Who feel entitled?

[Shadow Wolf]

Very typically, when someone is accusing another of feeling entitled, those being accused are either black or poor. This is very common, and very commonly believed that these two groups have an over inflated sense of entitlement. And while it can't be said that no one in these groups has such an over inflated sense of entitlement, I've noticed no one really bothers to look beyond this.
But what do you find when you look beyond this? It seems that being rich causes a sense of over entitlement. And not just one study, but five of them are cited in this study. (It also seems to come with larger doses of narcissism, but that isn't what's being discussed)

Five studies demonstrated that higher social class is associated with increased entitlement and narcissism. Upper-class individuals reported greater psychological entitlement (Studies 1a, 1b, and 2) and narcissistic personality tendencies (Study 2), and they were more likely to behave in a narcissistic fashion by opting to look at themselves in a mirror (Study 3)

So, why is it that poor people are "entitled" for wanting to eat, go to school, and get medical attention, while nobody points the finger at the wealthy, a group that science is suggesting feel they should have things handed to them at rates higher than other groups?

 

[Revoltingest]

Very typically, when someone is accusing another of feeling entitled, those being accused are either black or poor. This is very common, and very commonly believed that these two groups have an over inflated sense of entitlement. And while it can't be said that no one in these groups has such an over inflated sense of entitlement, I've noticed no one really bothers to look beyond this.
But what do you find when you look beyond this? It seems that being rich causes a sense of over entitlement. And not just one study, but five of them are cited in this study. (It also seems to come with larger doses of narcissism, but that isn't what's being discussed)

Five studies demonstrated that higher social class is associated with increased entitlement and narcissism. Upper-class individuals reported greater psychological entitlement (Studies 1a, 1b, and 2) and narcissistic personality tendencies (Study 2), and they were more likely to behave in a narcissistic fashion by opting to look at themselves in a mirror (Study 3)

So, why is it that poor people are "entitled" for wanting to eat, go to school, and get medical attention, while nobody points the finger at the wealthy, a group that science is suggesting feel they should have things handed to them at rates higher than other groups?

When one is a well-to-do aged white male, the accusation of "privilege" appears more often directed at us than at poor or black folk.
Perhaps it only seems as it does to you because the latter groups aren't used to thinking themselves as privileged.
But they are too.
A sword which cuts both ways can surprise the unprepared.

 

[jeager106]

en·ti·tled
/inˈtīdld/
adjective

1. believing oneself to be inherently deserving of privileges or special treatment.

That is entitlement. Believing that because one is part of a group, such as a minority
of the population, one is entitled to be given a living including given more
for having a large family while giving nothing back to the society that gives the
entitlement.
When you speak of rich, well to do people you speak of privilege. Those born with
wealth or those that earned wealth.
There is nothing what so ever wrong with GIVING the needy a warm home,
food to eat, clothes to wear.
Nothing wrong with welfare at all, nothing wrong with food stamps.
What is wrong is the notion that free living becomes a multi-generational way of life.
This kind of multi-generational life style kills the desire to work for a living, kills the desire to
excel in education.
There is dignity in work you see. There is pride in getting good grades and getting an education.
Living off the dole ruins self worth, self pride, kills the desire to do anything but
collect a check from the mailbox.
Entitlements make up the majority of the Federal budget.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

So, why is it that poor people are "entitled" for wanting to eat, go to school, and get medical attention, while nobody points the finger at the wealthy, a group that science is suggesting feel they should have things handed to them at rates higher than other groups?

Okay, I've invested some time to read the studies in their entirety, so this might be a little long-winded. I apologise. Hopefully some of is general interest.

In reading the studies, it's interesting. Whilst the headline of them, and the hypothesis being tested is around entitlement, much of the testing is focused on narcissistic behaviours. Whilst I understand the reason for the parallel, I think it can lead to a slight disconnect in a general discussion, since I always work under the assumption that some involved will only read the abstract (if that).

If asked whether the wealthy are more narcissistic, or have a general belief that they are wealthy due to being 'superior' than the rank and file, I would assume many (or most) wouldn't find it a particularly controversial statement. But I don't think that quite equate to them thinking things should be handed to them at a rate higher than other groups. You can, of course, argue that with the way the systems are built, that is exactly what happens, but I think how they themselves view the system is an important facet of the discussion.

