What if Jesus comes tomorrow?

[PruePhillip]

I'm going to limit the discussion to the Zecheriah 12:9-10 quote, since really this is the one that matters most to Christians.

Let me requote it for the record: Zecheriah 12:10 in Jewish Bibles:
10 And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplication; and they shall look unto Me because of the one they have thrust through; and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his first-born.

According to Christians this is supposed to be a messianic prophecy that is fulfilled in John 19:34-37
34 Instead, one of the soldiers pierced Jesus’ side with a spear, bringing a sudden flow of blood and water. 35 The man who saw it has given testimony, and his testimony is true. He knows that he tells the truth, and he testifies so that you also may believe. 36 These things happened so that the scripture would be fulfilled: “Not one of his bones will be broken,” 37 and, as another scripture says, “They will look on the one they have pierced.


If I'm remembering this correctly, Zechariah ch. 12 is about the battle at the end of time. In the middle of that battle, a miracle is going to happen -- someone is going to get killed, and this death is going to cause Israel to so deeply mourn that Israel will repent and turn back to God. It will be like the mourning in the Valley of Megiddo. What's that mean?

Often when God wants to speak to us of a future event, he says, "Remember when that happened back there? It will be like that."

If you read 2 Chronicles 35 about the death of King Josiah, you will understand. King Josiah disguises himself as an ordinary soldier so that he can fight alongside his men in battle. He is slain by archers. It is written that ALLLLL of Israel mourned for him. Jeremiah himself wrote the great lamentation for him. There was nothing again ever like it.

So all of this is who is pierced. Not Jesus.

The mourning wasn't that someone died. The Jews will see the one who saves them
once died at their own hands. He was the lowly man who came to them on the donkey.
But now he rules supreme over the nations.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

The mourning wasn't that someone died. The Jews will see the one who saves them
once died at their own hands. He was the lowly man who came to them on the donkey.
But now he rules supreme over the nations.

I guess you didn't read my post.

And if Jesus now rules supreme over the Nations, he has been doing a really, really lousy job of it for the last 2000 years.

 

[PruePhillip]

I guess you didn't read my post.

And if Jesus now rules supreme over the Nations, he has been doing a really, really lousy job of it for the last 2000 years.

I read your post, twice.
The Messianic figure who will rule over the nations was not like some Josiah figure.
Not sure of the Roman piercing Jesus point - are you saying it wasn't the Jews who
did this? If so the argument is disingenuous as it was Jews who ultimately put Jesus
on the cross, not the Romans.
What I love about the two verses is Zechariah is speaking of the traditional Messianic
king, but linking him to the Messianic Redeemer, also in the Jewish bible.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

I read your post, twice.
The Messianic figure who will rule over the nations was not like some Josiah figure.
Not sure of the Roman piercing Jesus point - are you saying it wasn't the Jews who
did this? If so the argument is disingenuous as it was Jews who ultimately put Jesus
on the cross, not the Romans.
What I love about the two verses is Zechariah is speaking of the traditional Messianic
king, but linking him to the Messianic Redeemer, also in the Jewish bible.

Messianic figure? I see where you are confused. The one who is pierced is not the Messiah. This is not a messianic prophesy.

 

[PruePhillip]

Messianic figure? I see where you are confused. The one who is pierced is not the Messiah. This is not a messianic prophesy.

When Daniel speaks of the one will be "cut off" for his people by
the nation that destroys the temple and Jerusalem, who do YOU
think that is?
When Job says, "I know my Redeemer lives and he shall stand
on the earth in the latter days." Who is this?
When David speaks of the one rejected even of his own brothers
and sisters, suffers a cruel death, is resurrected and sees that
sacrifice is pleasing to God - who is this?
When Moses, "the meekest man in all the world" speaks of God
sending one "like me" who do you think it is?

 

[chinu]

1) How would this event be covered by the media?

Man who was acting as a "Jesus" has been arrested and put in jail by police

2) Would anything drastic happen, economically?

Nothing will happen.

3) What would the political establishment do? What would world leaders have to say?

Do nothing, Say nothing. Because if they would have to do, or say anything, then "Jesus" would have never been hanged on the cross on "His" first visit.

4) What would happen on the Internet?

010101 as usual.

5) Would there be civil disturbances of some kind? Or mass celebrations?

NO, nothing.

6) What would the Atheists do? (Assuming there would be obvious miracles being performed that they would be able to observe)

"Jesus" will never perform any kind of miracles (Even he's capable to do so)
IF "He" would have to perform any miracle, then "He" would have never been hanged on the cross on "His" first visit.

7) How would adherents to religions other than Christianity react? (Bearing in mind he hasn't yet said ,anything...)

No need to react. Because, even adherents to Christianity will also not accept "Him" as "Jesus"

8) Would it all of a sudden somehow make the world a better place? Or would it make the world a more dangerous and unstable place? What do you think?

"Jesus" mission never included any kind of plan to make the world a better place.
"Jesus" very well knows that this world can never become a better place. Hence, "His" mission was always a "Salvation" or say.. "Salvation-from-World".

