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What is the Ground of Truth?

Nakosis

Non-Binary Physicalist
Premium Member
What do you use as the ground of truth?
The foundation from which all other truths are developed.
As an example, do you use the Bible as your ground of truth?
Do you go back to what is written in the Bible (or some other Holy work) to support what you claim as true?

When you say this is true or that is true, what is the foundation that you support your argument on?
 

syo

Well-Known Member
What do you use as the ground of truth?
The foundation from which all other truths are developed.
As an example, do you use the Bible as your ground of truth?
Do you go back to what is written in the Bible (or some other Holy work) to support what you claim as true?

When you say this is true or that is true, what is the foundation that you support your argument on?
I ask my husband. He is my superior at anything. I think.
 

mikkel_the_dane

My own religion
What do you use as the ground of truth?
The foundation from which all other truths are developed.
As an example, do you use the Bible as your ground of truth?
Do you go back to what is written in the Bible (or some other Holy work) to support what you claim as true?

When you say this is true or that is true, what is the foundation that you support your argument on?

That one is over 2000+ years old in the Western tradition and here is the latest round up of it.

As far as I can tell there are 5 different limited versions of truth. And none seem to be the truth. As for the ground, that is foundational rationalism and it has never been found. ;)

But as always, you can to find the ground of truth, but I wouldn't put any money on you and put a lot against you if offered the bet. But that is me.
 

wellwisher

Well-Known Member
What do you use as the ground of truth?
The foundation from which all other truths are developed.
As an example, do you use the Bible as your ground of truth?
Do you go back to what is written in the Bible (or some other Holy work) to support what you claim as true?

When you say this is true or that is true, what is the foundation that you support your argument on?
If you look at the evolution of human thought, hard sensory data cannot be the foundation of thought. For example, the ancient people had eyes and could easily see the sun and moon. However, that hard sensory data, did not prevent them from thinking these two natural objects were divine. If anything, this sensory data, confirmed their sensory expectations, from learned theory, about what these objects needed to represent.

What is fundamental is not hard sensory data, but our sensory expectations for this data and what it appears to mean. How you see reality, stems from your conceptual foundations.

As an example in science, nobody; few, expected to see hard sensory evidence of galaxies forming so fast and so early within the universe. But such hard data was recently found by a new more powerful telescope. Even thought this data was in front of everyone for decades, since they did not expect to see it, due to the existing theory, the brain will ignore it or reason it away. But now the genie is out of the bottle, due to hard data, nobody can deny. Galaxies, such as these, were speculated decades ago, but they placed out of the science mind, since the current theory denied their reality. Conceptual foundations can make you blind or give you extra sight.

In politics, one side of the isle can see riots, and the other side sees freedom fighters. Why don't both see the same thing, if both can describe the objective details, in the same way? It is due to sensory expectations coming from your conceptual foundation of thought. Data in is processed by this foundation. When Atheist argue about no hard data for God, they cannot see it, even if it was front of them, since they do not expect to see it, by their own conceptual foundation.

Conceptual foundations are not as tangible as the sensory data, which is why even science changes theories with time. As new data contradicts, old expectation, needed changes makes new sight appear.

Religion would be the base foundation, since it deals with the nebulous nature of all conceptual foundations. Faith is not about the eyes seeing, since that is influenced by conceptual expectations. But rather faith is more about being true to what you expect to see, even that which may not even be conscious yet, to the eyes. Some scientists had faith they would see very early galaxies, even though the pretentious consensus had to clue since they were blinded by their own conceptual bias. Religion teach us to be humble and hopeful to future clarity.
 

Quintessence

Consults with Trees
Staff member
Premium Member
All humans (nay, all living things in general) use their bodies as the "ground of truth." That is, the senses and that which processes sensory information. This one is certainly no exception to that. One cannot escape one's fundamental nature.
 

9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
What do you use as the ground of truth?
The foundation from which all other truths are developed.
As an example, do you use the Bible as your ground of truth?
Do you go back to what is written in the Bible (or some other Holy work) to support what you claim as true?

When you say this is true or that is true, what is the foundation that you support your argument on?
I suppose that "I exist" is the only ground of truth I have if I'm being honest with myself, but even that is questionable. "Cogito ergo sum" has its issues.
 

Nakosis

Non-Binary Physicalist
Premium Member
That one is over 2000+ years old in the Western tradition and here is the latest round up of it.

As far as I can tell there are 5 different limited versions of truth. And none seem to be the truth. As for the ground, that is foundational rationalism and it has never been found. ;)

But as always, you can to find the ground of truth, but I wouldn't put any money on you and put a lot against you if offered the bet. But that is me.

