Who has the burden of proof?

[RitalinOhD]

Ah, the old atheist trickery of repetition. Throw enough crap and some will eventually stick. Unfortunately, for you, I am aware of the standard response to the technique. Repetition. I have already told you, clearly and concisely, that I have had no remonstrations with the use of information taken from reputable web sites. I had never given any disapproval of links or copying of articles. I disapprove of iniquitous and dishonest plagiarism, regardless of content. The using of other people's words, as their own. It gives the poster an unfair edge to the debate. I dislike even more when fellow atheists gather as a pack of wolves, having no moral accountability to anyone, or anything, whose only reason for being here is to cause offense and derision amongst poster and who openly supports behavior that is unethical and illegal. It is a direct reason why our society is in a moral decline.

I hope your victim card is lamenated, cause you use the hell out of that thing.

 

[Parsimony]

Now, I am going to try and be polite and considerate with you. I am going to ask you if you would like to go through your post and make any amendments that you want to. Just make sure that this is what you want me to respond to. I will be fair and tell you that I can demolish, with credible evidence, almost every point you have made in it. The data is fine it is the application of the data that is flawed. I really do not want to do that but I will have no other alternative should you wish to proceed.

Be my guest.

As for this remark, "I have given sources for my claims. Now let's see yours" It is not always a good thing to be cocky about what you have posted. It only makes being wrong more of a bitter pill to swallow.

It's not being cocky. It's a statement of truth. I want to see your sources.

That is why I did not say that 11 metres per second squared would crush us but I said "what if it were 11, what if it were 8" because my reasoning tell me that by increasing or decreasing the gravitational acceleration would eventually have an adverse effect on us, so, how miraculous is it that we have the optimum gravitational acceleration to sustain life.

Yes you did. Here is your original quote:

Gravitation exerts a force on us of approximately 9.81 metres per second squared. It's effect is to keep us on solid ground. What if it were 11, what would be the effect? We would all be crushed under the force. What if it were 8, well then we would all explode. Isn't it miraculous that it stays at what it is causing a equilibrium with our bodies under the ideal force. Do you think that is miraculous, I do.

I see that you then took your original quote and inserted some question marks into it, modifying it to become:

Gravitation exerts a force on us of approximately 9.81 metres per second squared. It's effect is to keep us on solid ground. What if it were 11, what would be the effect? We would all be crushed under the force? What if it were 8, well then we would all explode? Isn't it miraculous that it stays at what it is causing a equilibrium with our bodies under the ideal force. Do you think that is miraculous, I do.

In your original quote, those question marks weren't there. You were making declarations, not asking questions.

 

[Skwim]

Ah, the old atheist trickery of repetition. Throw enough crap and some will eventually stick.

Ah, the pot calling the kettle black. You do understand, do you not, that were it not for your use of the internet to support your claims that I would have no reason to remind you of the bullet with which you shot yourself in the foot? *

Unfortunately, for you, I am aware of the standard response to the technique. Repetition.

"Unfortunate"? Sorry, but I am honestly not feeling any repercussions whatsoever. In fact, I'm rather enjoying our little give-and-take here. You make odd/unreasonable remarks and I ("we" a lot of times) take you to task for them.

I have already told you, clearly and concisely, that I have had no remonstrations with the use of information taken from reputable web sites.
I had never given any disapproval of links or copying of articles. I disapprove of iniquitous and dishonest plagiarism, regardless of content. If give the poster an unfair edge to the debate. I dislike even more when fellow atheists gather as a pack of wolves, having no moral accountability to anyone, or anything, whose only reason for being here is to cause offense and derision amongst poster and who openly support behavior that is unethical and illegal. It is a direct reason why our society is in a moral decline.

There are a lot of words in what you say, none of which strike at the core of your hypocrisy,

6/19/2014
"Do you really believe that if someone posts it on the internet then it must be true."
​

VS.

8/11/2014
"Everything I wrote comes from reputable sites on the Internet."
​

so please forgive me for ignoring their message and stick to the immediate issue at question.



* But please rest easy, I understand your dilemma and won't bring it up again. Just realize that I and everyone else who reads our exchange recognize your posting tactics here for what they are, and will take them into account when reading your future posts.


Have a good day and stay dry.

 

[Serenity7855]

Actually, in this case, everything is brandy-new and original.

