Satyamavejayanti
Well-Known Member
"तत्त्वप्रह्व, post: 4842538, member: 55730"
Namaste,
Just to provoke your thoughts - the saṁskṛta term dharma /can/ include/s/ other religions as well, basically whatever an individual possesses and/or adopts is dharma, which why you'll find other religions when referred to in hindu languages are called dharma for eg., christianity becomes kraista-dharma, and that is also why religious conversion is dharma-parivartana or dharmāntaraṇa.
Well i personally think that Dharmah as used for other religions is applicable only when one defines what they mean by Dharmah in that context, so Dharmah-parivartana to me could mean changing the mode of worship, or could mean also that I have taken sanyasa and my Grahista Dharmah has changed, so it depends on context. As for things like Christ Dharmah - really it then becomes important that I personally analyze this to ensure that this christ Dharmah emphasizes Satya and Ahinsa as being higher then any other idea of that so called Dharmah, in other words if Christ is subbordinate to Dharmah of Satya and Ahimsa then people can call it Christ Dharmah and i would not contend that.
Also when you say sanātana, what exactly are you referring to? As in, for me, dharma is sanātana because it is based on the vedas which are apauruṣeya, hence sanātana.
Well in my view "Sanatana" as simply "never ending", infinite, multitude, Apurushay + "Dharmah" which is Changing, evolving, specific, Individual, Apurushay and in contrast and opposite of Adharmah.
Hope this makes sense.
In a way, i'd agree with you, in that not having any value system (other than that of immediate pleasure) can itself be a (sort of) dharma - this is what the cārvaka system says, but then if you consider the cārvaka mata also as dhārmika, then wouldn't the necessity to differentiate b/w dharma and adharma itself disappear?
Well it maybe for the Charvaka the difference between Dharmah and Adharmah is hard to establish, but my essential idea is that if I as a Hindu were to Label the Charvaks as Adharma without any evidence, this for me is Asatya and therefore Adharmah in itself.
CM: The highest dharma is that which satisfies my immediate desires.
TD: But what if that desire contains in it the seed of destruction of community?
CM: It doesn't matter, there is no way i can judge the unforeseen repercussions of my action, hence, i don't think it is necessary to worry about it.
TD: Repercussions need not be always unforeseen, if you steal for the sake of satisfying your hunger, then you are not only causing unwarranted, unprovoked trouble to the other person, but also transgressing his personal rights.
CM: Not necessarily. I will steal only from those who are very rich, hence i'd only be obtaining my needs from those who have more than what they need.
TD: Even in that case, if everyone starts to live by these standards, the entire system will implode and there will widespread social unrest.
CM: The system you speak of is itself made of individuals like me, so as long as every individual is given the freedom to obtain what (s)he desires the system as a whole will also be fine.
I think your confusing Charvaks with Marxists, lol. But i see what you mean, and all we can do in this situation is to provide the direct perception of "social unrest", as evidence to the Charvak, to prove that his Dharmah of "immediate desires" is actually Adharmah, and if he refuses direct perceivable evidence, that person i would not even consider as Charvak let alone Dharmic. But if we cant provide any direct Parmana then what justification can we have to label the Dharmah of the Charvak as Adharmic?
The very foundation of cārvāka system is that there is nothing called pāpa and/or puṇya.
But I as a Hindu do have Papa and Punya Karma as my criteria of understanding and making decisions on actions, Charvaks can differ but it does not change my perspective.
You began with this proposition:
I began essentially with "To me", so being Hindu to me is Dharmah, but Dharmah does not equate to Hinduism only.
How would you say dharma alleviates duḥḳa? I know many brahmins for whom performing their daily dharma itself is a major source of duḥḳa
Well, depends of what i mean by Dukha, to me Dukha is not being content, being in mental and physical pain, but best description i can think of is the sense of something lacking in life, weather it be money, wife, sex ect, i think what i explained earlier about Dharmah is a good place to start to help with the eliviation of Dukha.
My Guna of Dharmah,
"Responsibility, ethics, relationships, respect, worship, social wellbeing, individual wellbeing, practice, ritual, philosophy, wisdom, compassion, unity. Dharmah is the responsibility of the individual and the society at large, the practice of an ethical lifestyle, respect for the relationships we Humans have with each other and mother Bhumi, worship in any mode, in any style of many or none forms. Dharmah is the category produced for an individual to determine who is considered a Guru/Acharya/Purohita/Pundit/Swami/Deva and Devi so one can peruse personal wellbeing and happiness, Artha and Kama. Dharmah is there to produce an ethical, happy, content and respectful individual who forms part of a larger society so that the society of many well-grounded individuals can have wellbeing. Dharma is practical to be put into practice every moment of my life with rituals Dharmah creates a sense of responsibility and Shruddha, the philosophy of life and living is Dharmah. The wise who share their wisdom with those willing is a wise act within itself. Dharmah is extended not only to Humans but to all living and non-living beings/entities where compassion and respect are fostered not because this existence is for our use, but because Mata Bhumi has her own rights which we are taught to respect."
as for Brahmins, i would consider Nishkama Karma to be part of their Dharmah to avoid Dukha as much as possible. As nothing in the cosmos is full proof, Dukah i think will always exist, it can only be limited in its impact.
Please bear with my inquisitiveness, i'm just trying to understand how you've arrived at your perspective on hinduism that you described above.
You know this is a work in progress, a life long en devour, have not arrived anywhere yet.
Dhanyavad
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