WHERE IS THE SCRIPTURE THAT SAYS GOD'S 4th COMMANDMENT IS ABOLISHED?

[Brian2]

Hi Brian, I do not think any one has been telling you to be circumcised to keep the laws of Moses are then? By the way Acts 15 is talking about the question is circumcision a requirement for the salvation of new gentile believers. This is the context stated verbatim in Acts 15:1-2 and this was the question Paul and Barnabas were going to Jerusalem to discuss. They were not going to Jerusalem to discuss are Gods 10 commandments still the standard of Christian living. To come up with that interpretation of the scriptures has Paul in contradiction with Paul and the rest of the bible when he states some time latter after the Jerusalem decision to the Corinthians gentile believers in 1 Corinthians 7:19 "Circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing but the keeping of the commandments of God. You might want to revisit your interpretation of the scriptures here dear friend.

Take Care.

The question soon became bigger than circumcision and the conclusion also was bigger than circumcision and was that the Gentiles should not be required to keep the law of Moses.
The Gentile Christians had to mix with Jewish Christians who were zealous for the law however and so it seems that the Noahide laws were recommended for that purpose.
Noahide laws also are not a requirement for Gentile Christians if the Law of Moses is not.

Acts 15:5 Then some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees stood up and said, “The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to keep the law of Moses.”
6 The apostles and elders met to consider this question.

You should read more of 1 Corinthians 7 and get the gist of what is being said.
So why are you saying "keeping the commandments of God" means that Gentiles should keep the Sabbath which was given as part of the Law of Moses as a sign for Israel.
Certainly someone who remains a slave when called to be a Christian will not be expected to keep the Sabbath.

 

[101G]

According to the scriptures in the very words of Jesus in Matthew 22:36-40 to love God and our fellow man (Jesus was quoting Deuteronomy 6:5 and Leviticus 19:18) is simply summing up all the law and the prophets (Matthew 22:40; Romans 13:8-10; James 2:8-12; 1 John 5:2-3; John 14:15; John 15:10). Love is expressed in obedience to Gods law not disobedience or breaking Gods law in those who have been born again to walk in Gods Spirit to love (see Galatians 5:16; Romans 8:1-4; John 3:3-7; compare 1 John 3:4-9; 1 John 2:3-4; Revelation 12:17; Revelation 14:12; Revelation 22:14). Those in Christ are not subject to the law because they have been given Gods forgiveness for their sins and are now walking in newness of life free from condemnation and death and are now walking in newness of life in obedience to Gods law (see Romans 6:1-23). According to the scriptures no one is "in Christ" is they are living a life of known unrepentant sin. Those who are living a life of known unrepentant sin according to the scriptures do not know God (see 1 John 2:3-4) and are in danger of the judgement to come (see Hebrews 10:26-31.

Take Care.

GINILJC, to all,
You take care also. food reply. God requires only three things of us which fulfills the Lasw, which is now command of us is to LOVE ONE ANOTHER.

our Requirements. Micah 6:8 "He hath shewed thee, O man, what is good; and what doth the LORD require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God?"

this is clearly brought out by God again in the NT by his apostle Paul.
Romans 2:1 "Therefore thou art inexcusable, O man, whosoever thou art that judgest: for wherein thou judgest another, thou condemnest thyself; for thou that judgest doest the same things." Romans 2:2 "But we are sure that the judgment of God is according to truth against them which commit such things." Romans 2:3 "And thinkest thou this, O man, that judgest them which do such things, and doest the same, that thou shalt escape the judgment of God?" Romans 2:4 "Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?" Romans 2:5 "But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;"Romans 2:6 "Who will render to every man according to his deeds: "Romans 2:7 "To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:" Romans 2:8 "But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath," Romans 2:9 "Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;" Romans 2:10 "But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:"

Romans 2:11 "For there is no respect of persons with God. "Romans 2:12 "For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law;" Romans 2:13 "(For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.

"Romans 2:14 "For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:" (One might want to RE-READ that verse again).
Romans 2:15 "Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)" (IS THAT NOT Micah 5:8 PLAIN AS DAY?). Romans 2:16 "In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel."

stay blessed my friend

101G

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

Well exactly.

This whole thread strikes me as an excuse to slag off most of Christianity, by someone who is part of an exclusivist sect and is seeking out reasons to exclude most of Christendom. It's pretty daft, in my opinion, and not particularly pleasant.