You will excuse me for my apprehension, your track record, so far, a great deal of distrustfulness in your words and claims.

I am a scientist, I've been there and done that,

You tell us that you are a scientist. I have my doubts, as every scientist I know does not need to Google the answers to scientific questions. They write the answers. Plus, your grammar and spelling is worse then mine, and I am not a scientist.

Where have you been and what have you done. Take the car to the car was and washed it?

I am only questioning your reading comprehension,

Why, if I am as incompetent as you claim, why the venomous and vitriolic posts to a poster who is clearly below your intellectual superiority. Or is it because I exposed an aggressive atheist in unethical dishonesty and it has irritated you into a vendetta.

it's an old saw:

Huh

"two weeks ago I could not even spell engineer, now I are one."

Again, Huh.

You have no trust in my words because they destroy, at the core, what you are trying to advance.

No, I have no Trust in your word because I caught you plagiarising.

I am putting forward that miracles still happen. How has anything you have said destroyed that belief. Indeed, nothing, absolutely nothing you say could convince me otherwise, as I have actually witnessed a miracle performed right in front of my eyes, and to the astonishment of the doctors involved. :yes:

You have raised no evidence as to the correctness of what I have said, only to how you see cut and paste ... everything I posted, regardless of source, is correct and accurate, unlike anything that you have posted.

The correctness of your point is irrelevant as our discussion are still tainted by your dishonesty. I will not spend my time and energy on someone who I have to be apprehensive as to whether you are cutting and pasting without linking to the source. Or indeed acting in a unfair and duplicitous manner. The accuracy and correctness does not excuse the deception. I already have a repertoire of underhanded acts performed by dishonest aggressive atheist trolls whose only objective is to agitate and offend Christians. I need no more. I am all to familiar with the capabilities of troll atheists.

 

[Parsimony]

Serenity, I think that I may have misunderstood one of your arguments. I thought you were arguing that gravity itself is the force that holds us together. I now see that you are saying that it is a balance of pressures which does this, with gravity being involved indirectly as it affects those pressures. Is that correct? Many years ago, I came upon a person who did believe that gravity was directly responsible for holding us together. I thought you might've been in the same boat as him. Now I see that's not the case.

 

[Serenity7855]

Ah, the pot calling the kettle black. You do understand, do you not, that were it not for your use of the internet to support your claims that I would have no reason to remind you of the bullet with which you shot yourself in the foot? *

I stand by my post. Some thing on the internet are lies some things are not. I use the Internet but scrutinise the source. I am not condemning anyone from using the Internet for info to back their claims. You the bullet must have missed my foot because I stand unscathed. You, on the other hand, have to justify your words here on public record as to why you defended plagiarism.

"Unfortunate"? Sorry, but I am honestly not feeling any repercussions whatsoever. In fact, I'm rather enjoying our little give-and-take here. You make odd/unreasonable remarks and I ("we" a lot of times) take you to task for them.

Hey, let me explain that for you. You will kick yourself. You are an atheist, you have no moral accountability for your actions. Did you kick yourself

There are a lot of words in what you say, none of which strike at the core of your hypocrisy,

6/19/2014​

Hypocracy, that's a new one.

"Do you really believe that if someone posts it on the internet then it must be true."

Quite so

​

VS.

8/11/2014
"Everything I wrote comes from reputable sites on the Internet." ​

Quite so. Where is the issue

​

so please forgive me for ignoring their message and stick to the immediate issue at question.

Oh, it is my job to forgive all men for their trespasses.

* But please rest easy, I understand your dilemma and won't bring it up again. Just realize that I and everyone else who reads our exchange recognize your posting tactics here for what they are, and will take them into account when reading your future posts.

Yeah, right.

Post tactics, another new one. What post tactics are those, only, I just write, I plan nothing. No tactics, I am. afraid. But you are right, people will indeed see your defence of plagiarism. Oh, I seem to be impressing some of the posters judging by my PMs.

 

[Sapiens]

You will excuse me for my apprehension, your track record, so far, a great deal of distrustfulness in your words and claims.

I have no track record of inaccuracy here (well, except for my mistaking Sir Arthur Clarke as the author of "To Serve Mankind), and if that puts you off your feed ... so be it.

You tell us that you are a scientist. I have my doubts, as every scientist I know does not need to Google the answers to scientific questions. They write the answers. Plus, your grammar and spelling is worse then mine, and I am not a scientist.

