exactly what the God of Christians wants from His worshippers! James 1:27.
Even His Son, Jesus, gave the command to ‘love your enemy’!
So, this should be a big part of worship to the Creator of all: how we treat others.

But we find many religions hypocritical this way, and we try to open people’s eyes to it.

There’s no doubt that Jesus loved people, but he abhorred the teachings and actions of the religious leaders in his day.


So long....best wishes.

 

[MatthewA]

Questions surely never hurt; though assuming does hurt many.

 

[Deeje]

This is the kind of response I have come to expect from you. A bait and switch. It has nothing to do with the claim you made previously. You said that sin is in our genetics. You said 100%. You were very clear on your position on this.

And this is what I have come to expect from you....complete lack of comprehension. The sites that I investigated all said that aging and death were caused genetically......that science knows that cells are programmed to age and eventually die, but they have no idea why they do it, since the process of cell renewal should theoretically go on forever. Death is in the genes....but there is no reason why it should be.

What does the Bible say causes death? "SIN".....but as a "Christian" you are supposed to know that. (Romans 5:12)

If sin is 100% in our genes, then it sort of makes Christ's sacrifice meaningless, since his death on the cross has not taken it out of our genes.

YET.....his death has granted forgiveness of our sins for now, but the reversal of the Edenic penalty will be accomplished by the rule of his Kingdom, still to come. That is when death "will be no more". (Revelation 21:2-4)
The Bible is not your strong point, is it?

By the same token, if it were genetic in its nature, then we could circumvent God by traditional breeding methods or gene editing to remove it from the genome.

How do you figure that? They can't even address all the genetically transmitted diseases.....let alone aging and death.....you don't seem to have a clue.

 

[Deeje]

Questions surely never hurt; though assuming does hurt many.

The right questions are very important.....how else are we to arrive at the truth? Why should anyone fear the truth?

Do we trust God's word to tell us the whole truth, or do we understand that the devil can manipulate others in order to undermine our faith? What about our own treacherous heart? (Jeremiah 17:9) Seeking our own desires can lead us away from God too, and we can make him like something in our own image, instead of the other way around.

But God assures us that the genuine seekers will find him.....he knows who they are.

 

[metis]

So do you believe that Jesus was executed as related in the Bible?

Yes.

That's what I thought then, continued on my way for many years not believing in him, now I do.

That's great!

 

[metis]

We must die to make room for others. If life forms didn't die, the world would have been too overcrowded millions to even maybe billions of years ago. Thus, I really do not believe that "original sin" is not why we die, especially since life forms were dying long before us humans ever inhabited Earth.

However, dying is not high on my bucket-list, just to be clear.