What if we accepted each others Religion?

[Trailblazer]

Jews don't even accept Christ but I hardly see Baha'is saying anything about that.

Baha'is don't say much about it since Bahais don't generally get in discussions with Jews, but Baha'u'llah had a lot to say about Jews rejecting Christ, and it was not pretty. I posted a long passage when I first joined this forum and I got a lot of backlash from some Jews who were offended, but it was what He wrote and I agree with it.

Below is part of a long passage where Baha'u'llah chastised the Jews for not recognizing the beauty of Jesus and of beholding the Face of God.

“And when the days of Moses were ended, and the light of Jesus, shining forth from the Day Spring of the Spirit, encompassed the world, all the people of Israel arose in protest against Him. They clamored that He Whose advent the Bible had foretold must needs promulgate and fulfil the laws of Moses, whereas this youthful Nazarene, who laid claim to the station of the divine Messiah, had annulled the laws of divorce and of the sabbath day—the most weighty of all the laws of Moses. Moreover, what of the signs of the Manifestation yet to come? These people of Israel are even unto the present day still expecting that Manifestation which the Bible hath foretold! How many Manifestations of Holiness, how many Revealers of the light everlasting, have appeared since the time of Moses, and yet Israel, wrapt in the densest veils of satanic fancy and false imaginings, is still expectant that the idol of her own handiwork will appear with such signs as she herself hath conceived! Thus hath God laid hold of them for their sins, hath extinguished in them the spirit of faith, and tormented them with the flames of the nethermost fire. And this for no other reason except that Israel refused to apprehend the meaning of such words as have been revealed in the Bible concerning the signs of the coming Revelation. As she never grasped their true significance, and, to outward seeming, such events never came to pass, she, therefore, remained deprived of recognizing the beauty of Jesus and of beholding the Face of God. And they still await His coming! From time immemorial even unto this day, all the kindreds and peoples of the earth have clung to such fanciful and unseemly thoughts, and thus have deprived themselves of the clear waters streaming from the springs of purity and holiness...”
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 20-21

Baha'u'llah also chastised the Jews for not recognizing Muhammad.

“When the Unseen, the Eternal, the Divine Essence, caused the Day Star of Muhammad to rise above the horizon of knowledge, among the cavils which the Jewish divines raised against Him was that after Moses no Prophet should be sent of God. Yea, mention hath been made in the Scriptures of a Soul Who must needs be made manifest and Who will advance the Faith, and promote the interests of the people of Moses, so that the Law of the Mosaic Dispensation may encompass the whole earth.Thus hath the King of eternal glory referred in His Book to the words uttered by those wanderers in the vale of remoteness and error: “‘The hand of God,’ say the Jews, ‘is chained up.’ Chained up be their own hands; And for that which they have said, they were accursed. Nay, outstretched are both His hands!” “The hand of God is above their hands.”
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 22-23

 

[Trailblazer]

So essentially, Baha'is do say and make Christianity false... along with all the other religions.

No, Baha'is do not say that Christianity is false. We only say that some of the man-made Christian doctrines are false.
The official Baha'i position on Christianity is as follows:

“As to the position of Christianity, let it be stated without any hesitation or equivocation that its divine origin is unconditionally acknowledged, that the Sonship and Divinity of Jesus Christ are fearlessly asserted, that the divine inspiration of the Gospel is fully recognized, that the reality of the mystery of the Immaculacy of the Virgin Mary is confessed, and the primacy of Peter, the Prince of the Apostles, is upheld and defended. The Founder of the Christian Faith is designated by Bahá’u’lláh as the “Spirit of God,” is proclaimed as the One Who “appeared out of the breath of the Holy Ghost,” and is even extolled as the “Essence of the Spirit.” His mother is described as “that veiled and immortal, that most beauteous, countenance,” and the station of her Son eulogized as a “station which hath been exalted above the imaginings of all that dwell on earth,” whilst Peter is recognized as one whom God has caused “the mysteries of wisdom and of utterance to flow out of his mouth.”
The Promised Day is Come, pp. 109-110

 

[Trailblazer]

What she failed to mention is that Christians do recognize the Jewish religion.

Well, that goes without saying and that is to the credit of the Christians.

The Jews are in a class by themselves because they believe they have the only true religion, since they did not recognize any of the Messengers of God who came after Moses. For Jews, the Torah is the only scripture that is true. They do not generally share this or get in debates about it since they don't even think it is debatable.

 

[Trailblazer]

Zoroaster, Muhammad and the last two are totally irrelevant to Christianity, just as Krishna is. Jesus is God in the flesh. There's no one else we need after His revelation and atonement. By saying we need to accept Muhammad and the others, you're saying that Jesus isn't enough, that He is not God and He didn't atone for us. A Christian could never agree with that. There's no need for any other prophets or such.

These individuals who Baha'is consider Messengers of God are irrelevant to Christianity since they had a totally different mission from God.