I have a laptop with keys that stick, sometimes that makes for problems.

Where have you been and what have you done. Take the car to the car was and washed it?

"... the car was and washed ..." see what I mean?

Why, if I am as incompetent as you claim, why the venomous and vitriolic posts to a poster who is clearly below your intellectual superiority. Or is it because I exposed an aggressive atheist in unethical dishonesty and it has irritated you into a vendetta.

Naw, I was on your case long before your accusations.

Huh


Again, Huh.

Don't get it? Not surprising.

No, I have no Trust in your word because I caught you plagiarising.

No, it was not plagiarism, my use was covered by fair use doctrine. But in any case, that is no defense of the incorrectness of the horse pucky you spread about.

I am putting forward that miracles still happen. How has anything you have said destroyed that belief. Indeed, nothing, absolutely nothing you say could convince me otherwise, as I have actually witnessed a miracle performed right in front of my eyes, and to the astonishment of the doctors involved. :yes:

When your prayers regrow an amputated limb give me a call. You witnessed a statistically unlikely event, that is all that medical miracles come down to.

The correctness of your point is irrelevant as our discussion are still tainted by your dishonesty. I will not spend my time and energy on someone who I have to be apprehensive as to whether you are cutting and pasting without linking to the source. Or indeed acting in a unfair and duplicitous manner. The accuracy and correctness does not excuse the deception. I already have a repertoire of underhanded acts performed by dishonest aggressive atheist trolls whose only objective is to agitate and offend Christians. I need no more. I am a, to familiar with the capabilities of troll atheists.

You need not be concerned. I understand your misinterpretation of copyright when it comes to facts and I will take great care to stay on the side you prefer of even the bizarre line you want to see drawn.

 

[Serenity7855]

Serenity, I think that I may have misunderstood one of your arguments. I thought you were arguing that gravity itself is the force that holds us together. I now see that you are saying that it is a balance of pressures which does this, with gravity being involved indirectly as it affects those pressures. Is that correct? Many years ago, I came upon a person who did believe that gravity was directly responsible for holding us together. I thought you might've been in the same boat as him. Now I see that's not the case.

Thank you so much, what a smashing post. How very honourable of you. You are not an atheist are you? Atheists are not so genuine and, quite frankly, honest. How very refreshing. Oh yes, you are correct. I did not mean the gravitational acceleration on its own. I am going to call it a day on that good note, it is nearly 11pm in the UK and my bed awaits me,. Thank you. .

 

[Parsimony]

Thank you so much, what a smashing post. How very honourable of you. You are not an atheist are you? Atheists are not so genuine and, quite frankly, honest. How very refreshing. Oh yes, you are correct. I did not mean the gravitational acceleration on its own. I am going to call it a day on that good note, it is nearly 11pm in the UK and my bed awaits me,. Thank you. .

I don't consider myself to be an atheist, no, even though at this point I'm not really sure whether I believe in God anymore or not. I still don't think it's a good idea to call atheists dishonest as a group.

 

[Serenity7855]

SAPEIN

Naw, I was on your case long before your accusations.

just this post, all on its own, sums up everything we Christians need to know about your motives and agenda. Bring it on my friend but be aware that I am enlisted in the army of God. Very telling remark that stands out because of its connotations.

Ephesians 6:10-18

Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord, and in the power of his might. Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil. For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. ...

 

[Serenity7855]

I don't consider myself to be an atheist, no, even though at this point I'm not really sure whether I believe in God anymore or not. I still don't think it's a good idea to call atheists dishonest as a group.

No, as a group they are not. It is the sub-group of atheist trolls.

I hope you return to the flock of the Lamb to find that straight an narrow path that leads to life eternal. I wish I could send you something that would connect you into the network of the Holy Ghost, who would testify to you of the authenticity of our God and his son, Jesus Christ. If I could offer you one piece of advice that would draw you close to deity, it would be to steer clear of all denominations that preach the interpretations of Man, that is all of them. Read your scriptures in a mindset of wanting to know the truth of every single word you read. I read the KJV of the bible. Council yourself by listening for that still small voice that whispers to your mind and soul. Pray in private, and if you can, vocally. When you become strong, knowing that you have the Holy Ghost as a constant companion, then, if you want, attend a church of like minded people who will lift you up, not bring you down. I have a testimony of my father in heaven. I really do. I would lay my life down in his name. I have come so close to having a perfect knowledge without the sight of divinity. My soul is full of the wonders of our wonderful and miraculous world and universe. Everything I look at testifies of Him, the eternal father. My prayers are with you, my friend. Be safe.