A narcissistic personality will attribute their success to their own worth and value. They were successful because they were better (in their own minds). This would seem to me to be the exact antithesis of the issue surrounding welfare payments (as an example) and the issue of dependency that is commonly raised. If we are raising a welfare generation (as a hypothetical) I think it's fair to say that the problem is not one of narcissism amongst the recipients, but instead of dependence, and associated lack of motivation. Simplistically, the argument from the wealthy, narcissistic few is that the less wealthy simply need to take control of their own situation more (ie. become more narcissistic).

For me, I possibly have an unusual/biased view. Based on how groupings for the 5 studies were determined, I would sometimes be in the privileged control group (based on income, for example) and sometimes not (based on parents education levels, for example). I tend to think in terms of social mobility. That is, remove the barriers for the 'poor' to improve their social class.

For me, that would mean investing heavily in things like state education and health, less so other government supports (very broadly speaking). I would also say that the wage discrepancy in the USA between the wealthy and the working class (as opposed to the non-working class) is a massive problem, and will destroy social cohesion (is already?)...

That's my initial take on reading this, anyway.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Well, apparently nobody so far has really caught on that while everyone blames black people and those of us who weren't born with a silver spoon in hand (my "crib" was a dresser drawer: what about yours?) Until my dad was hired at Chrylser (those evil union ********), even McDonald's was a treat), aren't so much into that "entitlement" thing as people like to make us seem, but rather, according to scientific study, it has having a bunch of money that seems to inflate the sense of entitlement more than anything. There is even an interesting study that involved people playing Monopoly, in which one player had the game heavily stacked in their favor, and these players, when asked about their own success in the game, tended to blame the other player for mistakes rather than the fact they had the game heavily stacked in their favor. It was even noticed that they had a tendency to taunt the other player and even smack their token on the board in way to make it very audible as they advanced along the board.
I didn't mention "privilege." (I've been able to stuff my pockets full of stuff while on crutches at a gas station without any body questioning or second guessing if I put everything on the counter)
I didn't mention multi-generations of people being one welfare. (many studies have shown if you are in poverty, the chances are very good that your kids will be born in poverty, and their kids will also be born and die in poverty)
I even specifically stated this isn't about narcissism but specifically about feeling entitled. Entitlement that seems to come from those who have been handed everything.
No. I mentioned that people love to point at black people and poor people, claim and insist (even get foamy at the mouth at times) that we are "entitled" because we feel we deserve a chance at things like education, that we shouldn't have to suffer through medical ailments that are treatable, and that we shouldn't starve and should have more options than cheap and highly processed junk food to feed ourselves ("food deserts" seems to be the term), but that makes us these god awful "entitled" people, but when science gets involved, those who really seemed entitled are those who already have it all. That is what this discussion is about. It isn't hatred of the wealthy (I know people who are probably more wealthy than anyone on this forum, and their charity has helped my family, on a number of occasions, to have anything to unwrap on Christmas), but that no one seems to even notice that those who have a lot tend to also expect a lot. To me, this was very noticeable in school, where the rich kids expected
things to be given to them, while those of us who didn't have a lot realized you have to work for things. But when you ask for food, for medical care, or education, we are suddenly the ones who are "entitled."

 

[Penumbra]

Entitlements make up the majority of the Federal budget.

Yes, but not in the way you're referring to.

They're called entitlements, originally, because they're based on people getting back roughly what they put in, with a smaller chunk going to those in great need.

Entitlements are a majority of the federal budget because people pay into them and get the money back. Every paycheck has social security tax and medicare tax removed from it, and then people that live to retirement age are entitled to social security benefits and medicare coverage because they paid into it for the duration of their working years. It's their money being returned back to them. Entitled to their own money, in other words.

A smaller chunk of federal entitlement spending (about a third) goes to people with disabilities and other people that didn't necessarily pay into the system.