Imo, Jesus had the most important mission from God since He was the One who originally conferred salvation upon all of humanity.
I would never have believed that had I never become a Baha'i. My love and reverence for Jesus comes from what Baha'u'llah wrote about Jesus.

Baha'u'llah also conferred salvation, which is why He said WE in the following passage, but that was after we had already been saved by Jesus.

“WE, verily, have come for your sakes, and have borne the misfortunes of the world for your salvation. Flee ye the One Who hath sacrificed His life that ye may be quickened? Fear God, O followers of the Spirit (Jesus), and walk not in the footsteps of every divine that hath gone far astray… Open the doors of your hearts. He Who is the Spirit (Jesus) verily, standeth before them.”
Proclamation of Bahá’u’lláh, p, 92

 

[McBell]

It is different with the Muslims because the Muslims accept not only Muhammad, but also Christ and Moses and all the other Messengers of God.
Christians do not accept anyone but Jesus and they reject all the religions except Christianity.

What does that have to do with:

Other religions cannot unite with Christians because they believe that Christianity is the only true religion for all of time and eternity.​

​

Do not the Muslims believe the same thing about Islam?

 

[TransmutingSoul]

It is not just a coincidence that I have posted mainly to atheists and agnostics for the last 11 years on various religious forums.
At least there is something to talk about.

It is not the people I talk about, it is the mindset.

I am unable to see how unity can take hold until the councels of the Pen of the Most High are embraced, this is a prerequisite to unity.

It may be possible this can happen without acknowledgement of the source, but humanity is not showing this will be the path.

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Atheists and agnostics are not standing in the way of the unity of mankind.

The reason why unity has thus far not taken hold is because of the Christians.
Other religions cannot unite with Christians because they believe that Christianity is the only true religion for all of time and eternity.
Missing that is like missing the broad side of a barn!

There are many fronts and many reasons.

Regards

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Realistically, if it was even a possible interpretation (big if since it's impossible), God would be a big time deceiver from his words in Quran, and sought to disunite people from the truth and make it difficult, if what Baha'allah claims to be true.

I do not see a deception, I see it is our unwillingness to accept God given explanations.

We have deceived our own selves.

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Or you could just admit that people worldwide are experiencing a multiplicity of the divine and we can perhaps just focus on our own gods and goddesses, and the relationship we have with them... and grant to others their own experiences and relationships.

Why don't we build our oneness on the fact that we are all stuck in the same place: a tiny rock hurtling through space which we currently cannot leave.

Why are we yet to acheive that?

Would it not take a plan of action?

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Due to the fact that….“the realisation that God is One and there is no exclusive faith”……
has been shown throughout history, up to and including the present and foreseeable future, to actually mean……”the realisation that God is One and there is no other exclusive faith other than mine”….by the majority of those that might utter such a phrase……

I do not see that is the meaning.

Regards Tony

 

[Trailblazer]

What does that have to do with:

Other religions cannot unite with Christians because they believe that Christianity is the only true religion for all of time and eternity.​

​

Do not the Muslims believe the same thing about Islam?

Yes, Muslims believe that Islam is the true religion now and for the future, although Muslims believe that there were other true religions before Islam.
To be fair, Christians believe that Judaism was a true religion that preceded Christianity, until the Jews rejected Christ.

The gist of it is that religions cannot unite unless religious people cease to believe that their religion is the 'best' and 'last', the religion for all time.
Jews, Christians and Muslims all hold this belief.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

A Christian could never agree with that. There's no need for any other prophets or such.

History has shown that a Christian, a Hindu, a Jew, a Zoroastrian, a Muslim and many people of other faiths, can embrace that new frame of reference.

Regards Tony

 

[Shaul]

Baha'is don't say much about it since Bahais don't generally get in discussions with Jews, but Baha'u'llah had a lot to say about Jews rejecting Christ, and it was not pretty. I posted a long passage when I first joined this forum and I got a lot of backlash from some Jews who were offended, but it was what He wrote and I agree with it.

Below is part of a long passage where Baha'u'llah chastised the Jews for not recognizing the beauty of Jesus and of beholding the Face of God.

“And when the days of Moses were ended, and the light of Jesus, shining forth from the Day Spring of the Spirit, encompassed the world, all the people of Israel arose in protest against Him. They clamored that He Whose advent the Bible had foretold must needs promulgate and fulfil the laws of Moses, whereas this youthful Nazarene, who laid claim to the station of the divine Messiah, had annulled the laws of divorce and of the sabbath day—the most weighty of all the laws of Moses. Moreover, what of the signs of the Manifestation yet to come? These people of Israel are even unto the present day still expecting that Manifestation which the Bible hath foretold! How many Manifestations of Holiness, how many Revealers of the light everlasting, have appeared since the time of Moses, and yet Israel, wrapt in the densest veils of satanic fancy and false imaginings, is still expectant that the idol of her own handiwork will appear with such signs as she herself hath conceived! Thus hath God laid hold of them for their sins, hath extinguished in them the spirit of faith, and tormented them with the flames of the nethermost fire. And this for no other reason except that Israel refused to apprehend the meaning of such words as have been revealed in the Bible concerning the signs of the coming Revelation. As she never grasped their true significance, and, to outward seeming, such events never came to pass, she, therefore, remained deprived of recognizing the beauty of Jesus and of beholding the Face of God. And they still await His coming! From time immemorial even unto this day, all the kindreds and peoples of the earth have clung to such fanciful and unseemly thoughts, and thus have deprived themselves of the clear waters streaming from the springs of purity and holiness...”
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 20-21