 

[outhouse]

it would be to steer clear of all denominations that preach the interpretations of Man

A more ignorant statement could not be made.

All religions are factully interpretations of man

atheist trolls.

Sorry, your the one in a boat running around with a pole, with no line and bait expecting to catch a fish with ignorance as your only lure.

Do be upset with us because youy have no fish, it is your own fault.

 

[Thief]

A more ignorant statement could not be made.

All religions are factully interpretations of man




Sorry, your the one in a boat running around with a pole, with no line and bait expecting to catch a fish with ignorance as your only lure.

Do be upset with us because youy have no fish, it is your own fault.

Who is ...'we'.....
Hearing voices are you?

 

[Skwim]

I stand by my post. Some thing on the internet are lies some things are not. I use the Internet but scrutinise the source. I am not condemning anyone from using the Internet for info to back their claims. You the bullet must have missed my foot because I stand unscathed. You, on the other hand, have to justify your words here on public record as to why you defended plagiarism.

Interesting. Care to point out exactly where I defended plagiarism? The pertinent quote, and a link or an identifying location is expected.

Hey, let me explain that for you. You will kick yourself. You are an atheist, you have no moral accountability for your actions. Did you kick yourself

Take a look at my avatar (look under "Religion")? It hasn't changed since I came on board.

Quite so. Where is the issue

While your ignorance here is not surprising, I am amused that you choose to exhibit it in public. But what the heck, it all goes to making RF an interesting place to drop in at.

 

[Parsimony]

I hope you return to the flock of the Lamb to find that straight an narrow path that leads to life eternal. I wish I could send you something that would connect you into the network of the Holy Ghost, who would testify to you of the authenticity of our God and his son, Jesus Christ.

I have felt the Holy Ghost in my heart. Many, many times. I used those experiences to justify my faith for many years. I don't deny that those experiences happened, it's the interpretation of those experiences that I now question. The reason is because I have since learned that the people of other religions say that they can also feel the presence of their respective gods and communicate with them as well. Not to mention that religious experiences can be created artificially, both from electromagnetic brain stimulation and suggestion. I now consider feelings to be one of the weakest forms of evidence for the divine.

If I could offer you one piece of advice that would draw you close to deity, it would be to steer clear of all denominations that preach the interpretations of Man, that is all of them.

I attend church twice every Sunday. I currently am a part of a Pentecostal Holiness Church which has extremely fundamentalist views. I have found myself in disagreement with many things that have been preached there, but the people have always been very nice to me and I hold no ill-will towards them. I greatly admire my pastor. I would much rather not rock the boat by trying debate with them.

Read your scriptures in a mindset of wanting to know the truth of every single word you read. I read the KJV of the bible.

I read that version too, although that doesn't keep me from researching deeper meanings by looking into what the original Hebrew version said.

Council yourself by listening for that still small voice that whispers to your mind and soul. Pray in private, and if you can, vocally. When you become strong, knowing that you have the Holy Ghost as a constant companion, then, if you want, attend a church of like minded people who will lift you up, not bring you down. I have a testimony of my father in heaven. I really do. I would lay my life down in his name. I have come so close to having a perfect knowledge without the sight of divinity. My soul is full of the wonders of our wonderful and miraculous world and universe. Everything I look at testifies of Him, the eternal father. My prayers are with you, my friend. Be safe.

I would appreciate some prayers, thanks. If there is a God, perhaps He will hear your prayers if He won't hear mine. I don't think I'd be asking Him for too much. I don't even ask for absolute proof. I just want Him to show me that it is more likely for Him to be real than not.

 

[Serenity7855]

Who is ...'we'.....
Hearing voices are you?

He says it a lot. It makes him feel like a part of a group and secure. It is also a coercion technique to give an impression that you are in the minority. Its clever stuff, but very sleazy and unethical. .

 

[outhouse]

He says it a lot. It makes him feel like a part of a group and secure. It is also a coercion technique to give an impression that you are in the minority. Its clever stuff, but very sleazy and unethical. .

You overthink everything. Of course due to your ignorance you have to.


We see you coming and going.

We direct this conversation, and you run into the walls trying to find your way in the dark.