 

[psychoslice]

Well in my observations I see it the other way around, I see those who are so called poor saying that they should be entitled to whatever they want, most are in that situation because of themselves, while those who are better of are hard working people, even the so called rich, they are the one's who own the big business that employ people and give them what they need to survive. The aboriginals in my country of Australia were once treated bad, but time has changed, and now they get more benefits than the so called white people, so the poorer whites get less than the poorer aboriginals.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Well in my observations I see it the other way around, I see those who are so called poor saying that they should be entitled to whatever they want, most are in that situation because of themselves, while those who are better of are hard working people, even the so called rich, they are the one's who own the big business that employ people and give them what they need to survive. The aboriginals in my country of Australia were once treated bad, but time has changed, and now they get more benefits than the so called white people, so the poorer whites get less than the poorer aboriginals.

Dude, until fairly recently, the Aboriginal of Australia were legally defined as fauna. That's right. Human beings legally defined as being on par with the dingo, koala, and kangaroo. Their ancestral grounds were taken to make golf courses, and certain rights of passages and other culturally important events they have not been able to carry out for decades.

 

[psychoslice]

Dude, until fairly recently, the Aboriginal of Australia were legally defined as fauna. That's right. Human beings legally defined as being on par with the dingo, koala, and kangaroo. Their ancestral grounds were taken to make golf courses, and certain rights of passages and other culturally important events they have not been able to carry out for decades.

That was over two hundred years ago, and their still carrying on about it, the thing is they get more than the average white poor person, there is everything given to them so they can help themselves, but most don't, they just drink and keep telling us all that it was our fault, that to me is insulting, no white person had anything to do with what happened, a colour should not be made to feel guilty. I know what I am talking about, I have many Aboriginal friends who agree with me, they feel ashamed of what their people are doing to themselves.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

I even specifically stated this isn't about narcissism but specifically about feeling entitled. Entitlement that seems to come from those who have been handed everything.
No. I mentioned that people love to point at black people and poor people, claim and insist (even get foamy at the mouth at times) that we are "entitled" because we feel we deserve a chance at things like education, that we shouldn't have to suffer through medical ailments that are treatable, and that we shouldn't starve and should have more options than cheap and highly processed junk food to feed ourselves ("food deserts" seems to be the term), but that makes us these god awful "entitled" people, but when science gets involved, those who really seemed entitled are those who already have it all. That is what this discussion is about. It isn't hatred of the wealthy (I know people who are probably more wealthy than anyone on this forum, and their charity has helped my family, on a number of occasions, to have anything to unwrap on Christmas), but that no one seems to even notice that those who have a lot tend to also expect a lot. To me, this was very noticeable in school, where the rich kids expected
things to be given to them, while those of us who didn't have a lot realized you have to work for things. But when you ask for food, for medical care, or education, we are suddenly the ones who are "entitled."

Erm...couple of points.

1) You might have stated this wasnt about narcisism, but the studies were heavily focused on it. I don't see that as negative, merely explaining why my post took the angle it did.

2) I'm unsure how I get to be a THEY in all this. I certainly haven't targetted black people or the poor in any of my posts near as I am aware, nor would I.

3) When accusing others of getting foamy mouthed, you have to be careful not to be...well...foamy mouthed.

Sorry. I read your OP and found it interesting, and also invested time in reading the studies. If I'm reacting to something not aimed at me, I humbly apologize. As stated in my first post I think promotion of social mobility is incredibly important, and incredibly underemphasised.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

Dude, until fairly recently, the Aboriginal of Australia were legally defined as fauna. That's right. Human beings legally defined as being on par with the dingo, koala, and kangaroo. Their ancestral grounds were taken to make golf courses, and certain rights of passages and other culturally important events they have not been able to carry out for decades.

Yep. It was a national disgrace. If you want to see something uniquely disgusting, look at how we gave them the right to vote and then retracted it again. Classy.

 

[Jumi]

Some feel they are more equal than others.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

That was over two hundred years ago, and their still carrying on about it, the thing is they get more than the average white poor person, there is everything given to them so they can help themselves, but most don't, they just drink and keep telling us all that it was our fault, that to me is insulting, no white person had anything to do with what happened, a colour should not be made to feel guilty. I know what I am talking about, I have many Aboriginal friends who agree with me, they feel ashamed of what their people are doing to themselves.

200 years ago? Try just a short enough time ago that many are still alive, about only four decades ago, is when the Australian government decided they are people, not fauna.

 

[Revoltingest]

To feel "entitled" is about the individual.
We can't speak so generally that all in this or that group are "entitled" or not.
Does an individual expect to be given unearned that which belongs to someone else?
That's "entitlement".