Gjallarhorn
N'yog-Sothep
Neither are wholly accurate, so in that sense yes.
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What lies behind thought?
- Thread starter sandandfoam
- Start date
Neither are wholly accurate, so in that sense yes.
He he
Enai de a lukal
Well-Known Member
Sure.
Interesting. I immediately went to Tolkien:
"It cannot be seen, cannot be felt
Cannot be heard, cannot be smelt
It lies behind" our thoughts yet still
our empty minds would fill
or some such thing.
apophenia
Well-Known Member
yeah, like nothing and being, prior to thought, and in which (whom ?) thought occurs
what we usually call awareness is gross in comparison
is that what you mean ?
however, that is not really what my pseudo-Shakespearian poem refers to. that was more about iron filings on a piece of paper, and the magnet under the paper. 'al nafs amara' in arabic I think ..
Your connection was, I think, semantic or conceptual while mine was more syntactical:
[pardon errors in punctuation, capitalization, morphology, etc. as like usual I am quoting from memory]
"It cannot be seen, cannot be felt
Cannot be heard, cannot be smelt
It lies behind the stars, and under hills,
And empty holes it fills
It comes first, and follows after
Ends life, kills laughter"
The Hobbit by J. R. R. Tolkien
Kilgore Trout
Misanthropic Humanist
The back of your skull.
apophenia
Well-Known Member
We always assume that thought occurs in the head, and that 'self' is in the head ( and yes, the reasons for that are obvious). I had a surprising and memorable experience once at a vipassana ten-day retreat - during one sitting session I became aware of my face and head being above 'me'. My sense of location-of-self was in the middle of my chest rather than behind my eyes. It was a simple but also awesome change of perception which happened spontaneously and has not happened since.
But 'we' is a thought or a reality. How to know?
Tumah
Veteran Member
Think about what drives our thoughts. Our Passions. I desire women, I think about women. I appreciate cars, I think about the latest models. I appreciate the sciences, I contemplate the Theory of Everything. Everything that I do begins with what I desire to do. I desire to be a fair person, a kind person, a cool person. My thoughts will be about achieving those desires.
Wants are more thought.
Tumah
Veteran Member
I think that we can change our Wants through our thoughts, but that ultimately the source is the Want. I don't think "I want to think about this woman" I just see her and automatically start thinking about her because I Want to. I can choose to say to myself, I appreciate purity more than Lust, from now on I no longer Want to think about women. But the drive is the Want.
apophenia
Well-Known Member
That is true. What I am wondering about is.. is the "I" itself a desire?
Perhaps.
But for many, somehow getting rid of "I" certainly is.
Perhaps.
But for many, somehow getting rid of "I" certainly is.
Double bind. What to do?
Tumah
Veteran Member
That is true. What I am wondering about is is that is the "I" itself a desire?
I think "I" is the vessel that contains the Wants. Two people with similar natures are not the same people. They are two vessels with similar Wants.