Baha'u'llah also chastised the Jews for not recognizing Muhammad.

“When the Unseen, the Eternal, the Divine Essence, caused the Day Star of Muhammad to rise above the horizon of knowledge, among the cavils which the Jewish divines raised against Him was that after Moses no Prophet should be sent of God. Yea, mention hath been made in the Scriptures of a Soul Who must needs be made manifest and Who will advance the Faith, and promote the interests of the people of Moses, so that the Law of the Mosaic Dispensation may encompass the whole earth.Thus hath the King of eternal glory referred in His Book to the words uttered by those wanderers in the vale of remoteness and error: “‘The hand of God,’ say the Jews, ‘is chained up.’ Chained up be their own hands; And for that which they have said, they were accursed. Nay, outstretched are both His hands!” “The hand of God is above their hands.”
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 22-23h

Oh, that wacky Baha'u'llah. What a mashugana.
If the Jews are so wrong how come HaShem has returned them to their land including control over the Bahai Temple and gardens in Haifa?

 

[Secret Chief]

The gist of it is that religions cannot unite unless religious people cease to believe that their religion is the best and last.

Try telling that to the Bahais.

 

[Trailblazer]

History has shown that a Christian, a Hindu, a Jew, a Zoroastrian, a Muslim and many people of other faiths, can embrace that new frame of reference.

Regards Tony

Yes they can, but it is not very common.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Newsflash: You can be respectful of others without compromising your own beliefs!

Respectful is very good but I prefer being as brother's. There’s things we understand differently but the basic commandment to love one another encompasses all religions and eliminates all boundaries between us. I look forward to that day. I am imperfect and often lack wisdom but I know we are all one humankind and all children of one Heavenly Father so there’s no real reason for these wars, hatreds and prejudices.

The only way forward really and the only way to defeat hate is not with guns and bombs but the most powerful weapons in the universe, love and brotherhood.

 

[Truthseeker]

Well, that goes without saying and that is to the credit of the Christians.

The Jews are in a class by themselves because they believe they have the only true religion, since they did not recognize any of the Messengers of God who came after Moses. For Jews, the Torah is the only scripture that is true. They do not generally share this or get in debates about it since they don't even think it is debatable.

I knew you knew that, and it was just an oversight.

 

[Trailblazer]

Try telling that to the Bahais.

I don't have to since Baha'is do not believe believe that the Baha'i Faith is the 'best' religion.
We do not believe that any religion is better than any other religion. Religious are just different because mankind's needs are different in every age.

“These principles and laws, these firmly-established and mighty systems, have proceeded from one Source, and are the rays of one Light. That they differ one from another is to be attributed to the varying requirements of the ages in which they were promulgated.”​

Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 287-288​

Baha'is also do not believe that the Baha'i Faith is the 'last' religion that will ever be revealed. Rather, we believe that Messengers of God will continue to be sent by God throughout all time.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Try telling that to the Bahais.

Very untrue. This is where people make unfounded judgements clearly having no knowledge at all on what is the Baha’i belief. It is written in our scripture that all religions are true and equal and we are ‘forbidden’ to exalt one over the other. That is why we read from all scriptures of all religions at our services not only Baha‘i and why all our Houses of Worship have the symbols of all religions ‘engraved’ in their architecture.

We really truly believe in other religions not just for show.

Here are the Words of Baha’u’llah on the topic …

In thine esteemed letter thou hadst inquired which of the Prophets of God should be regarded as superior to others. Know thou assuredly that the essence of all the Prophets of God is one and the same. Their unity is absolute. God, the Creator, saith: There is no distinction whatsoever among the Bearers of My Message. They all have but one purpose; their secret is the same secret. To prefer one in honor to another, to exalt certain ones above the rest, is in no wise to be permitted. Every true Prophet hath regarded His Message as fundamentally the same as the Revelation of every other Prophet gone before Him.

 

[Trailblazer]

Oh, that wacky Baha'u'llah. What a mashugana.
If the Jews are so wrong how come HaShem has returned them to their land including control over the Bahai Temple and gardens in Haifa?

I believe that the Jews were wrong to reject Jesus but that doesn't mean they were wrong about everything.

Jews were able to return to their homeland since that was the will of God, as prophesied in the Bible.