Which prophecies did Jesus fulfill as to be the Messiah?

[FranklinMichaelV.3]

Lol most women don't realize they are pregnant until what 1 to 2 months in? Most women start showing by 4 months.

So Joseph found out she was pregnant (1 to 2 months in), then married her, and no one commented on the point that 8-7 months later she gave birth to a child when the normal gestation period is 9?

 

[Me Myself]

Hello dantech,

What I actually said was .....


This genealogy from both of Jesus' parents was proved that he was indeed a "son of David". Which was part of the credentials needed to prove his claim to be Messiah. It had little to do with inheritance.

The prophesy in Isaiah 9:6, 7 (CJB) says....
" For a child is born to us,
a son is given to us;
dominion will rest on his shoulders,
and he will be given the name
Pele-Yo‘etz El Gibbor
Avi-‘Ad Sar-Shalom
[Wonder of a Counselor, Mighty God,
Father of Eternity, Prince of Peace],
6 (7) in order to extend the dominion
and perpetuate the peace
of the throne and kingdom of David,
to secure it and sustain it
through justice and righteousness
henceforth and forever.
The zeal of Adonai-Tzva’ot
will accomplish this."


It was the opinion of those who knew the family that Joseph was Jesus' legal father as well as his siblings, but he was the firstborn of the family.

"Adonai has sworn it,
and he will never retract —
“You are a cohen (priest) forever,
to be compared with Malki-Tzedek.” (Psalm 110:4 CJB)

Since the Messiah was prophesied to be both a king and a priest, according to the manner of "Malki-Tzedek", (Mel·chiz′e·dek, a king/priest whose genealogy is not revealed) both the prophesy in Isaiah and Psalm 110 indicate that it was only by God's declaration that this was so. The kingly tribe and the priestly tribe were separate. Messiah was to be a "son of David" (kingly tribe) as his genealogy proved but he was also to be a priest.

The messiah wasnt meant to be the "son" he wasean to be FROM THE SEED of david.

The seed.

This doesnt work if he is adopted

 

[JayJayDee]

The messiah wasnt meant to be the "son" he wasean to be FROM THE SEED of david.

The seed.

This doesnt work if he is adopted

Well, I think that the Bible disagrees with you.

Shortly before Passover 33 C.E. when Jesus was entering Jerusalem riding a colt, the crowd welcomed him and some cried out: “Save, we pray, the Son of David!” (Matthew 21:9) Why did they cry out that way? They had come to recognize that Jesus was the promised Messiah and that God would give him an everlasting Kingdom, “the throne of David his father.” The "son" of someone was not necessarily the next generation but in that one's family line.

The people longed for the salvation, peace, and justice that the Kingdom would bring. (Luke 1:32; Zechariah 9:9)

Since both his parents were descended from King David, he had a legal right to be called a son of David. He was also of the seed of Abraham.

 

[outhouse]

Well, I think that the Bible disagrees with you.

Shortly before Passover 33 C.E. when Jesus was entering Jerusalem riding a colt, the crowd welcomed him and some cried out: “Save, we pray, the Son of David!” (Matthew 21:9) Why did they cry out that way? They had come to recognize that Jesus was the promised Messiah and that God would give him an everlasting Kingdom, “the throne of David his father.” The "son" of someone was not necessarily the next generation but in that one's family line.

The people longed for the salvation, peace, and justice that the Kingdom would bring. (Luke 1:32; Zechariah 9:9)

Since both his parents were descended from King David, he had a legal right to be called a son of David. He was also of the seed of Abraham.

Yet there is no historicity to his lineage at all, according to most scholars.

I don't think Jews even knew who Davids lineage even was. David barely has any historicity but I do think he existed, but not as stated.

 

[Pegg]

I didn't say they are never mentioned. I asked for genealogies that go by the woman (not the man), in reference to inheritance.

In the cases you showed, the genealogy is still by the father, but mentions who the mother is. "The three were born to HIM from..."
Also, this has nothing to do with inheritance.

Job 42:15*And no women were found as pretty as Job’s daughters in all the land, and their father proceeded to give them an inheritance in among their brothers.




