What is the soul, according to the Bible?

[moorea944]

Katzpur,
One big reason that people cannot understand many concepts of the Bible, is that they do not understand what death really is. Without the proper understanding of death, truth will elude you.
I don't know about you, but I am a Bibliist, which means that I do not listen to what people say the Bible says, but what it actually says itself. I form all my beliefs according to what the Bible says!!!
Let's look up a few Scriptures that will allow us to realize what Death is according to the Bible.
Consider what God told Adam about death, Genesis 2:17, 3:19.
Then look at a description of death, Ecclesiastes 3:18-20. Here we are told that both animals and men are all made of dust and both will return to the dust. Exactly what the condition of the dead is explained to us at Ecclesiastes 9:5,6, according to these Scriptures the dead know nothing!! The same is said also, at 9:10, no work, no knowledge. Therefore a person who has died cannot do anything, for they no longer exist, Job 14:2, and a dead person does not even know thing that happen to his son, Job 14:21. The dead cannot even praise the creator, Psalms 6:4,5, 115:17.
Think about this, Satan told Eve that she would not die, as God told them that they would, Genesis 3:2-4. If you believe that a dead person can do anything, or even knows anything, are you not telling the very same lie that Satan told Eve??
In your post, you misstated what is said about Jesus, at 1Peter 3:18. Jesus did not preach to the spirits during the parts of three days that he was dead, but he was put to death in the flesh, and made alive in the spirit, and in that state, he went and preached to the spirits in prison. Another point is recorded at 2Corinthians 5:16, where we are told that Jesus disciples will not see Jesus again, in the flesh.
Remember, Jesus was made a little LOWER than Angels, when a man on earth, Hebrews 2:9. Angels are far superior to flesh and blood man, 2Peter 2:11, so when Jesus was resurrected to life again he was exalted above even angels, as a mighty spirit creature, Philippians 2:9-11.
Another point about Jesus, as a mighty spirit, flesh and blood cannot inherit The Kingdom of God, but Jesus is the King of The Kingdom, 1Corinthians 15:42-50. Jesus is now immortal, he cannot die again, Romans 6:9. Even the second death has no hold on Jesus, Revelation 2:11. The second death has no hold on Jesus ans also no hold on the Anointed, Holy Ones, Saints, that will be Co-Rulers with Jesus in heaven, Revelation 20:4-6, Romans 8:14-17, 1Corinthians 15:52-54.

........that will be Co-Rulers with Jesus in heaven,

Shouldnt that be on earth? When I read the bible, I see no "heaven going" at all. Everything will be on earth. Jesus comes back to earth and stays. Too many verses to list...

But this verse I really love... Zech 14 "And the LORD shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one LORD, and his name one."
Remember the Lord's prayer? Thy Kingdom come, thy will be done, on earth as it is done in Heaven....

So many chapters, esp in OT, that tells us what the earth will be like in the Kingdom age with Christ as our King. As yes, we will be Co-Rulers with Jesus, but it will be on earth....

 

[allright]

You are basing your statements on preconceived ideas of what you think some texts are saying, to the exclusion of other passages. The thoughts presented in the OT Bible were Aramaic and ancient Hebrew, not modern. And as the language changed, so did philosophical ideas, being corrupted by pagan influence. But one can find the original intent of those writers, by examining all the pertinent Scriptures and reasoning on them.

For one, Daniel 12:2 is referring to the Resurrection, not immortality! Indeed, Why would one need a resurrection, which means "stand back to life", if one is already living as an immortal? That is contrary!

As for Samuel: Samuel refused to see Saul anymore, after Saul was disowned by Jehovah. But after Samuel died, he could then be "forced" to see Saul? No....it was simply a demon (fallen angel) who was impostering dead Samuel.

Why do you think Jehovah God told the Israelites to abhor talking with the dead, to not do it?! (Deuteronomy 18:10-12) People who do (going to seances, spirit mediums, fortune tellers, etc.) are getting involved, not with God's power, but with Satan's. Certainly if we really could, how it would ease our mind about our dead loved ones, and God being love, wouldn't deny us that! (In examining Scripture, we should proceed in the understanding that God is love.)

But the dead are "asleep in the ground of dust." Jesus' words regarding Lazarus at John 11:11-14 emphasize the point again.

Yet the belief that the dead are 'living somewhere else (heaven or hell)' is everywhere.

All these instances earth wide, of people saying they can talk with their dead, they are being deceived and misled....the Devil tries to keep on promoting the lie he told Eve, in Genesis 3, "You positively will not die."