Yes, well I have a concept of truth. Don't know how original it is. Perhaps it is among your 5.
A truth humans can never actually know but possibly infer.
 

Nakosis

Non-Binary Physicalist
Premium Member
If you look at the evolution of human thought, hard sensory data cannot be the foundation of thought. For example, the ancient people had eyes and could easily see the sun and moon. However, that hard sensory data, did not prevent them from thinking these two natural objects were divine. If anything, this sensory data, confirmed their sensory expectations, from learned theory, about what these objects needed to represent.

What is fundamental is not hard sensory data, but our sensory expectations for this data and what it appears to mean. How you see reality, stems from your conceptual foundations.

As an example in science, nobody; few, expected to see hard sensory evidence of galaxies forming so fast and so early within the universe. But such hard data was recently found by a new more powerful telescope. Even thought this data was in front of everyone for decades, since they did not expect to see it, due to the existing theory, the brain will ignore it or reason it away. But now the genie is out of the bottle, due to hard data, nobody can deny. Galaxies, such as these, were speculated decades ago, but they placed out of the science mind, since the current theory denied their reality. Conceptual foundations can make you blind or give you extra sight.

In politics, one side of the isle can see riots, and the other side sees freedom fighters. Why don't both see the same thing, if both can describe the objective details, in the same way? It is due to sensory expectations coming from your conceptual foundation of thought. Data in is processed by this foundation. When Atheist argue about no hard data for God, they cannot see it, even if it was front of them, since they do not expect to see it, by their own conceptual foundation.

Conceptual foundations are not as tangible as the sensory data, which is why even science changes theories with time. As new data contradicts, old expectation, needed changes makes new sight appear.

Religion would be the base foundation, since it deals with the nebulous nature of all conceptual foundations. Faith is not about the eyes seeing, since that is influenced by conceptual expectations. But rather faith is more about being true to what you expect to see, even that which may not even be conscious yet, to the eyes. Some scientists had faith they would see very early galaxies, even though the pretentious consensus had to clue since they were blinded by their own conceptual bias. Religion teach us to be humble and hopeful to future clarity.
All humans (nay, all living things in general) use their bodies as the "ground of truth." That is, the senses and that which processes sensory information. This one is certainly no exception to that. One cannot escape one's fundamental nature.
I suppose that "I exist" is the only ground of truth I have if I'm being honest with myself, but even that is questionable. "Cogito ergo sum" has its issues.

Wouldn't any truth developed/understood by humans disappear when humans disappear?
 

Quintessence

Consults with Trees
Staff member
Premium Member
Wouldn't any truth developed/understood by humans disappear when humans disappear?
If you want to take a very anthropocentric view of things and hold certain assumptions about how time/space work, sure. The story can be told however you want to tell it.
 

osgart

Nothing my eye, Something for sure
Truth is the positive values/virtues that create trustworthiness, and deservedness, love, joy, and peace. There's about, at least 100 such positive character traits that I can think of.

Other then that it's also to be in accordance with reality.
 

Soandso

ᛋᛏᚨᚾᛞ ᛋᚢᚱᛖ
For me, my opinions on reality are shaped by the best physical evidence I've seen. When it comes to things I am ignorant on, I do make limited assumptions based on my limited understanding until I can better educate myself on the subject. It's not a perfect system, but at least it keeps me honest
 

Treasure Hunter

Well-Known Member
What do you use as the ground of truth?
The foundation from which all other truths are developed.
As an example, do you use the Bible as your ground of truth?
Do you go back to what is written in the Bible (or some other Holy work) to support what you claim as true?

When you say this is true or that is true, what is the foundation that you support your argument on?
I associate truth with life because truths associated with death I don’t want. So everything gets repeatedly cast into the fire (including me). Whatever gets destroyed is and always was unworthy.

There is no other way to do it. Anyone who doesn’t do it this way will die with their beliefs and their truth won’t matter in the future compared to the one who is still living.
 
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mikkel_the_dane

My own religion
I associate truth with life because truths associated with death I don’t want. So everything gets repeatedly cast into the fire (including me). Whatever gets extinguished is and always was unworthy.

There is no other way to do it. Anyone who doesn’t do it this way will die with their beliefs and their truth won’t matter in the future compared to the one who is still living.

Well, I am somewhat a realist as a former soldier, so I do death differently than you for some cases.
 

ChristineM

"Be strong", I whispered to my coffee.
Premium Member
There are several definitions of truth, I use the definition "that which is true or in accordance with fact or reality."

So if it can be measured or observed i reckon it's true
 
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