 

[IndigoChild5559]

When Daniel speaks of the one will be "cut off" for his people by
the nation that destroys the temple and Jerusalem, who do YOU
think that is?
When Job says, "I know my Redeemer lives and he shall stand
on the earth in the latter days." Who is this?
When David speaks of the one rejected even of his own brothers
and sisters, suffers a cruel death, is resurrected and sees that
sacrifice is pleasing to God - who is this?
When Moses, "the meekest man in all the world" speaks of God
sending one "like me" who do you think it is?

First of all, I notice that none of these questions deal with the one who was pierced, so my assumption is that you have acquiesced.

Job: the Redeemer is God. Not the messiah.

David: David is speaking of his own self. He even speaks of himself after the resurrection.

Moses: the prophet like unto Moses that will come was Joshua.

 

[PruePhillip]

Messianic figure? I see where you are confused. The one who is pierced is not the Messiah. This is not a messianic prophesy.

The one pierced.
David and Zechariah mention this piercing. If I recall, Psalms 22, 69
and Zech 9 and 12.
The one pierced is lowly, riding upon a donkey, rejected, humiliated,
given vinegar and gall, his garments parted and gambled over,
disbelieved upon of his mother's sons and daughters, sees his ribs
sticking out, has his tongue cleaved to his mouth, says "My god, my
God, why have you forsaken me?" and he will have a posterity in the
earth and they will proclaim to generations yet born that "he has done
this."
And then the nation that wanted a King but not a Redeemer will mourn
when they finally see their king - it's the lowly one they once pierced.

 

[PruePhillip]

"Jesus" will never perform any kind of miracles (Even he's capable to do so)
IF "He" would have to perform any miracle, then "He" would have never been hanged on the cross on "His" first visit.
No need to react. Because, even adherents to Christianity will also not accept "Him" as "Jesus"

"Jesus" mission never included any kind of plan to make the world a better place.
"Jesus" very well knows that this world can never become a better place. Hence, "His" mission was always a "Salvation" or say.. "Salvation-from-World".

Think it says in Isaiah that the suffering Redeemer will heal the sick, raise the dead and after
his own death will live to see the fruits of his suffering.
The miracles Jesus performed in the Gospels were a demonstration that he was this man.
Yes, he didn't come to make a better world, and that's a point many people misunderstand.
Many who were healed by him still not believe in him. Jesus said the world will get worse
and worse, until he comes again. And a sign that the Gentiles were finished was the Jews
taking back Jerusalem - an event which has already happened.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

The one pierced.
David and Zechariah mention this piercing. If I recall, Psalms 22, 69
and Zech 9 and 12.
The one pierced is lowly, riding upon a donkey, rejected, humiliated,
given vinegar and gall, his garments parted and gambled over,
disbelieved upon of his mother's sons and daughters, sees his ribs
sticking out, has his tongue cleaved to his mouth, says "My god, my
God, why have you forsaken me?" and he will have a posterity in the
earth and they will proclaim to generations yet born that "he has done
this."
And then the nation that wanted a King but not a Redeemer will mourn
when they finally see their king - it's the lowly one they once pierced.

You need to stop splicing verses together that deal with different subjects -- stay focused. You also can't just add any verse which uses the word pierced.

Quote ONLY those chapter and verses (quote and cite) that you think are referring to Jesus. Then we'll talk.

 

[PruePhillip]

You need to stop splicing verses together that deal with different subjects -- stay focused. You also can't just add any verse which uses the word pierced.

Quote ONLY those chapter and verses (quote and cite) that you think are referring to Jesus. Then we'll talk.

ALL of the above speak of Jesus. You have some other figure that fulfills these?
Daniel speaks of the "people of the prince" who destroy Jerusalem and the Temple,
and "cut off" the Messiah. I just can't imagine there will be a third temple and a
third time when Jews go into exile for rejecting their Messiah.

 

[Muffled]

Ok, why.

Why not do coming in all glory the first time?

If there is a God, I doubt anyone has the right idea about what is going to happen.

I believe everything happens at the right time.

I believe that is because you have no basis to judge.

 

[Muffled]

Man who was acting as a "Jesus" has been arrested and put in jail by police

Nothing will happen.

Do nothing, Say nothing. Because if they would have to do, or say anything, then "Jesus" would have never been hanged on the cross on "His" first visit.

010101 as usual.

NO, nothing.

"Jesus" will never perform any kind of miracles (Even he's capable to do so)
IF "He" would have to perform any miracle, then "He" would have never been hanged on the cross on "His" first visit.
No need to react. Because, even adherents to Christianity will also not accept "Him" as "Jesus"

"Jesus" mission never included any kind of plan to make the world a better place.
"Jesus" very well knows that this world can never become a better place. Hence, "His" mission was always a "Salvation" or say.. "Salvation-from-World".

I believe that will not happen either for the antiChrist or for Jesus.

I believe wiping out the armies of the world could be considered a miracle. I believe the reason Jesus did not perform a miracle to save Himself was because the crucifixion was His objective.

I believe saving people makes the world a better place.

 

[Thief]

What would happen on the Internet?

this Forum would be worth millions
and I would then sue the owner for copyright infringement

 

[firedragon]

What would happen if Jesus comes back tomorrow??