Yes, the Devil is "misleading the entire inhabited earth"! -- Revelation 12:9

Take care.

 

[allright]

So when Jesus told the thief on the cross today you will be with me in Paradise he meant unconscious rotting in the grave.

And when Elijah was taken up into Heaven in a chariot, the chariot drop him off dead in a grave


And when Paul said it was better for him to depart and be with the Lord he meant unconscious rotting in the grave

And when Moses and Elijah spoke to Jesus God just resurrected them from from being dead and rotting
in the grave and after they were done talking send them back unconscious to rot in their graves

Also it was Samuel who appeared to Saul.
1 The Bible says it was Samuel
2 The devil doesnt know the future or when some one is going to die
3 The last thing the devil would tell Saul or any backslider is he was to die the next day, which could drive him to repentance

 

[Hockeycowboy]

So when Jesus told the thief on the cross today you will be with me in Paradise he meant unconscious rotting in the grave.

And when Elijah was taken up into Heaven in a chariot, the chariot drop him off dead in a grave


And when Paul said it was better for him to depart and be with the Lord he meant unconscious rotting in the grave

And when Moses and Elijah spoke to Jesus God just resurrected them from from being dead and rotting
in the grave and after they were done talking send them back unconscious to rot in their graves

Also it was Samuel who appeared to Saul.
1 The Bible says it was Samuel
2 The devil doesnt know the future or when some one is going to die
3 The last thing the devil would tell Saul or any backslider is he was to die the next day, which could drive him to repentance

(My battery is going dead)
First, Jesus was in the grave for 3 days, before He was resurrected. So He told the thief, "Truly I tell you today, comma, you will be with me in paradise."

2nd, Elijah "was taken up into the sky", not the spiritual heavens! Read John 3:13. He was still living....he wrote a letter to the king, from another land. Scriptures verify it.

More later.

 

[Katzpur]

Katzpur,
One big reason that people cannot understand many concepts of the Bible, is that they do not understand what death really is. Without the proper understanding of death, truth will elude you.
I don't know about you, but I am a Bibliist, which means that I do not listen to what people say the Bible says, but what it actually says itself. I form all my beliefs according to what the Bible says!!!

Well, I personally look for truth wherever it can be found. I don't like to limit myself to just one source.

Let's look up a few Scriptures that will allow us to realize what Death is according to the Bible.
Consider what God told Adam about death, Genesis 2:17, 3:19.
Then look at a description of death, Ecclesiastes 3:18-20. Here we are told that both animals and men are all made of dust and both will return to the dust. Exactly what the condition of the dead is explained to us at Ecclesiastes 9:5,6, according to these Scriptures the dead know nothing!! The same is said also, at 9:10, no work, no knowledge. Therefore a person who has died cannot do anything, for they no longer exist, Job 14:2, and a dead person does not even know thing that happen to his son, Job 14:21. The dead cannot even praise the creator, Psalms 6:4,5, 115:17.

I disagree with this interpretation. You talk about only listening to what the Bible actually says, but no one does that. The verses you have quoted can be interpreted as you interpret them, but they can also be interpreted differently. I believe that man became a living soul when God breathed life (i.e. his spirit) into him, and that when that spirit leaves the body, the body dies. I do not believe that the spirit dies. I know you will disagree with me on that, and that's okay. You just need to understand that I am as firm in my convictions as you are in yours, and am no more likely to change my belief than you are.

Think about this, Satan told Eve that she would not die, as God told them that they would, Genesis 3:2-4. If you believe that a dead person can do anything, or even knows anything, are you not telling the very same lie that Satan told Eve??

Please don't insinuate that I am a liar. Of course I don't believe that a dead person (i.e. a dead body) can do anything.

In your post, you misstated what is said about Jesus, at 1Peter 3:18. Jesus did not preach to the spirits during the parts of three days that he was dead, but he was put to death in the flesh, and made alive in the spirit, and in that state, he went and preached to the spirits in prison.

His body was dead for the entire 3-day period, but His spirit never died. Again, you say I misstated what the Bible says, but from my perspective, it's you who did that.

Another point is recorded at 2Corinthians 5:16, where we are told that Jesus disciples will not see Jesus again, in the flesh.

Your interpretation is so different from mine that I don't even know where to begin.

