Leaving aside for the moment what persists in your mind, what lifestyle is that?KrAzY_KaRl said:
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What has your Atheism done for you?
- Thread starter linwood
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The Voice of Reason
Doctor of Thinkology
Soultype - we understand perfectly well what lifestyle he is implying. Deut is asking Krazy to explicitly state what he is implying. The point that we are making is, how does he come by the knowledge that Deut, myself, Spinkles, etc. are living any given lifestyle?SoulTYPE01 said:
For all Krazy knows, Deut may live the life of a monk, Spinkles may be a hedonist, Faust may be philanthropist, Sunstone might be a cutthroat murderer, Pah might be a completely normal man, or I may be a male version of Mother Teresa (I liked her wardrobe).
Krazy is implying a broad generalization that "because X is an Atheist, X MUST be a hedonist". While this may be true for some (but not all) Atheists, it is equally true for followers of any and all religions. Living a hedonistic lifestyle is neither a prerequisite for Atheism or Christianity, nor is it mutually exclusive to any given belief system. Ones lifestyle is independent of ones belief system - a fact that Krazy is either ignorant of, or chooses to ignore.
TVOR
I think that I'm now more sensitive to the needs and wishes of my fellow beings than when I was a rather intense Christian who could get all answers by looking in the Holy Book. I can't claim that I necessarily am a better person now, but having to face the greater responsibility in having to make all ethical decisions mysellf, I find that my life is less complicated. My philosophy of life and subsequent decisions are now governed by myself and my fellow very concrete beings, not by some hypothetical entity.
I have said it before, but I prefer the "negative" form of the Golden Rule. "Doing to others" etc. presupposes that you yourself know what is best for everyone else. How Übermensch! (Masochists, go out and torment people, 'cause that's what you want them to do to you!) The Buddhist way (and the way lots of other religions state it), not doing to others what you don't want them to do unto you, seems to me to be more on the safe side.
I have said it before, but I prefer the "negative" form of the Golden Rule. "Doing to others" etc. presupposes that you yourself know what is best for everyone else. How Übermensch! (Masochists, go out and torment people, 'cause that's what you want them to do to you!) The Buddhist way (and the way lots of other religions state it), not doing to others what you don't want them to do unto you, seems to me to be more on the safe side.
Mr Spinkles
Mr
Please, TVOR, don't be ridiculous. We all know pah is not even close to being a normal man.TVOR said:
I agree with Anders that atheism has focused me on humanity and the needs of humanity (very much including those people that I interact with daily). And I agree with Deut's beautifully poetic expression of how atheism has helped me to look at life without the distortions of theology -- as if seeing the night sky without the pollution of artificial lights.
Mr Spinkles
Mr
:biglaugh:Sunstone said:
Your life is less complicated as an atheist? I would think it would be less complicated as a "Christian who could get all answers in a Holy Book".anders said:
Honestly, I'm a bit confused by some of the "atheist success stories" on this thread. It almost sounds like those commercials on TV for hair regrowth..."I met my wife, got a big raise, AND won the lottery--all thanks to Men's Miracle Hair Growth Gel!" I value life, I'm awed by the universe, and I do my best to be a kind, moral person; and all of those things would be true whether or not I believed in a supernatural Creator-being.
In the first place, I agree with you, Spinks, that you would be a kind, moral person, etc regardless of whether or not you believed in deity. The older I get, the more I see evidence that people are basically whatever people are, regardless of their beliefs in deity. Kind people are kind, and cruel people are cruel -- and their beliefs in deity don't seem to me to make much difference. Whatever it is that causes some of us to be kind, and some of us to be cruel, seems to be something other than belief in deity.Mr_Spinkles said:
In the second place, I think Anders and others are getting at something a bit different than that when they talk about atheism simplifying their lives or thoughts. There is a lot of baggage that comes with the JudeoChristian worldview, and much of it is subtle. It can take a lifetime to get rid of that baggage. A fifty year old friend of mine told me not so long ago that he was still working to rid himself of some of the suppositions and assumptions that were instilled in him by his Catholic upbringing. As he put it, "The older I get, the more I see how I was influenced by that upbringing." So, I think there is at times and under certain circumstances a certain legitimate feeling of relief and liberation that comes with atheism.
