Which "fouding fathers" were undeniably deists?

[tomspug]

There is many a generalization made that the majority of the "founding fathers" were deists. The only one I've ever heard of was Thomas Jefferson, who himself is questionably so. Exactly which founding fathers were undoubtedly deists and not theists.

No question, if during the time period, one were a deist, he would be privately so. But it seems strange to me that men who consider human rights to be "God-endowed" would make for a strange deist. It seems to me that any appeal to God, in any form, admits a belief in a personal God, not an impersonal one.

Regardless of the existence of certain deists, the cause of the American Revolution used theism as one of its primary justifications through the concept of God-endowed, inalienable rights.

 

[Charity]

George Washington
Ben Franklin

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Tom Paine was definitely a deist, but would you consider him a "Founding Father"?

 

[whereismynotecard]

I don't know what deist means.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

tomspug,

In the case of the deists, human rights had to be discovered by using Reason to examine Nature, which was ultimately created by a deist God. But it was only by observing Nature and using reason that those of the Enlightenment came to their conclusions about human rights, the "natural state" of Man as free, the social contract, etc.

Your question is which founders were "undeniably deist". I think Jefferson, Franklin, Adams, Washington, and Madison were undeniably non-theist, insofar as they rejected miraculous disruption of Natural Laws, and rejected Divine intervention or interest in human affairs.

 

[kiwimac]

Tom Jefferson was definitely Deist as was Franklin.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I don't know what deist means.

A deist is someone who believes in God, and usually that God created the universe, but doesn't believe that God takes an active role in what happens in that universe, so no miracles, no Garden of Eden, no angels, no Son of God coming down from Heaven to atone for the sins of humanity, and usually no final judgement, Second Coming, Heaven or Hell.

 

[tomspug]

Tom Paine was definitely a deist, but would you consider him a "Founding Father"?

Thomas Paine was a founding father, most definitely.

I'm REALLY enjoying watching the HBO series John Adams. I highly recommend it to... um... everyone. It's awesome!

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Thomas Paine was a founding father, most definitely.

Okay. He was definitely a deist, and definitely not private about it... though he spent much of his life as a public deist in France. If you haven't checked out Age of Reason, his treatise on deism, I think it's worth a read.

I'm REALLY enjoying watching the HBO series John Adams. I highly recommend it to... um... everyone. It's awesome!

I'll have to check it out once one of the Canadian cable channels picks it up.

 

[Wandered Off]

In addition to Franklin, Jefferson, and Payne, one who was public about it was Ethan Allen.

 

[tomspug]

I'll have to check it out once one of the Canadian cable channels picks it up.

It's on DVD now, actually.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I go as far as to say most of them where. Not all of them, but alot of them where, especially the more influential ones.
My reason behind this being is that Thomas Paine, who was without question a deist, fueled the Revolutionary War, and wrote material that was a major influence in the writing of the Constitution. So if Paine was so widely agreed upon, I would say most of the Founding Fathers at least held some Deist believes.

 

[Arlanbb]

SO how many "founding Fathers" was there? arlan

 

[Shadow Wolf]

SO how many "founding Fathers" was there? arlan

Probably more than we know of. I'm sure there at least a few that history, for whatever reason, did not record. The only number I found, which was from a chart that was not correct, said 204. I also found one site that claimed just 7.

 

[doppelganger]

I would add James Madison to the list:

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]"What influence, in fact, have ecclesiastical establishments had on society? In some instances they have been seen to erect a spiritual tyranny on the ruins of the civil authority; on many instances they have been seen upholding the thrones of political tyranny; in no instance have they been the guardians of the liberties of the people. Rulers who wish to subvert the public liberty may have found an established clergy convenient auxiliaries. A just government, instituted to secure and perpetuate it, needs them not."[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif] - "A Memorial and Remonstrance", 1785[/FONT]

 

[doppelganger]

By the way, here's a fascinating exchange between Paine and Samuel Adams about Deism. Notice that Paine points out Jefferson is being accused of being a "liberal." The more things change, the more they stay the same.

Correspondence between Tom Paine and Sam Adams regarding religion

 

[tomspug]

Ironically, the Anti-Federalists often referred to themselves as "republicans".

I'm not sure if that quote qualifies James Madison as a "deist", but it does show that he was openly critical of many forms of organized religion. Sounds a lot like myself, honestly.

 

[doppelganger]

I'm not sure if that quote qualifies James Madison as a "deist", but it does show that he was openly critical of many forms of organized religion. Sounds a lot like myself, honestly.

To clarify, I didn't say that it did. I just like that particular quote.