Remember, Jesus was made a little LOWER than Angels, when a man on earth, Hebrews 2:9. Angels are far superior to flesh and blood man, 2Peter 2:11, so when Jesus was resurrected to life again he was exalted above even angels, as a mighty spirit creature, Philippians 2:9-11.
Another point about Jesus, as a mighty spirit, flesh and blood cannot inherit The Kingdom of God, but Jesus is the King of The Kingdom, 1Corinthians 15:42-50. Jesus is now immortal, he cannot die again, Romans 6:9. Even the second death has no hold on Jesus, Revelation 2:11. The second death has no hold on Jesus ans also no hold on the Anointed, Holy Ones, Saints, that will be Co-Rulers with Jesus in heaven, Revelation 20:4-6, Romans 8:14-17, 1Corinthians 15:52-54.

We're wasting our time here. I believe that Jesus Christ was physically resurrected -- precisely as the Bible says was the case. If you want to believe something else, that's fine with me. Just try to keep in mind that the scriptures can be interpreted in various ways. I'm not saying that all of the ways are equally accurate, because I don't believe they are. I'm just saying that when you state your belief as if it were as simple as straightforward as 1 + 1 = 2, you're being unreasonable.

 

[allright]

(My battery is going dead)
First, Jesus was in the grave for 3 days, before He was resurrected. So He told the thief, "Truly I tell you today, comma, you will be with me in paradise."

2nd, Elijah "was taken up into the sky", not the spiritual heavens! Read John 3:13. He was still living....he wrote a letter to the king, from another land. Scriptures verify it.

More later.

There was no comma in the original

Paradise and Heaven refer to two different locations . Papius wrote that Apostles taught "the garden of Eden was translated into Heaven which is were belevers go to await the resurection"

Please tell me where does scripture verify Elijah wrote this letter

So you saying God did resurrect Elijah and Moses from their graves just to speak to Jesus and then sent them back to their graves to be unconscious and decay.

As for John 3:13 Paul said he was caught up to the Third Heaven

 

[LegionOnomaMoi]

You are basing your statements on preconceived ideas of what you think some texts are saying, to the exclusion of other passages.

No, but now that you mention it this describes your approach fairly well. One issue is that you don't even employ this flawed strategy to relevant texts in general, just some selections of Greek terms you then relate to a highly selective set of Hebrew passages.

The thoughts presented in the OT Bible were Aramaic and ancient Hebrew, not modern. And as the language changed, so did philosophical ideas, being corrupted by pagan influence.

Can you read ancient Hebrew, Aramaic, or Greek? Have you ever studied the mechanisms of linguistic diachronic or synchronic change (e.g., grammaticalization or lexicon grammatical borrowings)? Or do you just use translations your religious beliefs, and some inadequate reference material like Strong's or online so-called "literal translations" and the like to interpret quote-mined passages in languages you can't read from texts situated in linguistic, sociocultural, and literary contexts you are neither familiar with nor understand?

 

[katiemygirl]

It is not immortal!

(This entire site is very enlightening, and does not endorse any denomination)

"The Greek word psyche (as in psychology) has been translated many ways, including soul, life, etc. However, psyche actually means something that breathes. It is used in the Bible to describe both breathing animals and breathing humans. So by the Bible's definition, a soul cannot leave the body, because a soul is what the living body (whether human or animal) actually is (see Genesis 2:7).

In ancient Greece, philosophers eventually added another meaning to psyche: The inner person (as opposed to the person that others see and come to know). And with time, the pagan religion of Greece started to teach that this inner person is its own entity and can never die (is immortal) (please see the Wikipedia definition, 'Soul,' for more history of the word).

Unfortunately, the pagan doctrine that humans have an immortal soul (not that they are souls), began to creep into Christian teaching around the beginning of the Second Century CE, after the deaths of Jesus' Apostles. However we can see that Jesus and his Apostles never taught such a thing, for the teaching that the soul is immortal is in direct conflict with Jesus' promise of a resurrection, because if a person is immortal (can never die), he/she can never be resurrected ('stand again').

Notice that the doctrine of the immortality of the human soul is totally without support from the Bible. For the word immortal(ity) (gr. athanasia or undying) is only mentioned in the Bible in two places, and it isn't used with or applied to the word soul in either case. Both of these scriptures show that immortality is only given by God as a reward for righteousness. And as Ezekiel18:4 says, 'The person (gr. psyche or soul) that is sinning will die (gr. apothaneitai).'

Of course, there are places in the Bible where the word soul means more than just a living, fleshly body. For example, God is recorded to have spoken of 'My Soul' in several places. Obviously, God is much more than just a 'soul' as most people think of that term, and He surely wasn't talking about His having a human body. So we must conclude that what He was referring to is His inner person.