Joshua 15:16*And Ca′leb proceeded to say: “Whoever strikes Kir′i·ath-se′pher and does capture it, I shall certainly give him Ach′sah my daughter as a wife.” 17*At that Oth′ni·el the son of Ke′naz, Ca′leb’s brother, captured it. Accordingly he gave him Ach′sah his daughter as a wife. 18*And it came about that when she was going home, she kept inciting him to ask a field from her father. Then she clapped her hands while upon the ***. At this Ca′leb said to her: “What do you want?” 19*So she said: “Do give me a blessing, for it is a piece of land to the south you have given me, and you must give me Gul′loth-ma′im.” Accordingly he gave her Upper Gul′loth and Lower Gul′loth.


in these accounts, daughters also received an inheritance. Just because they were not all mentioned in the genealogies doesnt mean they were without an inheritance because this account shows that the daughters of Israel obviously did receive land as inheritance.

 

[renaud.kingsland]

as far as I´m aware he did not fulfill any

Agreed. Xtians tend to shoehorn or in many cases even intentionally mistranslate/misinterpret the Torah to make verses seem to fit Jesus.

However we know very little about the actual Jesus, and even if he existed. So it's probably safe to say that someone who may or may not have existed probably wasn't the messiah

 

[FranklinMichaelV.3]

Job 42:15*And no women were found as pretty as Job’s daughters in all the land, and their father proceeded to give them an inheritance in among their brothers.




Joshua 15:16*And Ca′leb proceeded to say: “Whoever strikes Kir′i·ath-se′pher and does capture it, I shall certainly give him Ach′sah my daughter as a wife.” 17*At that Oth′ni·el the son of Ke′naz, Ca′leb’s brother, captured it. Accordingly he gave him Ach′sah his daughter as a wife. 18*And it came about that when she was going home, she kept inciting him to ask a field from her father. Then she clapped her hands while upon the ***. At this Ca′leb said to her: “What do you want?” 19*So she said: “Do give me a blessing, for it is a piece of land to the south you have given me, and you must give me Gul′loth-ma′im.” Accordingly he gave her Upper Gul′loth and Lower Gul′loth.


in these accounts, daughters also received an inheritance. Just because they were not all mentioned in the genealogies doesnt mean they were without an inheritance because this account shows that the daughters of Israel obviously did receive land as inheritance.

These were outside of the norm (mind you Job is not an actual historical story as far as we know especially given its written format).

But I don't think the inheritance that Dantech is talking about is the inheritance of things like land.

 

[dantech]

Job 42:15*And no women were found as pretty as Job’s daughters in all the land, and their father proceeded to give them an inheritance in among their brothers.




Joshua 15:16*And Ca′leb proceeded to say: “Whoever strikes Kir′i·ath-se′pher and does capture it, I shall certainly give him Ach′sah my daughter as a wife.” 17*At that Oth′ni·el the son of Ke′naz, Ca′leb’s brother, captured it. Accordingly he gave him Ach′sah his daughter as a wife. 18*And it came about that when she was going home, she kept inciting him to ask a field from her father. Then she clapped her hands while upon the ***. At this Ca′leb said to her: “What do you want?” 19*So she said: “Do give me a blessing, for it is a piece of land to the south you have given me, and you must give me Gul′loth-ma′im.” Accordingly he gave her Upper Gul′loth and Lower Gul′loth.


in these accounts, daughters also received an inheritance. Just because they were not all mentioned in the genealogies doesnt mean they were without an inheritance because this account shows that the daughters of Israel obviously did receive land as inheritance.

again, you don't understand what I'm saying. Daughters can receive inheritance. But they can't give one. You inherit from your father. Which was the case with job

 

[Hawkins]

And did he leave any unfulfilled?

The question is rather how biblical and legitimate those Jewish prophecies are.

Anyone can claim to be a Messiah, however he must demonstrate (at least theologically) that he actually can save!

The Messiah in Christianity can save up to 1/3 humans through the said Covenant brought in by Him.

Who else, in the history of humanity, is capable of making such a claim and actually realized it ?!


Who can do this,

Step 1: You claim to be a Messiah.
Step 2: You bring in a theology saying that "I here on bring in a Covenant which those who believe in me will be saved. I am here to save as a Messiah.
Step 3: And as a result, up to 1/3 humans believed (that is, up to 1/3 humans are potentially and theologically saved by you).

Who in the history of humanity can ever do that ?!

