What is the nature of “nature”?

[oldbadger]

Yes, I agree, I guess it just depends on what aspects of nature you want to discuss, but definitely there's "human nature."
Still, I when I say, I'm going to go walk in nature, most people understand that to be around plants, landscape, earth, and not a crowd of people.

As to the nature of nature - no doubt it is incredibly intelligent.

Fair enough!

My kind of Deism forces me to see everything, from the smallest particles yet discovered, to the margins of our Universe and beyond, from the weakest forces to the strongest, as within nature.

I tend to look upon humanity and its various successes as a mere nothing by comparison with the brilliance of all else, in nature, and in space.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

So there cannot be any supernatural. Can there be? Please
Regards

Funnily enough, @paarsurrey, I would agree with this.
However, from your world view, this might be a way of looking at it...

Allah is beyond natural law, as are the angels, right?
So these would be examples of 'supernatural' concepts. They are not bound by the same dimensions or natural laws (eg. gravity) as us.

 

[Satyamavejayanti]

"paarsurrey, What is the nature of “nature”?

I think it is Naughty, because that is its Nature.

 

[paarsurrey]

Funnily enough, @paarsurrey, I would agree with this.
However, from your world view, this might be a way of looking at it...

Allah is beyond natural law, as are the angels, right?
So these would be examples of 'supernatural' concepts. They are not bound by the same dimensions or natural laws (eg. gravity) as us.

"Allah is beyond natural law, as are the angels, right?"

One neither believes in Allah nor the angels, how could one say that?:
I get the following from the truthful religion:

Verse (35:43)

Sahih International: [Due to] arrogance in the land and plotting of evil; but the evil plot does not encompass except its own people. Then do they await except the way of the former peoples? But you will never find in the way of Allah any change, and you will never find in the way of Allah any alteration.
Does nature bind the human beings? Please
Regards

 

[lewisnotmiller]

"Allah is beyond natural law, as are the angels, right?"

One neither believes in Allah nor the angels, how could one say that?:
I get the following from the truthful religion:

Verse (35:43)

Sahih International: [Due to] arrogance in the land and plotting of evil; but the evil plot does not encompass except its own people. Then do they await except the way of the former peoples? But you will never find in the way of Allah any change, and you will never find in the way of Allah any alteration.
Does nature bind the human beings? Please
Regards

Dude, seriously? I'm trying to help you. You're asking what supernatural means, and I am using examples from your worldview in order to help you understand the difference between natural and supernatural.
Heck, I even already said that from MY point of view, supernatural doesn't really make sense.

 

[paarsurrey]

Dude, seriously? I'm trying to help you. You're asking what supernatural means, and I am using examples from your worldview in order to help you understand the difference between natural and supernatural.
Heck, I even already said that from MY point of view, supernatural doesn't really make sense.

Thanks for helping me, and I am explaining the phenomenon that there cannot be any supernatural, as God has created the nature as per His attributes, so there cannot be anything against his attributes, truthfully. His attributes work without blemish, in a very natural way. Please
Regards

 

[lewisnotmiller]

Thanks for helping me, and I am explaining the phenomenon that there cannot be any supernatural, as God has created the nature as per His attributes, so there cannot be anything against his attributes, truthfully. His attributes work without blemish, in a very natural way. Please
Regards

So...you think God works under natural law? That's an unusual view, I would have thought.

Anyways, I tend to agree in terms of there not being such a thing as 'supernatural'.

 

[paarsurrey]

So...you think God works under natural law? That's an unusual view, I would have thought.

Anyways, I tend to agree in terms of there not being such a thing as 'supernatural'.

Some times the natural laws are intercepted or under influence of other natural laws that occur, if something occurs first, yet these are natural but under special circumstances not perceped earlier. Right? Please
Regards

 

[lewisnotmiller]

Some times the natural laws are intercepted or under influence of other natural laws that occur, if something occurs first, yet these are natural but under special circumstances not perceped earlier. Right? Please
Regards

Not entirely sure what you mean, but I would say that our concept of what is 'natural' can develop. So we might very well discover new things which we are unaware of today, and which sit outside our current understanding of nature. But they'd expand our understanding of 'nature', so I wouldn't see those as 'supernatural' at all.