But if this is true, then why did Jesus say what he did as found at Matthew 10:28, where we read:
'Don't fear those who can kill the body,
But can't kill the person inside (gr. psyche).
Rather, fear the One who can fully discard (gr. apolesai),
The person and the body in the garbage (gr. geenne).'



What was Jesus actually saying? In this case he appears to be using the word psyche (soul) to refer to the value of life that remains with God until the resurrection. He obviously isn't referring to the soul as being immortal in this instance, because he says that God will discard or destroy the [unrighteous] soul or person."





http://www.2001translation.com/Genesis.htm#_Soul

1. Man has a soul, a spirit and a body. He is a triune being.

I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ (1 Thessalonians 5:23).

For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any two edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow (body), and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart (Hebrews 4:12).

2. Our spirit is where the Holy Spirit makes us new. The soul is where Satan does his work. It is where our passions, desires, and feelings live.

3. Our souls are immortal.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

There was no comma in the original

Paradise and Heaven refer to two different locations . Papius wrote that Apostles taught "the garden of Eden was translated into Heaven which is were belevers go to await the resurection"

Please tell me where does scripture verify Elijah wrote this letter

So you saying God did resurrect Elijah and Moses from their graves just to speak to Jesus and then sent them back to their graves to be unconscious and decay.

As for John 3:13 Paul said he was caught up to the Third Heaven

"There was no comma in the original"

Yes. So punctuation must fit the context.

"Papius wrote that Apostles taught "the garden of Eden was translated into Heaven which is were belevers go to await the resurection" "

You mean Papias? I don't go along with any old, extra-canonical writings, especially when they contradict Scriptural context.
This Earth is our home, not heaven! God's purpose for humans (Genesis 1:28) is to be fulfilled on earth. (Psalms 115:16; Isaiah 45:18; Matthew 5:5; Matthew 6:10, "Thy will be done on Earth."; Revelation 21:3-4, "the tent of God is with mankind."; etc., etc.)
If the dead 'go somewhere', why did Jesus say at John 5:28-29, when the dead are resurrected, they come "out of the memorial tombs"?

"Please tell me where does scripture verify Elijah wrote this letter."

2 Chronicles 21:12-15...... the letter was written to King Jehoram of Judah; Elijah was given a different assignment. (There are so many who are not aware of this....) Jehoram, whom the letter was written to, came after Ahab, who lived in northern Israel.
I'm not accusing you, but some people knowingly try to use Bible events to promote a certain teaching, which the Bible doesn't support. Then others accept it as truth. But at John 3:13, Jesus said "no one" had gone to heaven, prior to Him.

"So you saying God did resurrect Elijah and Moses from their graves just to speak to Jesus and then sent them back to their graves to be unconscious and decay."

In Matthew 17, after this Transfiguration, read the context....in vs.9, Jesus told His 3 apostles: "Tell the vision to no one."
It was a vision; it wasn't real.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

No, but now that you mention it this describes your approach fairly well. One issue is that you don't even employ this flawed strategy to relevant texts in general, just some selections of Greek terms you then relate to a highly selective set of Hebrew passages.


Can you read ancient Hebrew, Aramaic, or Greek? Have you ever studied the mechanisms of linguistic diachronic or synchronic change (e.g., grammaticalization or lexicon grammatical borrowings)? Or do you just use translations your religious beliefs, and some inadequate reference material like Strong's or online so-called "literal translations" and the like to interpret quote-mined passages in languages you can't read from texts situated in linguistic, sociocultural, and literary contexts you are neither familiar with nor understand?

"relevant texts in general"......please, feel free to present some texts pertinent to the subject.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

1. Man has a soul, a spirit and a body. He is a triune being.

I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ (1 Thessalonians 5:23).

For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any two edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow (body), and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart (Hebrews 4:12).

2. Our spirit is where the Holy Spirit makes us new. The soul is where Satan does his work. It is where our passions, desires, and feelings live.

3. Our souls are immortal.

Genesis 2:7. Is man 'given' a soul, or did he 'become' one!

Ezekiel 18:4,20. The human soul dies.

Revelation 16:3. Even living fish are souls. Are they (as souls) immortal? No....they die, too.

 

[moorea944]

Genesis 2:7. Is man 'given' a soul, or did he 'become' one!

Ezekiel 18:4,20. The human soul dies.

Revelation 16:3. Even living fish are souls. Are their souls (they) immortal? No....they (their souls) die, too.