Honestly he would kick everyone into oblivion for moulding his picture into something he would never recognise.

 

[TrueBeliever37]

Here's a thought experiment:

OK, so imagine tomorrow Jesus Christ comes down to Earth, from Heaven, thus bringing about his second coming:

I was wondering, what may happen once he shows up? But before he actually does or says anything?

So, once he appears and makes himself known, but before he says or does anything:

1) How would this event be covered by the media?

2) Would anything drastic happen, economically?

3) What would the political establishment do? What would world leaders have to say?

4) What would happen on the Internet?

5) Would there be civil disturbances of some kind? Or mass celebrations?

6) What would the Atheists do? (Assuming there would be obvious miracles being performed that they would be able to observe)

7) How would adherents to religions other than Christianity react? (Bearing in mind he hasn't yet said anything...)

8) Would it all of a sudden somehow make the world a better place? Or would it make the world a more dangerous and unstable place? What do you think?

1-The media won't have time to cover anything.
2-The economy won't matter anymore.
3-World leaders won't have any say so anymore.
4- Too late for anything to be put on the internet.
5-Those who have served him will rejoice. Those who haven't will try to hide in the caves and dens of the earth, and cry out for the rocks and mountains to fall on them and hide them from his face.
6-Atheists will realize they were wrong and their knees will knock with fear.
7-Other religions will realize they were wrong.
8-This world will be destroyed with fire.

 

[Riders]

Here's a thought experiment:

OK, so imagine tomorrow Jesus Christ comes down to Earth, from Heaven, thus bringing about his second coming:

I was wondering, what may happen once he shows up? But before he actually does or says anything?

So, once he appears and makes himself known, but before he says or does anything:

1) How would this event be covered by the media?

2) Would anything drastic happen, economically?

3) What would the political establishment do? What would world leaders have to say?

4) What would happen on the Internet?

5) Would there be civil disturbances of some kind? Or mass celebrations?

6) What would the Atheists do? (Assuming there would be obvious miracles being performed that they would be able to observe)

7) How would adherents to religions other than Christianity react? (Bearing in mind he hasn't yet said anything...)

8) Would it all of a sudden somehow make the world a better place? Or would it make the world a more dangerous and unstable place? What do you think?

How would we know he's coming to earth? Hes a human being, the size of a human, if he falls out of the sky we won't know it. There might be some strange interaction in the sky but I'm sure NASA would come up with an explanation for him. But when he gets here, he'll just look like another human being.

Will he be wearing regular clothes like us? What country will he be in, how will anyone know he's Jesus? Jesus is a normal name , if he says he's Jesus the Christ we will just think he's crazy. How would we know him from anyone else, he's suppose to look like a normal human being according to the bible.

He doesn't have horns or look like an alien does he? The bible says he's a normal human so there is no reason to think we would even acknowledge as being Jesus.

 

[Riders]

1-The media won't have time to cover anything.
2-The economy won't matter anymore.
3-World leaders won't have any say so anymore.
4- Too late for anything to be put on the internet.
5-Those who have served him will rejoice. Those who haven't will try to hide in the caves and dens of the earth, and cry out for the rocks and mountains to fall on them and hide them from his face.
6-Atheists will realize they were wrong and their knees will knock with fear.
7-Other religions will realize they were wrong.
8-This world will be destroyed with fire.

We wont see him coming, he's too small, as a human being falling out of the sky, we won't notice anything, we wont even know he's here. There might be some activity in the stars or sky but I'm sure NASA would come up with an explanation. He's just a regular sized human being , falling out from the sky we would not know him, where would he land, what country would he be in?

 

[Eddi]

How would we know he's coming to earth? Hes a human being, the size of a human, if he falls out of the sky we won't know it. There might be some strange interaction in the sky but I'm sure NASA would come up with an explanation for him. But when he gets here, he'll just look like another human being.

Will he be wearing regular clothes like us? What country will he be in, how will anyone know he's Jesus? Jesus is a normal name , if he says he's Jesus the Christ we will just think he's crazy. How would we know him from anyone else, he's suppose to look like a normal human being according to the bible.

He doesn't have horns or look like an alien does he? The bible says he's a normal human so there is no reason to think we would even acknowledge as being Jesus.

No human can possibly hope to answer those questions...

But I believe his second coming has been in the planning stage for around 2,000 years, so I should imagine all your points could be answered by those who are in the know

As regards him coming from the heavens: I believe this will be a spectacular event that everyone would recognise as a miracle and that nobody will miss. Personally, I imagine clouds parting, rays of sunshine, angels, all that sort of thing...

 

[Riders]

No human can possibly hope to answer those questions...

But I believe his second coming has been in the planning stage for around 2,000 years, so I should imagine all your points could be answered by those who are in the know

As regards him coming from the heavens: I believe this will be a spectacular event that everyone would recognise as a miracle and that nobody will miss. Personally, I imagine clouds parting, rays of sunshine, angels, all that sort of thing...

Where in the bible is that? I guarantee you NASA will still come up with an explanation.