Mr Spinkles
Mr
Sunstone-- Mm, good point. I see what you're saying. Letting go of all that baggage is rather liberating.
The Voice of Reason
Doctor of Thinkology
Okay - so I went to far with Pah being a "normal" man, but you have to give me credit - I pegged Sunstone on the "cutthroat murderer" charge!
Anyone that says Mother Teresa didn't look good in purple socks is nuts. It's a select group in this world that can pull off that fashion statement, and still maintain a regal air.
TVOR
Anyone that says Mother Teresa didn't look good in purple socks is nuts. It's a select group in this world that can pull off that fashion statement, and still maintain a regal air.
TVOR
Finally, after all these years, I feel so deeply appreciated. When I took up my life's work, everyone said -- even mom said -- that it was just a hobby, a phase I was going through. No one except me knew it was a higher calling. Thank you, TVOR! Thank you for "pegging me". I feel vindicated after all these years of living with the "it's just a hobby" label.The Voice of Reason said:
The Voice of Reason
Doctor of Thinkology
No reason a man can't follow his life's calling while also enjoying it as a fulfilling hobby as well!!
If I can admit to my fetish for purple socks, and a burning desire to dress like Mother Teresa, I can only respect your pursuit of the finer pleasures in your corner of the world.
This world needs people like us, Sunstone.
TVOR
If I can admit to my fetish for purple socks, and a burning desire to dress like Mother Teresa, I can only respect your pursuit of the finer pleasures in your corner of the world.
This world needs people like us, Sunstone.
TVOR
Scuba Pete
Le plongeur avec attitude...
Now HOW can you argue with logic like that?
The Voice of Reason
Doctor of Thinkology
Hey Fisheye!! I didn't even notice you, over there in the corner. How's the ol' trick knee holding up? Notice how I haven't mentioned anything about your proclivity for eating sushi while wearing an eyepatch and a kilt? "One Thumb" Johnson wants to know if you still heat the fork up on the stove, prior to "disciplining" the dog?
No sir! Mum's the word - they'll get nothing from me, NetDoc.
TVOR
No sir! Mum's the word - they'll get nothing from me, NetDoc.
TVOR
Scuba Pete
Le plongeur avec attitude...
Well, nothing within "Reason". BTW, I think you got your user name in much the same way a really BIG guy gets called "Tiny".
But in keeping with the topic... no, TVOR has done NOTHING for me lately.
Mr Spinkles
Mr
Hey, get outta here, NetDoc--you're not an atheist!
And you, TVOR...I thought you were agnostic (or as I like to call them, "wannabe atheists").
And you, TVOR...I thought you were agnostic (or as I like to call them, "wannabe atheists").
Scuba Pete
Le plongeur avec attitude...
I was atheistic for at least 6 months. And agnostic for far longer than that. I got rights!
Faust
Active Member
Hey Sprinks! Look what I can do! NetDoc taught me! (quote originally posted by).Mr. Sprinkles said:
No Sprinks, This is in reference to another thread, (What is the value of life).
As an atheist, while I'm alive, the entire universe exists for me, but when I cease to exist, The universe no longer exists for me. Thats a pretty big deal. We must enjoy every bit of this while we can and try not to mess it up for anyone else either. Since I approach this as a former theist, afterlife and theism are one and the same. I believe that "most" forms of theism propose an afterlife and that is their main draw.
This brings up another important point, most people want to go on being, they are sometimes consumed with the idea of going on indefinitely. But when I think about not existing anymore I consider the fact that I do not lament the time I did not exist before I was born simply because I did not exist. Why should I lament the time I will not "be" after I die? I will not exist then either. Isn't that the same thing?
Have I clarified or muttled?
Faust.
Faust
Active Member
Welcome Karl!Krazy Karl said:
I must say though that this statement is rather unfair. Seems like a pretty broad brush to be painting with!
I'm sorry if your personal experience has lead you to this misconception but I assure you that most of the atheists I know seem to be even more sensitive to living a moral lifestyle than a good deal of the theists I have personally come in contact with, but I do not use that to base my opinion of theists in general.
Please stick around for awhile and follow some of our discussions and maybe your perception of the "atheist lifestyle" will be altered.
Faust.