Your absolutely right. The problem with most people of the world, they dont want to hear anything about death. They want to be told that when you die, you still live on forever and ever. That is nowhere in scripture. When you die, all of your body parts die too, even your brain that makes you think and remember things. Man was never "given" a soul, he IS a "soul'. Bible says that your dead until resurrection. And that is "if" your raised. Some people wont be raised. That is why people who dont know God or who dont want to know God are like the beasts in the fields that perish. They will never see the light of day. It's funny how things creep into Christianity. Egyptians and Babylonians believed in afterlives too.

 

[allright]

"There was no comma in the original"

Yes. So punctuation must fit the context.

"Papius wrote that Apostles taught "the garden of Eden was translated into Heaven which is were belevers go to await the resurection" "

You mean Papias? I don't go along with any old, extra-canonical writings, especially when they contradict Scriptural context.
This Earth is our home, not heaven! God's purpose for humans (Genesis 1:28) is to be fulfilled on earth. (Psalms 115:16; Isaiah 45:18; Matthew 5:5; Matthew 6:10, "Thy will be done on Earth."; Revelation 21:3-4, "the tent of God is with mankind."; etc., etc.)
If the dead 'go somewhere', why did Jesus say at John 5:28-29, when the dead are resurrected, they come "out of the memorial tombs"?

"Please tell me where does scripture verify Elijah wrote this letter."

2 Chronicles 21:12-15...... the letter was written to King Jehoram of Judah; Elijah was given a different assignment. (There are so many who are not aware of this....) Jehoram, whom the letter was written to, came after Ahab, who lived in northern Israel.
I'm not accusing you, but some people knowingly try to use Bible events to promote a certain teaching, which the Bible doesn't support. Then others accept it as truth. But at John 3:13, Jesus said "no one" had gone to heaven, prior to Him.

"So you saying God did resurrect Elijah and Moses from their graves just to speak to Jesus and then sent them back to their graves to be unconscious and decay."

In Matthew 17, after this Transfiguration, read the context....in vs.9, Jesus told His 3 apostles: "Tell the vision to no one."
It was a vision; it wasn't real.

Jehoram became king in 2 Kings Chapter 1, Elijah was not taken up till chapter 2

As for Mathew 17 Jesus told them not to tell the vision till after he rose from the dead. You cut off half the verse to pervert what Jesus said to support a false teaching

And you still havent explained why Paul said it was better to depart and be with the Lord than continue his work on earth. if it was a choice of continuing his work or lie unconscious rotting away in a grave

Ans as for Paul he still went to the third heaven

 

[Hockeycowboy]

Your absolutely right. The problem with most people of the world, they dont want to hear anything about death. They want to be told that when you die, you still live on forever and ever. That is nowhere in scripture. When you die, all of your body parts die too, even your brain that makes you think and remember things. Man was never "given" a soul, he IS a "soul'. Bible says that your dead until resurrection. And that is "if" your raised. Some people wont be raised. That is why people who dont know God or who dont want to know God are like the beasts in the fields that perish. They will never see the light of day. It's funny how things creep into Christianity. Egyptians and Babylonians believed in afterlives too.

you're right, moorea944.

FYI, I edited my post at the end. It was wrong the way I worded it!

 

[Hockeycowboy]

Jehoram became king in 2 Kings Chapter 1, Elijah was not taken up till chapter 2

As for Mathew 17 Jesus told them not to tell the vision till after he rose from the dead. You cut off half the verse to pervert what Jesus said to support a false teaching

And you still havent explained why Paul said it was better to depart and be with the Lord than continue his work on earth. if it was a choice of continuing his work or lie unconscious rotting away in a grave

Ans as for Paul he still went to the third heaven

Oh goodness. This is a moot point, it has no effect on what I stated, but there were two King Jehorams in the Scriptures: one as king of Israel, and one of Judah. Jehoram of Judah was the one I was referring to.

Regarding the Transfiguration, how does reading the whole verse change what I said? It doesn't. It was still a vision.

And John 3:13 has nothing to do with Paul.

Think about this: Why have a resurrection -- bring the dead back to life -- if they're already living somewhere??!

 

[allright]

The point is that your claiming Elijah wrote the letter after he was taken up from a foreign land.
In fact he wrote it before he was taken up. Where does it say he wrote from a foreign land...

You only used half the verse to make the claim it showed the vision wasnt real.

Jesus told them to tell it after his resurrection showing the vision was real. Jesus doesnt spread false visions or practice deceit

Please explain why Paul said it was far better to depart and be with the Lord if his choice was to continue his mission on earth or lie unconscious rotting in the ground

 

[LegionOnomaMoi]

"relevant texts in general"......please, feel free to present some texts pertinent to the subject.