Yes, a very silly argument with undertones of hellfire punishment for utter inconsequentialities.

 

[Windwalker]

Your bonus question is stupid, Shabbat belongs to G-d, man honors it (and G-d) or not.

My "stupid question" is actually referring to the answer to that very question given by Jesus himself. "The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath.” ~Mark 2:27

So, Jesus resoundly disagrees with you. The Sabbath was made for man, not the other way around. That's like saying "Man was made for the weekend off", rather than recognizing the obvious, that the "weekend off" was made for man.

Are you sure that was a stupid question?

 

[Kenny]

Not according to the scriptures. Love is not separate from obedience to Gods law it is expressed through obedience from the heart. Goodness why post Galatians 3? Who is telling you that you are saved by the law? If I have never said to you Kenny that you are saved by the law why pretend that is what I am saying to you?

I posted Gal 3 because grace is by faith and not by works. of course I understand that grace doesn't give us a license to sin. And of course faith has works.. But you give it a hue of "work at fulfilling the law" when it is fulfilled in Jesus.

As i read your post, although I know your heart is right, you give a hue of "work the law" - which ultimately leads us into the law of condemnation of sin and death.

And, as I noted, there is no "8th day" for God because the rest that we find is that God has made every day a Sabbath for the believer, although you can certainly esteem a day above the rest as long as it is in faith as I noted in Hebrews and you affirmed.

No more spiritual adultery of going back to the Law as the roadmap for righteousness.

Ultimately, it is faith that pleases God and without it, you can't. Works of faith is good, of course.

 

[Windwalker]

Hi WW nice to meet you. In answer to your question?

No we are in the new covenant now ...

...are now fulfilled and continued in Christ and the promised Messiah to who they all pointed to.

...They were the shadows of things to come....

Then why do you exclude the observation of the Sabbath as itself not a "shadow of things to come", which itself was fulfilled in Christ as "our rest"?

You missed my bonus question I asked, about "was man made for the sabbath, or was the sabbath made for man". It's an important question, because it puts things into perspective regarding the actual religious importance and significance of these rituals and rules.

Jesus himself takes a different approach to these external religious observances, not as being about God, but about being for our benefit only, "The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. So the Son of Man is Lord even of the Sabbath.” Mk, 2:27,28

They are as you rightly quoted, "shadows of things to come". It is not the circumcision of the flesh that matters, but the circumcision of the heart, says Paul. It is not the day of rest with the flesh that in the weightier matter, but the rest that is found in our hearts that matters.

To make it about the external observance, is to miss the point of the 'fulfilment of these things in Christ,' as you quoted from in Hebrews. To underscore this, I'll quote from Paul in Galatians,

Again I declare to every man who lets himself be circumcised that he is obligated to obey the whole law. You who are trying to be justified by the law have been alienated from Christ; you have fallen away from grace.

Galatians 5:3,4
​

For you to say, "but the Sabbath must still be observed as ordered by Moses," is doing exactly the same thing as those who were telling the Christians they must be circumcised, as also ordered by Moses.

You, as they, were picking and choosing select "laws" as still in effect, and missing the overall point that Paul was talking about. It is not through observing these external laws that you are justified, but by fulfilling what they are pointing to, what they are "shadows of", as he worded it, which is in the heart.

He rightly then tells his readers, exactly what Jesus taught, "For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.”. (Gal. 5:14) It is not fulfilled in "only worshipping on Saturday instead of Sunday".

It is not in the "right day of the week" that the law is fulfilled. It is fulfilled in Love, through Grace alone. It is in the heart, not in the flesh where one observes the Rest, which the sabbath day in the law foreshadowed.

This is the core of Jesus', as well as Paul's teachings.

The question we should be asking ourselves is who do we believe and follow; God or man?

I agree with Jesus in what he taught about how the entire law is fulfilled in Love, not in the observing of days, as is taught by religious men seeking to justify themselves by religious practices.

 

[Kenny]

There is no such thing as an eternal 8th day. It is not biblical.

And there is no "8th day" for God (as you intimated). He is eternal, of course. He is our rest. Man wasn't made for the Sabbath but the Sabbath for the man. And Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath... we were made for Him!

All in faith.