You are the minority when dealing with people educated in biblical studies, as well as historical studies, as well as scientific studies.


Education rules the world, and without it due to your own bias, you remain blind to much of the world around you.

 

[Thief]

He says it a lot. It makes him feel like a part of a group and secure. It is also a coercion technique to give an impression that you are in the minority. Its clever stuff, but very sleazy and unethical. .

Yep....that's his technique alright.
But it's not clever.
Rather shallow really.

And this far into it.....I must reiterate the obvious.
There will never be a photo, a fingerprint, an equation or repeatable experiment.

No proof.
Science versus religion?...I think not.
I believe in God.
Science helps me do that.

 

[Serenity7855]

Hi Kryptid,

I apologise for making you wait for a reply, however, I have given it much thought and prayer. I am aware that what I tell you now is sacred and, therefore, open to ridicule by the trolls. I have only responded to one paragraph as it has rendered me exhausted. I will respond to the rest later as I still have a very important point to make that if not adhered to will almost certainly thwart and attempts that you make in communicating with the Holy Ghost. You probably know as much as I do about it, it relates to personal worthiness. Anyway, be assured that the road you are on is well trodden. I was on it myself for far to long.

I hope you return to the flock of the Lamb to find that straight an narrow path that leads to life eternal. I wish I could send you something that would connect you into the network of the Holy Ghost, who would testify to you of the authenticity of our God and his son, Jesus Christ.

I have felt the Holy Ghost in my heart. Many, many times. I used those experiences to justify my faith for many years. I don't deny that those experiences happened, it's the interpretation of those experiences that I now question. The reason is because I have since learned that the people of other religions say that they can also feel the presence of their respective gods and communicate with them as well. Not to mention that religious experiences can be created artificially, both from electromagnetic brain stimulation and suggestion. I now consider feelings to be one of the weakest forms of evidence for the divine.

Your word are very interesting and have struck on a familiar cord. I know where the problem lies, however, I am not so sure that I can be sufficiently articulate to convey it in words to you, but I do not mind trying, if you do not mind reading it.

I to was once in a very similar predicament to you. The year was 1981, winter, with thick snow on the ground, when we received a phone call to say that my father-in-law had a massive heart attack and as a result had passed away. It was the first death, in any of our families, of someone very close to us. When we viewed his body it was the first time we had seen someone who was dead. We were shocked at what we saw. An empty carcass having no evidence of the person that once occupied it. Where had he gone, was the first thing that came to our minds. Neither of us was particularly religious so heaven was not readily on our minds, nevertheless, we tried to find out from local clergy where they thought he had gone. None were able to answer our inquiry. Then, out of the blue came a knock on the door. When we opened it there were two Mormon missionaries stood there. They had a answer. Despite hours of trying to find holes in there answers they were able to give logical and understandable answers to all our questions. Within two weeks we found ourselves in the baptismal font being baptised into the Mormon religion. You may think that we were gullible, you would be right, however, I will come to that later. For 25 years I was a devout Mormon. I fulfilled every calling that could be filled in our local ward. I did an intense study on both the bible and the Book of Mormon and took a masters class on the New Testament. I also casually read the Bible and Book of Mormon several times. I could quote you chapter and verse of the most popular scriptures, although I lost that with age. I was, by all accounts, a "Peter Priesthood".

Now here is were we strike a similar cord. I never felt the Holy Ghost in all those years. In reality I did, however, I never recognised it because I was looking for something completely different. I had been duped by the missionaries and the church.

Please do not misunderstand me, Mormonism is essentially a very good social club to belong to, however, like Satan, they will tell you 99 truth to ensnare you with one lie, and I fell foul of that lie. What was the lie, the same lie that most Christian faith will tell you.