Was that a "no" to the ability to actually READ any of these texts in their original languages? As for relevant texts, you might start with those that represent the pagan concept of the Greek word psyche you claim was different than its use in Hebrew and Aramaic texts that didn't use the term AND whatever texts you are using to assert what the understanding of Jesus and his followers was of a Greek lexeme such that it differed from the pagan concept (which, again, we know of relevant texts)

 

[katiemygirl]

Genesis 2:7. Is man 'given' a soul, or did he 'become' one!

Ezekiel 18:4,20. The human soul dies.

Revelation 16:3. Even living fish are souls. Are they (as souls) immortal? No....they die, too.

Can we first establish the men have a spirit, a soul, and a body? I gave you Scriptures, which say such. We can discuss immortality of the soul once we establish that man is a triune being. If you disagree that he is, then please prove it with Scripture.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

The point is that your claiming Elijah wrote the letter after he was taken up from a foreign land.
In fact he wrote it before he was taken up. Where does it say he wrote from a foreign land...

The following is an excerpt from UCG.org:

"Many readers assume that Elijah at that point was made immortal and taken to the heaven where God resides. This was not the case. The sons of the prophets knew otherwise. They knew the whirlwind had simply removed Elijah to another location on earth. They exclaimed to Elisha: “Look now, there are fifty strong men with your servants. Please let them go and search for your master, lest perhaps the Spirit of the Lord has taken him up and cast him upon some mountain or into some valley” (2 Kings 2:16).

The disciples were concerned for Elijah’s safety, so they sent out a party of 50 men to search for him. The 50 searched for three days but did not find him (2 Kings 2:17).

Another passage proves conclusively that Elijah was not taken up to live in heaven. The Bible records that Elijah wrote a letter to Jehoram, the king of Judah, several years after he was removed in the whirlwind.

Notice the sequence of events recorded for us in the Bible. Elijah’s last recorded and dated act occurred during the reign of the Israelite king Ahaziah when Elijah told the king he would die for his sins (2 Kings 1:3-17). Ahaziah’s reign lasted only about a year, ca. 850 B.C.

Elijah’s removal and replacement by Elisha is then recorded in the next chapter, 2 Kings 2. The story continues with incidents from Elisha’s life, including an encounter with Jehoshaphat, king of Judah (2 Kings 3:11-14). Several years later Jehoram, son of Jehoshaphat, succeeded his father as king of Judah, ca. 845 B.C.(2 Kings 8:16).

Jehoram proved to be a wicked king, leading the nation of Judah in rebellion against God’s commandments. A few years into Jehoram’s reign, and several years after Elijah’s removal, Jehoram received a letter from Elijah warning the king of dire consequences because of his sins. This letter is recorded in 2 Chronicles 21:12-15.

This letter proves that the prophet was still alive and on earth some years after he was removed by the whirlwind and replaced by Elisha. God had chosen Elisha to succeed Elijah as His prophet, so He bodily removed Elijah to another place, where he continued to live for at least several more years—as his letter to Jehoram demonstrates.

The Bible tells us nothing more about Elijah’s life following his writing of the letter. But he eventually died, just like the other prophets and righteous men of the Old Testament, who all died in faith, not yet receiving the eternal life God had promised (Hebrews 11:39).

Again, a careful reading of the Scriptures shows that Elijah’s miraculous removal by a fiery chariot involved transporting him to another location on earth, not to eternal life in heaven."

(I certainly don't agree with everything this site says, but they got this right.)(I used it to simply prove, it's not only Jehovah's Witnesses who teach this.)

The fact that Elijah didn't die, is further shown in that Elisha did not mourn him, as was the custom when someone close, died back then. But he sure missed him.

Pauls words in Philippians 1:23 must be understood in light of 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18. Especially note the future tense used, as in "will rise first." Reminds one of Jesus' usage in John 5:28-29 and John 6:39-44, (vss.39,40,&44)

Why do you want me to explain scriptures you present, but don't explain passages that I present? Is that fair?

Again, why bring back to life (resurrect) the righteous and unrighteous dead, if they're already living somewhere else?

(See my OP, and my replies on that first page.)

So long.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

Wow, you have the answers.
I have no axe to grind, maybe a practising Jew will answer you.

Wow, you have the answers.
I have no axe to grind, maybe a practising Jew will answer you.

Hey, just wanted to say I love your picture....zebra butterflies are awesome!