However, I do support your position to hold the Sabbath by faith as you are thoroughly convinced. (Romans 14)

But don't judge people on the Sabbath or Holy Days - Col 2.

 

[lukethethird]

Strange. Do apes have morals?

Observe them and find out. Besides, we are apes.

 

[lostwanderingsoul]

Not at all. They think God continues, actively, to guide his church, that's all, and that it was not all laid down clearly in a manual, for all time, 2000 years ago.

But God says He never changes. Oh that's right, you do not always follow scripture. Make your own rules.

 

[Apostle John]

Observe them and find out. Besides, we are apes.

You might want to be. I am not.

 

[lukethethird]

You might want to be. I am not.

What species do you belong to?

 

[Soapy]

Observe them and find out. Besides, we are apes.

It is not the flesh being that determines who (or what) is ‘Image of God’. It is the spirit of the being that is the determiner.

Every spirit in a man is from God. Every spirit in all other living entity is a replication from its species model. That is why all plants and creatures (Flora and Forna) change behaviour in only very slow and minor ways according to environmental factors - but mankind changes according to desire - self-Willed desire.

(There is a theory that there was a kind of ‘ape-like’ creature that existed as an end of line creation of the animals. In this creature God awakened it’s ‘spiritual awareness’ which gave it the knowledge of God and a higher sense of self - including the development of a fuller language structure which meant greater scope over all the other animals. With this idea, the ‘awakening of Adam’ as ‘Image of God’ is fashioned in the story in that the body of Adam was a ‘Spiritually lifeless Being’ and God blew the spirit of Godliness into the mindfulness of Adam so he became a Spiritually LIVING SOUL. This would then account for the thousands of years unaccounted for by scientists but are unspoken of in the scriptures since if the Bible is followed from the outlined generation to generation of humanity there is a huge deficiency of the ages)

 

[icehorse]

The Ten Commandments were introduced by God to show the sin nature in man, make up part of the law in Judaism and are clearly where morals originate from. Christians are under grace and so don’t have to follow the Jewish law rigidly but Christians should respect the Ten Commandments.

Yes, but what do YOU think?

 

[Subduction Zone]

It is not the flesh being that determines who (or what) is ‘Image of God’. It is the spirit of the being that is the determiner.

Every spirit in a man is from God. Every spirit in all other living entity is a replication from its species model. That is why all plants and creatures (Flora and Forna) change behaviour in only very slow and minor ways according to environmental factors - but mankind changes according to desire - self-Willed desire.

(There is a theory that there was a kind of ‘ape-like’ creature that existed as an end of line creation of the animals. In this creature God awakened it’s ‘spiritual awareness’ which gave it the knowledge of God and a higher sense of self - including the development of a fuller language structure which meant greater scope over all the other animals. With this idea, the ‘awakening of Adam’ as ‘Image of God’ is fashioned in the story in that the body of Adam was a ‘Spiritually lifeless Being’ and God blew the spirit of Godliness into the mindfulness of Adam so he became a Spiritually LIVING SOUL. This would then account for the thousands of years unaccounted for by scientists but are unspoken of in the scriptures since if the Bible is followed from the outlined generation to generation of humanity there is a huge deficiency of the ages)

You sound a bit more reasonable than most creationists. Unfortunately your terminology is incorrect. What you describe is not a theory. It does not even appear to be a hypothesis. What reasonable test based upon predictions of your model could possibly refute it? If you cannot answer that question then you only have a WAG. That is a Wild Assed
Guess.

 

[Apostle John]

What species do you belong to?

Man

 

[Apostle John]

Yes, but what do YOU think?

I think like a Christian and know enough of the Bible.

 

[lukethethird]

Man

What is the difference between the dna of man and that of ape?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Man

Then you are an ape.

 

[Apostle John]

What is the difference between the dna of man and that of ape?

There is a difference. Consciousness doesn’t come from atoms. Where’s your evidence?

 

[Windwalker]

Man

The correct answer is homosapien. Or "human" to use the common term. However, you should know that humans are a primate species.

Humans (Homo sapiens) are the most abundant and widespread species of primate. They are a type of great ape that is characterized by bipedalism and exceptional cognitive skills due to a large and complex brain.

Human - Wikipedia
​

God created humans from the primate family as a type of a great ape, that is "characterized by bipedalism and exceptional cognitive skills". There are no valid religious reasons for you to deny science.