 

[paarsurrey]

Not entirely sure what you mean, but I would say that our concept of what is 'natural' can develop. So we might very well discover new things which we are unaware of today, and which sit outside our current understanding of nature. But they'd expand our understanding of 'nature', so I wouldn't see those as 'supernatural' at all.

Me also
Please
Regards

 

[Aupmanyav]

But you will never find in the way of Allah any change, and you will never find in the way of Allah any alteration.

That is a great misfortune. What does not change with times, perishes.

 

[Jedster]

That is a great misfortune. What does not change with times, perishes.

Stagnation happens before perishing.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Right.

 

[Guy Threepwood]

What is the nature of “nature”?
Please
Regards

________________
The thread was conceptualized from post #131 in another thread:
"supernatural"
There is no supernatural, all created by G-d is only natural.

'the executor of God's laws' : Galileo

 

[paarsurrey]

'the executor of God's laws' : Galileo

Please elaborate.
Regards

 

[Willamena]

So there cannot be any supernatural. Can there be? Please
Regards

What is "nature" is what is derived by observance and man doesn't observe the supernatural.

 

[Madhuri]

So there cannot be any supernatural. Can there be? Please
Regards

The term 'supernatural' only has meaning if we use the definition of 'nature' to be anything confined to the material existence. Thus anything associated with spirit or different platforms of existence beyond matter is technically 'supernatural'. That is why God, angels, ghosts etc. are considered supernatural because most religions see them as associated more with spirit.

I do not know if Allah in Islam is believed to be of matter or spirit so I do not know if the term 'supernatural' can apply in Islam.

Having said that, I do not agree that 'nature' should be restricted to reference to matter only. So when I first see the question of 'what is the nature of nature'? I think, which nature? Or the nature of nature of what?

 

[Scuba Pete]

Nature, natura and phusis... three words that mean the same. My favorite trio. CS Lewis wrote a book on them. It's been 35 years since I've read it, but there were a number of lessons for me in that book.

• Every creation (object or creature) has a reason for being.
  • Good
  • Bad
  • Neutral
• Every creation has attributes that define it.
  • A chair has "chairness"
  • Humans have humanity (a spiritual aspect)
  • Creatures have unique characteristics that make them a cat, a dog etc.
• Creatures are happiest that fulfill/honor their nature.
  • Humans are happiest when they show kindness and love.
  • Animals are best when they fit in the order of things.
  • Sin is the state of not fulfilling/honoring your nature.
• Objects are most useful that fulfill/honor their nature.
  • Well made objsects are cherished for their usefulness
  • A chair that can not support you is usually thrown out

Then we have the dichotomy presented by "natural", "supernatural" and the thus far ignored term "unnatural". The first and the last mostly refer to physical attributes while "supernatural" refers to the spiritual. It's hard for us to dissect this because we are spirits in a material world.

 

[Guy Threepwood]

Please elaborate.
Regards

As Galileo said, nature is the executor of God's laws, i.e. the processes by which his creation operates.

It also solves the infinite regression paradox unique to naturalism- where the laws of nature must be accounted for by- those very same laws. It provides a creative capacity and purpose for those laws existing

 

[paarsurrey]

The term 'supernatural' only has meaning if we use the definition of 'nature' to be anything confined to the material existence. Thus anything associated with spirit or different platforms of existence beyond matter is technically 'supernatural'. That is why God, angels, ghosts etc. are considered supernatural because most religions see them as associated more with spirit.

I do not know if Allah in Islam is believed to be of matter or spirit so I do not know if the term 'supernatural' can apply in Islam.

Having said that, I do not agree that 'nature' should be restricted to reference to matter only. So when I first see the question of 'what is the nature of nature'? I think, which nature? Or the nature of nature of what?

"if Allah in Islam is believed to be of matter or spirit"

Allah is attributive, He is the Creator of the spirits and matter.
Everything created by God forms nature.
Regards