You see Mormons have some of the most sophisticated movie production facilities that you can find anywhere. BYU conduct courses on film production for up and coming movie producers. They are experts in what they do, however, what they do is not particularly ethical. They have approximately 50,000 missionaries in the field who are train to seduce you into joining the church. They carry with them Oscar winning church movies to show to perspective converts. Each film follows a similar format. A wholesome family story with a sad ending or a sad story with a happy ending. We have all watched these kind of movies. They cause us two swell up in the chest and feel tingly all over with emotion. Many will cry from the artificially induced emotion of Lassie dying or Grandma recovering from cancer because she had a blessing. The one I was shown was of the reaction of children who tragically lost their mother to some kind of illness and she promised she would look down on them from above. They could tell when she was looking as there would be a rainbow in the sky. Yes, I was sucked in by it and it took me twenty five years to realise what they did. The point I am making is that these missionaries told me that these emotions that I was feeling was in fact the Holy Ghost. They lied to me and caused me to live for 25 years without his companionship. It was just normal and natural emotion born out of happiness or sadness

What did they do? They gave me a false depiction of the Holy Ghost. I was looking for that warm feeling in my heart and a rush of emotion to my brain. I never received it, ever. I very often became emotional at the birth of a child, or something similar, but that was normal human emotion. It was not until I left the church and sought the council of the Holy Ghost, whilst reading scripture, did I realise that the influence of the Holy Ghost cannot be mistaken with your own emotions. They are separate and distinctive. God would have to be cruel, or a joke, to make them so similar that you could not tell one from the other. Reading your description was like reading my own experience. What you think is the Holy Ghost is actually your own emotions. You are right, feeling are the worst kind of evidence for deity because they can easily be mistaken.

The Holy Ghost is the third member of the Godhead. He is a personage of spirit, without a body of flesh and bones. He is often referred to as the Spirit, the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of God, or the Comforter. The Holy Ghost is a sanctifier. Because no unclean thing can dwell in a divine presence, the whole system of salvation centers on the process of sanctification; people are saved to the extent that they are sanctified. Sanctification and holiness are inseparable. "To be sanctified is to become clean, pure, and spotless; to be free from the blood and sins of the world; to become a new creature of the Holy Ghost, one whose body has been renewed by the rebirth of the Spirit. Sanctification is a state of saintliness, a state attained only by conformity to the laws and ordinances of the gospel"

I see the Holy Ghost in all space, filled with a subtle, though material substance of wonderful properties, by which all natural phenomena are controlled. This substance is known as the Holy Spirit, or Dark Matter. Its most important characteristic is intelligence. ''Its inherent properties embrace all the attributes of intelligence. Knowledge is a function of intelligence, that means the immensity of space is filled with knowledge. Anything and everything that we can ever know is right in front of our eyes in a universal data base. All you need to be able to do is tap into it. To draw upon the powers of heaven and be sanctified by the Spirit of a living God. You are already naturally filled with it. It flows through your body like quantum physics tells us. It is not a swelling of the bossom or the point just before tears flow. You need a cool calm head to feel that external knowledge flow into your soul, testifying to you, your spirit, of that which is true. Communication of spirit with spirit in conceptual form. Feelings and conceptualisations that are not yours and are delivered in a micro second. Words seem archaic as everything is presented to your mind in an instant within your minds eye. The experience will engulf your entire being, both body and spirit, and you will know, without a doubt, that you are in communication with an external entity that is conversing with your spirit. .

Now, please do not expect that kind of experience everytime you communicate with the Holy Ghost. I have only witnessed it three times. Three times when my life was in tune with the teachings of the Gospel.Today, it is back to standard communications. I can actually feel him right now, as I write, guiding my hand. He is right there, within me and next to me. Telling me what to say, and very often, what not to say, I do not always listen, but he always forgives me. No swelling bossom, no teary eyes or lumps in the throat, just a constant presence guiding and directing me through this mortal probation, but as real as anything else in my life. I wish I could give you a prescription that would instantly give you this wonderful gift, so the eyes of your understanding maybe opened to the wonders of the universe. A understanding that supercedes the perceived knowledge that self proclaimed scientists think they have. A understanding that makes you realise that this forum must never be taken seriously, because those who frequent it, the atheists trolls, think that there belief system is the correct one to have and all others are fallacious fantasy. It is not. It is archaic. It relys on laborious calculations and unnecessary complexities. Through the Holy Ghost all of science is known without any words. You will be able to indulge in a little carnal smugness in the knowledge that you have a source of knowledge that makes them look like Kindergarten children.

 

[Serenity7855]

Yep....that's his technique alright.
But it's not clever.
Rather shallow really.

And this far into it.....I must reiterate the obvious.
There will never be a photo, a fingerprint, an equation or repeatable experiment.

No proof.
Science versus religion?...I think not.
I believe in God.
Science helps me do that.

Would you mind if I stole the last to lines of your post? Very profound. I like it and subscribe to it.