What is the Ultimate Reality?

[SpiritQuest]

The simulation argument posits that we are living in some type of computer simulation...

http://www.simulation-argument.com/

We could all be computer programs running on a demon's lap-top computer.

But is the demon also a program on some other being's computer?

Where is the ultimate level or "true" reality?

 

[Terese]

Why do you assume the Ultimate Reality is a demon?

 

[निताइ dasa]

Hahaha the old "evil demon" idea by Descartes. Yes this is a very important claim. We could very well be in a simulation (or in a dream state) and there is no way we can prove otherwise because our senses (and all its information) are drawn from this world. It is possible that there is another reality that underlies this one, similar to how our current reality underlies the reality of a dream.

In Vaishnav Philosophy, this reality is true, but it is not the highest reality. All the concepts found here are not original, but rather a perverted form of the spiritual world, which is Sat Cid Ananda (eternal, conscious and blissful). The objects in this world are subject to decay by the influence of time, while in the spiritual world, they are eternal present. The objects in this world give us only finite joy, while the objects in the spiritual world give us increasing bliss. The objects in this world are not conscious, while in the spiritual world every atom is conscious. Just like the sun reflects itself in the water, this world is but a petty reflection of the spiritual world. Just like the concept of a car is found in a Mercedes, but not the other way around, this world is but a concept of the original one.

You may then ask, how can we, the conditioned beings, find information about that ultimate reality? The answer is simple; scripture. God out of His infinite Mercy has sent down scripture to guide us to that ultimate reality. Scripture (and more specifically communication by language, called sabda) is not established by a material mechanism like our other senses (like vision, hearing, feeling etc). This is because the sound carries meaning, and within that meaning the spiritual world is transmitted to us. This in the Vedas is known as sabda brahma (the sound form of God). That is why the best way to reconnect with God in this age is to always sing His holy Names, which are non-different from Him. Jaya Nitaai!

btw some of these arguements are really interesting. There is one which says that in the future it is possible to simulate another world perfectly, and we are actually in the future but in a simulation, and this life is only one simulation.

 

[George-ananda]

Where is the ultimate level or "true" reality?

Those who I believe have experienced the ultimate reality tell us that it is pure Consciousness/God/Brahman. The universe is a play/drama in which Consciousness/God/Brahman experiences finite existence. In this view we each possess a spark of God.

Maybe somehow this can be likened to a computer simulation created by Consciousness/God/Brahman, but I have not given that much thought.

 

[Geoff-Allen]

Love is the ultimate reality!

 

[निताइ dasa]

Love is the ultimate reality!

Your comment reminded me of the following quote

 

[SpiritQuest]

Thank you all for the helpful responses and food for thought. Scriptures are indeed very helpful for they contain the wisdom and experience of our ancestors. Knowledge is a collection of separate facts which could be an infinite number of different(divided) facts. Total knowledge must be the undivided wholeness and unity of the universe. I wonder though, if a person did not have any scriptures then they would need to seek the truth of reality by observing the outer world and observing the inner world.

 

[PeteC-UK]

Hi Folks...

The "ultimate reality" would be the direct experience of the Self as the SOURCE of All Creation - to know the entirety and complete history of ALL existsnce right from the start of time and to have DIRECTLY EXPERIENCED it all, every moment every place and every time without exception, AND - mind blowingly - ALL AT ONCE

I will say that this is indeed our "final destination" so to speak - but I will also say that it is simply not possible to attain this ultimate reality, here, whilst still Being a Human

 

[Aupmanyav]

We could all be computer programs running on a demon's lap-top computer. But is the demon also a program on some other being's computer? Where is the ultimate level or "true" reality?

Demons! Gods! Where? I would like to meet one. Ultimate reality is space/energy.

 

[bobhikes]

The simulation argument posits that we are living in some type of computer simulation...

http://www.simulation-argument.com/

We could all be computer programs running on a demon's lap-top computer.

But is the demon also a program on some other being's computer?

Where is the ultimate level or "true" reality?

All we have is philosophies/religions about other realities not one proven so for us this is the Ultimate reality and it would be a mistake not to treat it as such.

 

[PeteC-UK]

Hi Folks..

Bobhikes; Proven..?...What proof would satisfy..??...Step outside and become free from your body for just an instant my friend - and I assure you that viewpoint will change in that same instant...The world you experience now - is uit a thin slice of the world that is ACTUALLY available for you to experience...The body is like a FILTER that is literally removing reality from your mind even right now...lol...

There are "sounds" the human ear a re not capable of hearing - sights that human eyes are not capable of perceiving - we are severely limited ot just five gross senses and your brain and mind have adopted a specific set of circumstances to call "reality" and is right now ignoring the rest completly....So NO - not atall -this reality is NOT the ultimate reality, nothing like - pale and quite insignificant I assure you - step outside of the Self and these preconceived ideas, and you will see it is so, experience it directly and thus you will prove it to the Self...

 

[Rick O'Shez]

The world you experience now - is uit a thin slice of the world that is ACTUALLY available for you to experience...The body is like a FILTER that is literally removing reality from your mind even right now...lol...