 

[dantech]

The question is rather how biblical and legitimate those Jewish prophecies are.

Anyone can claim to be a Messiah, however he must demonstrate (at least theologically) that he actually can save!

The Messiah in Christianity can save up to 1/3 humans through the said Covenant brought in by Him.

Who else, in the history of humanity, is capable of making such a claim and actually realized it ?!


Who can do this,

Step 1: You claim to be a Messiah.
Step 2: You bring in a theology saying that "I here on bring in a Covenant which those who believe in me will be saved. I am here to save as a Messiah.
Step 3: And as a result, up to 1/3 humans believed (that is, up to 1/3 humans are potentially and theologically saved by you).

Who in the history of humanity can ever do that ?!

What's your point. That he was a convincing person? Hitler was also a very convincing person. (I'm not comparing them, I'm nearly pointing out the flaw in what you said.

 

[RabbiO]

Anyone can claim to be a Messiah, however he must demonstrate (at least theologically) that he actually can save!

That is not a characteristic ascribed to the messiah within Judaism.

Peter

 

[Avi1001]

That is not a characteristic ascribed to the messiah within Judaism.

Peter

Perhaps redemption is a better word to use, and with respect to Israel. Also, it probably makes more sense to think of a messianic era rather than a personal messiah. What do you think Rabbio ?

 

[Hawkins]

That is not a characteristic ascribed to the messiah within Judaism.

Peter

No one says it is. I am just trying to open people to the possibility. Moreover, Judaism as it is in your mouth is not necessarily the same as what is said in the Scripture (OT).

 

[Akivah]

No one says it is. I am just trying to open people to the possibility. Moreover, Judaism as it is in your mouth is not necessarily the same as what is said in the Scripture (OT).

Ducky....another Christian who says if a Jew doesn't agree with my Christian beliefs, then the Judaism that they believe in isn't the REAL Judaism.

 

[Hawkins]

Ducky....another Christian who says if a Jew doesn't agree with my Christian beliefs, then the Judaism that they believe in isn't the REAL Judaism.

Another guy saying that whatever the self claimed Jews said must true and totally biblical unquestionably.

 

[metis]

Another guy saying that whatever the self claimed Jews said must true and totally biblical unquestionably.

BTW, RabbiO is a rabbi, and why do you say "self claimed Jews". Also, who said we couldn't be questioned on biblical matters?

Let me recommend you actually study up on Judaism because on this thread and another, you've really made some terribly erroneous statements. Rabbi Kushner's "To Life" is a to-the-point and well-written book on the basics of our faith.

 

[Shermana]

Ducky....another Christian who says if a Jew doesn't agree with my Christian beliefs, then the Judaism that they believe in isn't the REAL Judaism.

What makes you think that current Rabbinical Judaism is the "REAL" Judaism that was practiced in the pre-exile days? What makes you think the Rabbis haven't twisted it all out of proportion with all kinds of laws that they weren't supposed to "add" or "subtract" from and that what they teach is exactly what Moses taught?

Though I most certainly agree that saying Jews are only "Self claimed Jews" is...wrong. The religious traditions might not be the same as back then, but the biological descendence definitely is.

 

[Hawkins]

BTW, RabbiO is a rabbi, and why do you say "self claimed Jews". Also, who said we couldn't be questioned on biblical matters?

Let me recommend you actually study up on Judaism because on this thread and another, you've really made some terribly erroneous statements. Rabbi Kushner's "To Life" is a to-the-point and well-written book on the basics of our faith.

You are clueless again ?

Self claim Jews means they believe by faith that they are under the Old covenant which Mosaic Law will be used for the judgment.

So is it true that you, as a Jew, still under the old covenant ?

If you failed to abide by Mosaic Law, you make not much difference from a Gentile. We believe that , not all Jews will be considered as Jews by God.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Another guy saying that whatever the self claimed Jews said must true and totally biblical unquestionably.

So you don't think that they're "real Jews"? What do you mean by that, exactly?

 

[Hawkins]

So you don't think that they're "real Jews"? What do you mean by that, exactly?

So you think God does treat them as Jews and under the Mosaic Law ? What supports your this faith?

As far as I recall, in the book of revelation. It is said that certain Jews may not be the Jews at all in God's eye.