There are "sounds" the human ear a re not capable of hearing - sights that human eyes are not capable of perceiving - we are severely limited ot just five gross senses and your brain and mind have adopted a specific set of circumstances to call "reality" and is right now ignoring the rest completly....So NO - not atall -this reality is NOT the ultimate reality, nothing like - pale and quite insignificant I assure you - step outside of the Self and these preconceived ideas, and you will see it is so, experience it directly and thus you will prove it to the Self...

I think your notion of "ultimate reality" is a meaningless abstraction, a religious belief rather than anything grounded in experience.
Obviously our senses are limited and we can only experience a fraction of what is out there. But so what?

Experiences like "stepping outside of the self" might alter perception, but the input to the senses is still the same.

 

[YmirGF]

Silly, arrogant little human animals waxing on about some meaningless Ultimate This or Absolute that. It's so special. What is so humorous is that so many actually pretend to know what they are talking about. It's like listening to the wide-eyed conjecture of 3 year old's on the reality of the Easter Bunny... and about as useful.

The simulation argument posits that we are living in some type of computer simulation...

http://www.simulation-argument.com/

<yawn>

We could all be computer programs running on a demon's lap-top computer.

The Matrix was a wonderful set of movies, wasn't it?

But is the demon also a program on some other being's computer?

How, exactly, would one ever ascertain an answer?

Where is the ultimate level or "true" reality?

There is no spoon.

 

[Willamena]

Ultimately, reality is reality.

 

[YmirGF]

Ultimately, reality is reality.

Ultimately and absolutely.

 

[Parchment]

The simulation argument posits that we are living in some type of computer simulation...
http://www.simulation-argument.com/ We could all be computer programs running on a demon's lap-top computer. But is the demon also a program on some other being's computer?
Where is the ultimate level or "true" reality?

Before the computer age it used to be "what if our entire universe were but an atom on the fingernail of a giant", it sounds like one of those things acid heads come up with when they achieve total consciousness right before they forget it all.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Silly, arrogant little human animals waxing on about some meaningless Ultimate This or Absolute that. It's so special. What is so humorous is that so many actually pretend to know what they are talking about.

Hey, it's fun to pretend and play make-believe.

It's like listening to the wide-eyed conjecture of 3 year old's on the reality of the Easter Bunny... and about as useful.

But, a lot less cute.

 

[PeteC-UK]

Hi Folks..

Rick;

Experiences like "stepping outside of the self" might alter perception, but the input to the senses is still the same.

Hmm - perhaps you misunderstood me - by stepping out of the Self - I mean stepping literally OUTSIDE of the BODY and so experiencing the Self in an entirely NEW manner altogether....Do that and see NOW we are not even relying on PHYSICAL senses at all

I could tell you for instance - I once sat here at home - had a spontaneous oobe - left my body and was quite literally dragged some 100 miles away to witness DIRECTLY, my wife and her family and events that were happening there, IN REAL TIME, like YES they ACTUALLY happened - and somehow I WITNESSED it directly WITHOUT any "physical sense organs" being used at all....Later EVERYBODY present fully confirmed my facts - word for word conversation and actions - even lies told to me to cover a certain event that I dismissed out of hand then told them what I knew as certain truth - and to this day they are all mystified as to how I REALLY knew EVERYTHING that occurred...My nepjews, younger at the time, now call me a Jedi because of such things lol

I tell you I knew it because I WAS THERE PRESENT - in "spirit" - in MIND - like a hundred physical miles seperated us - my body sat here - not even sleeping or meditating, but literally a fully spontaneous event that split me in TWO Selfs existing in TWO places...I was aware here of my physical surroundings HERE like a daydream almost, watching tv - not fully Present - but there at the other house I was MORE than Present - like I was FULLY PRESENT in my entirety - enclosed the ENTIRE room viewing every angle ALL AT ONCE and making perfect sense of it all naturally.. Hard to explain, but as said so so NATURAL in the experience...

In fact I have known my Conscious Self in MANY forms - and as no form at all - and because Iam used to and comfortable with these subtle realities, I can almost guarantee that I right now THROUGH my "physical senses" are seeing things that actually exist, can be verified, but most others are simply totally ignoring.....Things such as - auras - my "eyes" now begin to see them and have done for many years - with a little dedicated practice I could probably see them clearer, but its not important to me - I KNOW they are there, see the base layer, a thin wispy smoke like substance that emanates from all matter, especially live matter.....Similarly I see a "fine energy" CONSTANTLY in the very air itself, and despite how I try to explain this apparantly not many others see it at all.. Of course these things ARE real - the bodies DO actually give off such an aura and there is indeed all manner of "energy" buzzing through the air and indeed our very bodies themselves.....

I believe fully I CAN see some of it already - and this is not "physical sight" at all - but is indeed the THIRD EYE as they term it - KUNDALINI as many will have heard of, and the seven major energetic centres the bodies contain known as CHAKRAS are VERY REAL - mine have "opened", become activated, like a muscle they now become more efficient with use and this allows Me the perception of such subtle energies to become indeed entirely natural...

 

[1137]

Primordial chaos.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

The Void.